Both parents commute - childcare for before and after school?

[testbunny]

Hi there

We are considering a move from London to Surrey. Both of us will commute into London (me 4 days a week). We would have to leave quite early in the morning, so what do other commuters to in terms of childcare? Is it possible to find a nanny, or will we have to find two seperate nannies? Or is a childminder, where we have to do drop-off and pick-up, the only option?

Thanks very much!

Woking is hideous - not sure the secondaries are worth moving for either tbh. A couple of v good secondaries in Guildford, but you'll pay a premium for living close enough to be in 'catchment'.

Thinking about this... you may be able to get a nanny for £8 gross an hour, maybe less, who is new to nannying and looking for a full-time job. 12 hours a day, 4 days per week = 48 hours per week x £8 per hour would be £20,023 gross per year. Cost to employer of a bit under £22k. If you could find a nanny who take that sort of salary and be happy that they would do housework duties whilst children at school, that may work out better than before/after school nanny - as the nanny is always around to care for sick children, inset days, go on school trips, bake cakes for the school cake sale, take parcels to the postoffice, do last minute shopping, be in for the shopping delivery, do all the laundry.

Some of the villages are nice. I've never lived in Woking itself. Costly though - my studio flat (think small box) is £120k, a small (2 bed) house I'd be lucky to find for under 220k... nice ones will be in region of 250k.

I live close to Woking and used to live in Woking itself. I also have commuted to London over the years for various amounts of days and hours and have been through various combinations of childcare.

If you have a choice between Woking and Guildford, I would choose Woking purely for ease of commute. I also think, whatever your budget is, you will get a bit more for your money within walking distance of Woking station rather than Guildford station. If you have to add on a car trip to the station, this will make your day even longer and car parking prices are ridiculous. Having said that, if you use a childminder you will probably end up having to drive somewhere anyway to drop them off.

Primary schools in Woking are generally good but secondary provision is not very good unless you are Catholic and can get into St John the Baptist. However, secondary is years off for you and things can change.

From every other point of view, Guildford is a better option - shopping, leisure activities, High St etc - but being realistic, work, home and school are your priorities right now and the amount of time you will have to waft around the cobble stones of Guildford from Jo Malone to Jigsaw is likely to be fairly limited!

I now work part-time and have an after-school nanny but start work late enough to be able to drop my ds2 at school beforehand. DS1 is now at secondary and so my childcare arrangements are much easier than when they were little. I use students for holiday care and have never had difficulty in recruiting one. I take most half-terms off and use grandparents for occasional inset days etc. DS1 is old enough to be home alone if necessary. If you have space, I think an aupair would be your best option. For you, a nanny will be very expensive childcare. Obviously, you can ask a good nanny to do laundry during the day, cook for children etc but seriously no nanny can be kept occupied for 6 hours a day on general household tasks and children-related activities from say, 16 April when schools went back this term to 1 June when half-term starts. Most schools will have one inset day in that period and even allowing for nanny attending say, sports day and perhaps one other school activity, and one/both children having a few days off ill that's still a lot of hours to fill for which you are paying a lot of money.

If you use an aupair and cover holidays with a combination of holiday clubs, your own holidays and possibly recruiting a student (or TA or teacher, I get applications from them) in conjunction with the aupair you still ensure a good level of care.

Thanks ladies for your help!

Thanks NannyNick

AngelNanny, if you do wrap around care what hours would you be prepared to do, and do you charge just for the hours worked or the whole day? would give me some sort of idea of how feasible a move with a longer working day will be financially (if we stayed in London, when dc2 starts school I would be able to drop off and still get in on time to work, and would only need after school care)

HandbagAddiction, this is useful thanks. what hours does your nanny work, and do you pay just for the before and after school care on those two days?

LesbianMummy1. That's a good idea. I will have a look in woking (as that is our prefered option), maybe talk to some agencies. It sounds like there are a lot of childcare options in the area which is good

I guess there are also breakfast clubs? Although, they probably dont start until 8am, and I think that would be too long a day, especially for my youngest to be in a school enviroment...

What you need is a wife!

Hi annh.

Thanks for your post - really helpful! Re: guildford and woking - I know both areas a bit, so agree guildford town centre is probably nicer, but woking more convenient. You sound like you have a good system. I'm wondering, because you are able to do the school drop off, do you now work locally or still commute to London?

Yes, I guess it will get easier as the DCs get older. Financilly, a nanny doesnt sound feasible, unless I can find one who will do wrap around care. i can take extra weeks unpaid holiday (not sure how many). That's a great idea about teaching assistants in the holidays, although I expect a lot will have children of their own. Yes, Au pair sounds like the mot financially sound option - just need to find a house large enough which doesn't cost a fortune!

Hi Testbunny,
My last position was for school aged children and I use to work the whole day and did a bit of housekeeping/nursery duties during the school hours.

However now I have a baby of my own I would just do the wrap around care. So working and charging for say 7am- 9am and 3pm-7pm, so just those 6 hours per day and could be flexible for ad hoc care if needed say for sickness or inset days.

I pick one little boy up from school one day a week (iv been with him for just over 3.5yrs) and I take my baby with me. We go to the little boys home and do his homework, play, cook tea, bath and it works really well. As mummy and daddy then come home and the little boy is all ready for bed and they don't have to worry about doing homework or bath when it's getting late.

angelnanny that's good to know and it that sounds like it works very well for everyone. I guess it wouldnt be as easy looking after 2 children, not just 1, with homework etc, as well as your baby? Although I could be wrong!

I'd stay put - a double commute is a huge strain on all members of the family and incurs a lot of costs.

If you're paying £20k child care and an extra £5k on rail fares stay put and go private! Very few state schools worth £25k a year....

Hi again,

So term time, nanny works as follows:-

Mon 07:45 to 6:15
Tue 07:45 to 09:30 / 2:30 to 6:00
Wed 07:45 to 6:15
Thur 07:45 to 09:30 / 2:30 to 6:15
Fri 07:45 to 6:15

During holidays, nanny works as follows:-

Mon 07:45 to 6:15
Tue 07:45 to 6:00
Wed 07:45 to 6:15
Thur 07:45 to 6:15
Fri 07:45 to 6:15

In terms of salary, I've annualised her salary and have agreed a final gross rate for contract purposes. I did this based on a calculation similar to what Nannynick has suggested, so work out 13 weeks of reduced hours, 29 weeks of full hours - add them up together, multiply by hourly rate and then divide by 12 approx. for the annualised. Worked out gross rate from that using Nanny tax help and this is the figure that's in her contract. Suits her as she gets a regular amount per month but also suits me as I am effectively only paying her for the hours she works.

Happy to answer any more questions if needed or recommend local agencies. As I said, I am further down the train line to you but some of the agencies I have used previously also cover Woking.

I think you should be able to find a nanny to do this. When I employed a nanny (10 years' ago now) I was working shifts, and needed a great deal of flexibility. Some weeks I needed the nanny to arrive at 6.30 am, others not until 10, but stay until 7.30 pm. I was lucky enough to find someone fabulous who was prepared to do this.

You just need to find that person who is right for you.

Thankyou everyone so so much. this is the best info i could have had!

We have a lot to think about. i was hoping to be able to save money on childcare when dc's were at school. very interesting about working out a nanny salary over 12 month. Thankyou nannynick and handbag! Something to consider.

seems we seriously need to consider staying put and hope the schools improve, or save for private. But i am also going to have a look at potential employment prospects in working and guildford, as that would help. Will keep you posted!

Thanks again!
TB xxx

Coming back late to say that I do now work in London but only 2 days a week, although have done four days up to fairly recently. However, I work in a sector (don't really want to say which!) where a later start than normal is acceptable. I also only work until 5.30. I have arrived at this situation probably only by having worked for the company for a long time, working very hard when I am there and being flexible about the occasional extra day/meeting whenever I can.

Thanks annh. You are in a lucky position. i wish my company were that flexible. TB x

I have a longer commute. 3.5 hours round trip to London. DH works in the City doing very long hours so can't help with childcare. We have a nanny for before and after school care. But I also have flexi time and can work at home 1 day which is very helpful. I've also used childminders but it is a really long day 11-12 hours and for young children it is a struggle.

You could also split the childcare with a person for the morning and another for the afternoon. I've done that too which was fine but the morning carer was a childminder so there you lose about 15-30 mins getting ready. I prefer it that way rather than picking up from a childminders as invariably there is the odd train delay.

thanks littlesue. crikey, 3.5 hours round trip!

Hi TB
I've been thinking about this some more over the last few days and thought that I'd come back to say explicitly what has been mentioned in passing in a few comments.

For me the thing that makes my commute/job possible is that I'm not reposible for all the drop offs and pick ups. I work a 4 day week (spread over 5 days with some home working) and DH works a 5 day week. On an 'average week' I do 5 drop offs and 2 pick ups, and DH does 3 pick ups, but we do change things about if necessary. This means that we both have enough flexibility that if we need to make up extra hours or fit in a late/early meeting then we can BOTH do this. I think if you trying to do a long commute, while being responsible for all drop offs and pick ups then either you need incredibly flexible childcare, or a job with very very strict hours (which doesn't sound like yours).

I guess what I'm trying to say is that if I were you I would think hard about the extent to which you are likely to end up being responsible for being there for the dc at both ends of the day. I'm not sure that I could do the commute/hours that I do without DH taking on a consistent share of this.