schizophrenic nanny

[teobaldo]

I was looking for a temp nanny to look after my dd who is 1 for one day a week and for my son when he comes back from school (he is 5). I called a nanny agency to have more guarantess. They sent me two women, the one I preferred mentioned that she is on antidepressant medications, I kind of panicked but talked to the agency that assured me that she is a wonderful person, really good with the other girl she is looking after. She told me that the other family has asked to look a letter from the doctor and that perhaps I could ask her as well ( given that I felt it was rude to ask for the reasons of the medications. Anyway to cut a long story short she came to show me the letter, which said she was actually schizophrenic but stable with medications and ok to look for work ( did not mention children though) This woman is lovely, so one side of me feels I should not discriminate her the other just think after all my responsability is towards my children.... Any advise ? I am actually quite annoyed with the agency. Does anyone know if legally is it possible for a schizophrenic on medications to work with children ?

My friend is a nanny and she is diabetic and she gets asked for a fitness to work letter from her doctor, no different from the situation here.

Thats not the same as asking of it would be legally possible for someone with diabetes to work with children.

I thnk your title is offensive. A nanny who has schizophrenia would have been much better.

It is quite normal to have concerns about your child's safety but if you felt that someone who was on AD's was a concern to you why ask for a letter explaining what they were needed for?

I don't think you should employ this lady as you have already judged her and she hasn't had a fair hearing.

But English isn't the OPs first language and she may have missed the PC subtlety....

It has lots to do with her speaking English fluently HereIGo. In terms of language use there's hardly an enormous difference between 'schizophrenic nanny' and 'nanny with schizophrenia'. Big difference in terms of meaning and implication, but not in terms of language.

TBH even if she is English just because she isn't aware of the PC term or language use doesn't mean she is prejudiced/unreasonable or anything else. Explain it by all means, but don't hold a grudge against someone for a slight error in how they've phrased something. Don't try to find offence where none was meant.

Exactly Holy. The poor woman came here to ask advice about something she doesn't know much about, she didn't dismiss the nanny out of hand because she has a mental illness, she came to find out more and yet she is still getting a hard time because of it... and now because of the fact that in her second (or maybe third or seventh language) she has written it in a 'non pc' way... for the love of all things this place does my head in some days.

It is very hard to keep up with what individuals define as being pc and / or inoffensive even when one is in a position where one "should " know never mind when one has little knowledge of a condition / illness.

In my work even job titles change almost annually because previous ones have been defined as causing offense / being inaccurate / giving the wrong impression.

As does how I refer in a general way to the people I work with / support ..... no matter how I refer to them others may define / infer various things about my attitude because of a word I choose ........their deduction might be accurate but then again it might not .

Op, it's likely this lady's condition would count as a disability under the Equality Act 2010 if her condition if not medicated meets this criteria:

In the Act, a person has a disability if:
? they have a physical or mental impairment
? the impairment has a substantial and long-term adverse effect on their ability to perform normal day-to-day activities

If you were to not employ her because of this condition it would be direct discrimination and she could make a claim to an employment tribunal. This means if you do reject her you have to be very clear as to your reasons and they cannot relate to her disability. If you have already offered her the job and then withdraw the offer because of this you would be on very shaky ground. It might be better to choose an entirely different childcare option such as a childminder and cite reasons such as cost, shared care with other children giving greater socialisation rather than hire a different nanny and run the greater risk of a discrimination claim.

There are exceptions to the Act so if any of the following applies you may be able to reject a candidate without risking a tribunal claim but really, it another family is employing her none of the following are hugely likely to apply and you should get some specialist advice before proceeding whether you decide to reject her or employ her and you need to make any reasonable adjustments.

Section A 12 provides: ?Certain conditions are not to be regarded as impairments for the purposes of the Act. These are:

? addiction to, or dependency on, alcohol, nicotine, or any other substance (other than in consequence of the substance being medically prescribed);

? the condition known as seasonal allergic rhinitis (e.g. hayfever), except where it aggravates the effect of another condition;

? tendency to set fires;

? tendency to steal;

? tendency to physical or sexual abuse of other persons;

? exhibitionism;

? voyeurism.

The exclusions apply where the tendency to set fires, tendency to steal, tendency to physical or sexual abuse of other persons, exhibitionism, or voyeurism constitute an impairment in themselves. The exclusions also apply where these tendencies arise as a consequence of, or a manifestation of, an impairment that constitutes a disability for the purposes of the Act?.

OP My DH has schizophrenia and is our 4 children's main carer. People with schizophrenia are no more likely to be dangerous or risky to work with little ones than anyone else and, speaking of those I know, their knowledge of how their condition affects them and their family members (it tends to run in families), they make more of active effort to connect and manage stress to counteract their condition. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it really, but asking for a GP's letter explaining her specific case in more detail might help you feel better (though this will likely be costly for her).

Wrote a long post and lost it as I did not realize the login expires after a while. Anyway in brief this time: thanks to all for the very useful information, I did not mean to offend anyone and I should have read the message before posting it. However I feel that those that had wanted to express hanger, did not read the message carefully either. I still think I have every right to find out more about the condition before deciding to put my dd in the sole care of someone. I explained why I asked about the legal implication, but everyone seemed to ignore that. Anyone when someone asks a question, it does not take a position one way or the other !

not all of us ignored the legal implications... they're just not where you thought they were :)

Teobaldi, it's your child and you right to interview nannies and pick the one that is right for you. I am sure this girl will find another post obviously reading these posts most people would not have any concerns the thing is with this horrible illness there are different degrees of it. You don't have o give that reason for turning her down.

catsareevil: "Thats not the same as asking of it would be legally possible for someone with diabetes to work with children." Er, yes, it is, actually. A diabetic person who has mismanaged their sugar/ insulin levels is likely to go into a state of hypo, where they won't be in a position to look after themselves, let alone someone's children. This could potentially distressing and even dangerous, depending on where they were at the timem of the hypo. If someone asks about the legality of employing a person with diabetes on these grounds, it wouldn't be offensive at all. It would be perfectly reasonable.

And just as with schizophrenia, a diabetic who manages their condition responsibly would make as good a carer as a person without the condition.

I'm confused, Kate. Is that act actually suggesting that an alcoholic nanny would be as safe as a non-alcoholic nanny who has hayfever??!!

Oh, okay, I've re-read it. I think I previously read it with 'it's way past your bedtime' brain.

Sorry, but no way in the world would I employ a nanny with schizophrenia.

I wouldn't employ her either. I have worked with MH before, and yes the vast majority of schizophrenics are stable and controlled on meds, but you do not know that is the case with her, and how she would react if she were to stop taking her meds. Also if you do not know her well, it may be difficult to recognise the subtle signs that her mh may be on the decline. Similarly I wouldn't employ a nanny with a serious medical condition either, even if it was well managed. I just wouldn't be able to leave my DS if I had to worry about my nanny's health.

I know of people with schizophrenia who have been told they can not work with children.

I know quite a few people with schizophrenia many who have their own children.

I would say like with any health issue find out the facts and how it affects that individual. I would take time to talk through and anyway it would affect her work and what you would expect e.g. if changing meds when she would need to inform you.

I do not feel you can base a judgement solely on a diagnosed condition and just like a crb shows if a person has been found guilty of a crime a diagnosis shows a person has sought help.

If this person already worked for you and then was diagnosed would you sack her?

Speak to this person interview her as you would everybody else and then make your decision schizophrenia aside only you will know what is right for your family.

I understand your concern but there are childminders with quals tht are horrendous. I paid one in sw13 who told my dd (7) that poor people ate cats in some countries, she also left dd outside my front door without waiting for me and went off. After i sacked her I saw her with 3 babies in her garden, one was playing with a hanging windchime on a tree, bumped it's head with the heavy swinging and cried and she ignored it. This is a level 3- trust your judgement.

Why the hell would you ask?

Fuck being PC. No, seriously, why would you ever come on an internet forum and ASK this question??

MayaAngelCool

Sorry, I wasnt clear enough - the person that I was replying said that a nanny with diabetes was having to get a fit to work report from the GP.

What I was trying to say was that seeking a medical report for a condition is not the same as asking if it was legally prohibited.

well... it is obviously a very divisive argument. I have decided to give her the job on a temporary basis, until an extra day at nursery becomes available, because I really liked her, she has one good reference, even if not much experience (only three months) and she seemed very sweet with my daughter.

In the end I prefer to have one form of child care only and nursery makes me feel more comfortable, as my ds went there I know the place and they are great.

Thanks to all that have been helpful and to those who swears a lot - good luck with your life.

Mental illness is very misunderstood and the main thing here is that she is being honest with you.

I have a degree in psychology. I have studied schizophrenia. I would personally not employ a schizophrenic as a nanny or in any other situation where there would be lone working. The chances of having an episode may be really slim, but if there was an episode the risks would be too high. A schizophrenic episode can be extremely distressing for the person and the child may witness erratic behaviour. That's me personally. Talking about MY child. I would not mind if a schizophrenic person was employed at the nursery or school, because if anything were to happen there would be people around to help. Its the lone working part that is the risk not the working with children part. Schizophrenia can be really unpredictable, and humans are fallible, medication can be forgotten. For me, its a no.