How important are CRB's?

[NannyTreeSally]

How important are CRB's to you?

We've seen a big downturn over the last few months of parents requiring them from potential nannies. Many say "they're only valid on the day their completed, the nanny could of gone on to commit an offence" etc.

I would usually ask for one to see the reaction, but in general most are clean, and I care more about checking out references (including talking with referees). Usually any causes for concern can be identified by a thorough review of references and cv (ie checking for gaps in employment).

IMO everyone working with children needs to have one. Employees at schools and day nurseries need to have one, it's an OFSTED requirement. I agree that a thorough interview and reference check is most important, but I would be wary of leaving my child with anyone who hadn't been thoroughly checked out. Yes, the nanny could go on to commit an offence, but it's irresponsible not to check history and to be honest, I would want it to be a pre-requisite in terms of my expectations if I was paying a fortune to a nanny agency to vet potential employees for me - you should be ensuring that all employees are 'safe'.

And ... although they are not renewed regularly, Ofsted will not renew a registration for someone that they get a negative report on (ie certain criminal offences).

Even though they seem out of date, they do confirm if there have been any serious offences in the past that a parent might want to know about!

Well no, strictly they don't tell you about any serious offences in the past, only convictions (eg not investigations, dismissals etc). Which is an important, but terribly small piece of information in the overall recruitment process. The Inspection culture which leads to some people equating CRB=safe to work with children has set safe recruitment back along way. It is scary to see how few employers do a detailed check of childcare references. I have had a number of nannies over the years and only once has anyone phoned me for a reference.

Equally knowing that someone working in a childcare setting has had a CRB done shouldn't necessarily give the parents any degree of comfort whatsoever. I know of playgroup employees who have convictions for violent assault (against an adult) and theft. If you have someone from your child's nursery work in your own home (eg babysitting) make sure that you do your own checks too!

The parents you have spoken to are right - all they tell you is if someone has been convicted of something, not whether they have actually done something.

The CRB themselves say that they are only 'valid' on the day of printing. That's why they're non-transferable.

If you think about it, Vanessa George would have been CRB checked. Fat lot of good that was.

Childminders are not required to renew a CRB at any time - you get one when you register, and that's it. You don't need to renew after 3 years or whenever, and if you ask Ofsted to authorise it being done (as they are the authorising body) they won't.

I agree that references should always be checked.
ofsted told me they do not need to be renewed for childminders as they have access to detail of new convictions.

Does a parent looking at a CRB check know what things on it means? Things could be listed which would not exclude someone from working with children.

My experience has always been going via umbrella organisations who then usually point out what the items on the the CRB mean, but to be honest I think that the CRBs are fairly clear in themselves. And if someone is working in my home I would want to know about any other convictions too if I could. A drink driving conviction does not exclude someone from working with children, but I wouldn't want them working as a nanny.

A thorough reference check is absolutely vital when employing anyone to work with children and that includes teachers as well as Nannies/childminders etc. A CRB check should also be done if only to cover your own back if anything should go wrong. As Flissaps has said they only tell you if someone has been convicted of something, not whether they have actually committed a crime. I worked in a school where a teacher was interviewed, references sought and received (they were excellent) and CRB came back clean. He was aapointed to the job. That teacher was arrested shortly after he started at the school for downloading porn from the internet. He admitted it but claimed it was adult porn only. This proved to be untrue. It was porn of the vilest sort and not involving adult victims. He went to prison but not for long enough in my opinion. This conviction will now show on any future CRB check so he will not work with children in any capacity again but his earlier checks had been clean because he had not been convicted at that point. He was also not a good teacher and his former school obviously gave him a good reference to get rid of him. So what I am saying is CRB is important to check there are no convictions but do not tell you more than that. References are important and I would always want verbal as well as written references as you can sometimes pick up any doubts from a conversation more easily than from a written reference.

I strongly agree that all parents who are employing a nanny should be made aware that a clean CRB does not = safe!!! For a long time, it?s been scary how many of the parents we help believe that a CRB is a ?100% safeguard?.

Everyone who works with Children should have a CRB, if nothing else to check for previous convictions that may impact the parents decision! But, as Flisspaps rightly said ?all they tell you is if someone has been convicted of something, not whether they have actually done something? Or indeed whether they may be capable of doing something...

I also strongly agree that it is completely irresponsible to not thoroughly vet a potential nanny! From my experience of checking references, it?s important to ask the right questions to ?scratch below the surface? which sometimes does unearth some questionable answers. As Isla77 said ?References are important and I would always want verbal as well as written references as you can sometimes pick up any doubts from a conversation more easily than from a written reference.?

As my initial post said... It seems that in recent times, the parents we help no longer believe that a CRB is a 100% safeguard and I hope it carries on this way!!

What questions would you ask to 'scratch below the surface' ?

Gathering as much information as possible is not always easy. It can be hard to get the referee to open up!

As a rough guide... i never ask a ?closed? question (one that can be answered with Yes/No) and always read between the lines of their answers to establish what my next question will be.

Some generic questions that I might ask (and read between the lines of) are...

1. What would you say the nannies weaknesses are?
2. If the nanny could improve one thing what would it be?
3. What didn?t you like about the nanny?
4. Would you re-employ the nanny? (If yes, why? If no, why?)
5. How would you describe the nannies communication style?
6. How would you describe the nannies approach to childcare?
7. How would you describe the nannies approach to discipline?
8. What do your children say about the nanny?
9. What issues or concerns have you had whilst they were employed by you?
10. Etc...

I would also ask questions about their start and end date, the children?s ages, the duties, etc (you can check their answers against the nannies CV).