Trial Weekend with Au Pair - Should I cut my losses?

[metrobaby]

I've had 3 AP's - 2 terrific ones, 1 awful. My 3 dcs are all in primary school. We've just had a trial weekend with our new AP who is a 19 yo German. However a couple of things are worrying me.

On the whole, new AP seems a nice girl. However, although the AP did spend time with the dcs, she didn't really seem to engage whole heartedly with them and wasn't pro-active with them. She looked a bit bored at times, and never instigated any play activity. After a day in London, when we returnd home, she didn't help - or offer to help - in any way with the dinner or bedtime and went straight up to her room.

Today, she woke up at 9.30 - but didn't come downstairs until 11am. She was leaving to go to the aiport at 2.30. Once again it was a similar story. DH took her to the airport and she only spoke to him when spoken to. DH said it was a real effort to talk to her.

This weekend is meant to be an ice-breaker for both sides to get to know each other. I don't expect her to be working - but I do expect her enage with the dcs and generally pitch in, especially considering we had paid all her expenses to come over this weekend and because this will be her 'job' in September! Personally, with a prospective employer I would have wanted to make a good impression.

Am I expecting to much?? With my 2 wonderful au-pairs I felt comfortable with them immediately and knew they would be fine. With my previous awful AP I had reservations from the start, and despite months and months of trying - and posting here - it never really got any better. I am scared of having a repeat experience or a domestic dementor!

I'm not sure if the weekend came as a complete shock to her. Should I cut my losses and start looking again?? Or should I give her a chance when she arrives??

Stick with your gut instinct and cut your losses. She could have been a much better guest even if she wasn't working! Good luck

I can imagine this scenario happening with a lot of potential young APs who don't have a clue what they actually want to do in life and so have a 'gap year' as an AP. Along with her 'follow up' email at her feedback.

I reckon she arrived and realised...she's not so interested in (other people's) children. But as T says - is thinking? What do I do now.

She didn't exactly put on a charm offensive did she?

How do you feel at the thought of picking her up from the airport in a couple of weeks' time? If there's any sense of dread - don't contemplate that probation period!

When I had an quick initial chat with our au pair after 2 weeks of being useless, she then spent several hours on the phone with her parents. The next day we had another chat. At first I just kept getting these word perfect statements which were blatently not hers - and she occasionally mentioned 'my mother thinks... my friend thinks....'.

In the end I told her I was completely uninterested in what her mother and her friend thought as they weren't here, SHE was. I wasn't hiring THEM I was hiring HER. Questioning her further and deeper I found that her own true thoughts and abilities were nowhere near as good as she had made out - she was simply regurgitating what she had been coached to say. (Which is why she made such a good impression over email and the phone!).

I really do appreciate all supportive messages on here.

Update - have now received a message from her German agency saying that they had a long conversation with AP's Mum who said her daughter had no idea it was a trial weekend, and that it could potentially lead to me retracting the offer. Mum said her daughter is the type needs who needs time to shine and show her talents. AP is very upset and is crying. They really want me to reconsider.

DH and I feel awful.

However - harriet - I would dread picking her up from the airport in a couple of weeks time. I don't think I would trust her with my dcs, and I don't want to be picking faults or walking on eggshells. ChitChatting - I reckon I would end up having the same experience of you. It has made me think that AP has been coached by her strong mother! xmyboys - you're right - regardless she should have been a much better house guest. Alarm bells were ringing when I realised over the weekend my dc had actually done more to pitch in than she.

I'm just not convinced with this AP whether she has a geniune interest in children or has much iniative - and these are 2 qualities that can't be taught.

Do not feel awful she sounds very immature if she is crying. You will not have to see her again. Also why does her mother have to speak for her? You have done the right thing.

don't feel awful about making a decision that will be best for your family. You have already paid out for this girl to have a weekend away in London so you should ignore the tugs on your heart strings and just remember there will be plenty of other really good au pairs out there who will be far better for you and your family.. Hold firm..! I do sympathise that this must all be a bit draining for you though...!

She may not have totally realised it was a 'trial' weekend. But don't let that deter you. It's not as though you didn't try to entertain her. It is not a cop out to say that you just didn't feel that she was engaged enough with the children and that it would be one thing if she were a house guest for a short period of time (say a friend's older child) but that APs that have worked out in your exp were more interested in them generally. She wouldn't have had to be 'on duty' to recognise that the playhouse thing was dangerous - this is something anyone would have noticed and IF they have an interest in children would have said something about.

And Metro
If this is what they do after a trial weekend imagine the lobbying if you did let her stay and then had to dismiss her.

The agency is probalby getting it in the neck from the parents. In Germany, APs have to pay EUR 150 to sign up with one.

This should just confirm it even more. Not all aupairs are the same, what is not right for you might be a perfect match for someone else. Don't feel guilty at all.
How is the new search going?

I think you should go with your gut instinct - if she didn't realise it was a trial weekend/getting to know each other session, what else did she think it was? I think even if she was acting in "house guest" mode, she should have offered to help with dinner/take the kids off to play a game while you got dinner ready. Her parents sound a complete PITA - as Harriet says, imagine what sort of lobbying they would do if the trial period didn't work out.

You owe it to yourself and your DH to recruit an au pair you will find it easy to manage and live with.

You owe it to your DCs to recruit an au pair who will care for and stimulate them.

As much as you may feel sorry for this girl, she is not your responsibility. If she cannot grasp an opportunity that you give her to demonstrate her best qualities, she has missed her chance.

You don't owe her parents anything (and yes, they clearly wrote that email).

You ABSOLUTELY do not owe the agency anything - they are only thinking of their fee. If you had just test driven a car that made deadful noises and pulled to one side when braking would you listen to the salesman when he said 'all it needs is a bit of TLC?'. No, you would move on to the next garage and find one that suits you better. Now of course an au pair is a human being not a car, but I am afraid that from the agency's point of view placing au pairs is the way they make their money.

Put your family first and say sorry, but no.

Don't employ her just because you feel regret or guilt.

Much better to sort this out now than after she's been living with you for a fortnight and it's still not working.

It sounds as though, emotions aside, you have already decided she's not right.

I've told the agency that we are not giving her a second chance, and they have been very supportive and sent me a few new AP profiles. They said they were not surprised. Apparently the German agency were surprised that AP acted this way, but also surprised how quickly I have retracted the offer. I had no idea harriet German APs had to pay their own agency either - and so much too! It explains why they wanted me to reconsider.

Thanks so much everyone for supporting me throughout this. I wanted to know that I had acted fairly and reasonably. I have always dreaded getting rid of an unsuitable AP. Jean Bodel - yes much better to get rid now than later. The weekend has proved that if an AP didn't make an effort to get to know us, and show her best qualities then better to cut my losses. Mr A - you're right - I definately owe it our family and no-one else.

Just wanted to let you you all know that Agency has told be that AP has now decidehd not to become an AP, and has decided to return to studying! We both had a narrow escape, and I'm so glad we had the weekend to find out. Harriet and T - you were spot on about her probably realising she didn't like children and didn't know what to do.

I've also found another AP, who seems great and will join us in 2 weeks. Fingers crossed she will be much better.

Metro
I thought at one point (after a bad AP World exp) that the agency fee the prospective APs have to pay in Germany served to weed out the people that didn't really want to be au pairs. It seemed like there was just too low a barrier to entry to AP WOrld, which was part of the reason for the timewasters. But I guess if the parents are driving the process, paying to sign up for an agency sounds like an obvious thing to do, then the agency/the parents can drive the process for an indifferent AP. Which is what happened to you. So...it just goes to show there's no point generalising.

I think you have to be very careful with what you are expecting from an au-pair. I have noticed a tendancy in the UK to think fo them as employees and maids of all work. Au pair mean on a par i.e equal so she should be like part of the family. They should only do about thirty hours a week, mainly basic childcare, and a bit of light housework (washing up the breakfast dishes, making the children's beds). They should not be doing all the childcare, shopping, cooking, cleaning ironing etc. You should also eb helping them to improve their English, and they should help the children elarn some of their language ideally.
If you want an employee then hire a nanny/governess/housekeepr, but you will have to pay a huge amount more. There have been some cases in Europe where people have hired young women telling them they will be an aupair, and then expected them to do everything, and some of these families have had to pay backpay retrospectively for the difference in duties. An aupair is cheap simply because they are not an employee, it is not right to on the one hand say aupair means something different now, whilst at the same time expecting to pay the same amount.

"An aupair is cheap simply because they are not an employee"

Er, no.

An au pair is cheap because they live in and work relatively few hours, therefore typically usually earning below the tax threshold. Do not confuse tax and employment status.

If you hired a nanny or housekeeper for 25 to 30 hours they would expect a lot more than live in and £80 a week. I worked as a live-in nanny previously and I got £200 per week, my own ensuite room, all living costs paid for, and language lessons and I worked thirty hours a week, and that was quite low. Obviously with the recession nannies do not get paid as much in the UK, but they still get a lot more than an au-pair. The idea is they live as part of the family, learn the language etc it is a gap year experience, whereas a nanny is a profession. Obviously EU citizens do not need visa's, but look at the requirements for Non-EU au-pairs and they have very strict rules about what the aupair is supposed to do and recieve in return. So an au-pair is a cheap option for those who cannot afford a nanny as it provides someone to keep an eye on the children and do basic childcare for just a few hours, but that person does not need childcare qualifications or do as much as a nanny or housekeeper. So if someone is paying an aupair wage, but expecting nanny and housekeeper duties they are underpaying the au-pair. I am not saying at all that is what happened here, it sounds anything but. However it is really important that families are clear about whether they are expecting a nanny/housekeeper or an au-pair, and it is made clear to them the difference. I think if someone is hiring an aupair it is probably a good idea to go to aupair forums and see what they are saying, or look at the sites where families can be blacklisted and see the reasons why so you know the pitfalls because being or having a nanny or aupair can be a great experience, but it can go really wrong on both sides.

Kelly your info is very out of date. We are well versed in the legislation surrounding au pairs. The status exists for only 2 nationalities - Romanians and Bulgarians, both EU. For the vast majority language lessons are not obligatory, in fact for Australians, Canadians or New Zealanders they would be farcical. The other nationalities in the Youth Mobility Scheme may find them helpful but their working rights aren't restricted.

Yes a nanny is comparatively more expensive, that is usually down to experience and an increased level of responsibility. PT nannies are disproportionately expensive to make the job worthwhile. If you compare pay scales for mothers helps and nannies a mothers help is cheaper because typically they are less experienced and have less responsibility. An au pair even more so.

If one considers that an au pair can work 25 hours for £75 plus room and board, that's a rate of £3/hour. Full time at that rate is £150, however as is often pointed out that basic rate is plus room and board so £5 or £6/hour for additional hours would be mote reasonable, which gives £225 or £250 extra and £300 or £325 gross is eminently suitable for a predominantly shared job for an inexperienced childcarer.

I would say your job at £200 (net or gross by the way?), assuming 50 hours

Now the problem lies in the fact that au pairs, as they are no longer controlled, are open to abuse. This is where the family must be prepared to enter into the spirit of the exchange. However as an employee an au pair can raise a grievance. Swings and roundabouts.

To recap an au pair is an employee, contrary to what you said in your first post this does not make then expensive.

Sorry, went to check the 50 hours because I had a feeling you had specified and posted.

So £200 for 30, if you're in any way qualified of experienced is about pro rata for a FT live in nanny.

If someone wants that coming on here but wants to pay £80 they are usually politely told that £80 will get them an 18 year old with babysitting experience and that is in no way suitable for their requirements. I totally agree that if you want more you pay more, so do most of the world bar the nutjobs on Gumtree.

Fraktious,
That is exactly it, the system is now hugely open to abuse, and there have been a lot of cases of people hiring aupairs, but expecting a huge amount more basicly a nanny/housekeeper/nanny/maid of all work once the girl arrives. Remember most aupairs work for cash in hand, do not know how to go about making a formal complaint, and there is little they can do if they get fired unfairly. Again it works both ways, and an aupair can be a disaster for the family, but I have met a lot more aupairs who had had huge problems with the families and it normally (apart from a few bizarre cases) stems from the families expecting too much for an aupair.

Hi OP, I just read this thread and wanted to say that I was so glad to see you weren't persuaded by the original sob story.

I would have said (if joining the conversation earlier :) ) go with your gut instinct. I wish I had done that earlier this year when looking for my second au pair (our first girl from Jul 2010-Jul 2011 was great) but now I am looking forward to the arrival of our fourth au pair in September (yep Jul and Aug saw 1 au pair each )!

The things you mentioned about the girl not being engaged with your children rang so many alarm bells (imagine what she would have been like if you hadn't been there...no second thought don't do that) and the whole not acting like an adult member of the household especially with regards to cleaning up after your own mess and dishes etc is something I've asked a lot about in my latest recruitment.

Anyway GOOD LUCK with your next AP.

Remember most aupairs work for cash in hand, do not know how to go about making a formal complaint, and there is little they can do if they get fired unfairly

And this is why it is important to remember au pairs are employees. If you mean cash in hand as undeclared then that's because they earn below the tax threshold. that doesn't make them not an employee without rights to a grievance procedure which should be in their contract. If they don't have a contract then they can go to a tribunal and believe me au pairs do know how - one unfortunate MNer was threatened with that by her au pair.

It's quite a slow process getting people to understand that absence of regulation of au pairs in particular doesn't mean absence of all regulation.

Families can take the piss in job ads/not be upfront but their au pair when the au pair arrive can do something about it. Families are legally allowed to advertise for whatever they want - there is no restriction on what they can ask as long as they make it clear what they want in the contract. If it's in the ad the au pair knows what they're applying for, if it's not but is in the contract the au pair can decline the job, if it's not in the contract the au pair doesn't have to do it and if they're then fired they can challenge that.

That said under a year there is little anyone can do against dismissal save in specific circumstances be they au pair, nanny, bin man or banker.

I agree, but remember it is difficult for a teenage girl in another country to take up a grievence with the host family as it is her home as well. That is why there is a lot of abuse, with people hiring young women telling them they are going to be aupairs, and then once they arrive making it clear they are nannies/housekeepers/maids of all work. Very few will take it to tribunals, especially as once they are fired they lose their home and may end up having to leave the country (I knew a girl who ended up working 70 hours per week, and then the parents kept delaying paying her, she did not dare complain too much as she had no money and was afraid they would kick her out, I think if she had been older she would probably have had the confidence to take them to a tribunal). However, like you say that is changing and more aupairs are fighting for their legal rights, and I know in some countries couples have been made to pay backpay (I am fairly sure that is not possible in the UK with the minimum wage laws here). But there are a lot of people who honestly think an aupair's job should involve doing ALL the housework, including cleaning bathrooms and ovens etc, laundry, cooking, shopping etc, and then wonder why they have problems getting people to stay.
I really would recommend that if someone is hiring an aupair, they take a look at the aupair forums, and blacklist sites to see what makes a good experience and a bad experience from both points of view, or go along to the nanny and aupair meet up groups and ask the opinion of the people there. I used to know a couple who ran an aupair group and they said there was not one situation they had not come across, and I think people like that are probably the best people to speak to for advice, they can also probably give good recommendations for nannies and aupairs. It is not just aupairs who are the victims, I have heard of families hiring people off the internet and just getting robbed blind etc so it pays to get as much advice as possible before moving a stranger into your home. As negative as I sound I would certainly get an aupair myself in a few years, if it goes well it is a good way to get someone just to keep an eye on the children, and if you get one who has a native language other than English it teaches them a foreign language.