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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

childminder's been off sick, do I pay her or not?

22 replies

connyrabbit · 05/04/2011 11:43

I have a childminder/cleaner who does 10 hours a week at my house, looking after the children on 2 days and doing housecleaning on the third.
I have always paid her as per normal hours when we were away on holiday, but am I supposed to do the same when she's away?
What do others do?

Thanks all!

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Strix · 05/04/2011 11:46

I think you might have a nanny and not a childminder, in which case you are her employer and should arrange for SSP as a minimum. Do you have a contract?

Littlefish · 05/04/2011 11:49

Just a quick point - if she is working in your own home, she is not a childminder, she is a mother's help, or nanny.

What does it say in your contract with her? If you don't have a contract, what did you agree when she first statred working with you?

hatwoman · 05/04/2011 11:52

do you not have a contract or some form of written agreement that specifies?

on a different note - is she self-employed and working for several other people too, doing a tax return and paying her tax? because if not you could find (like strix says) that technically you are an employer (even if you don;t have a contract) and you are liable for her tax.

K999 · 05/04/2011 12:01

Do you work? If so, do you get paid when you're off sick?

Original poster

connyrabbit · 05/04/2011 12:05

Ok sorry so she is a nanny as she comes to my home. And no we don't have a contract. I know she works with another family but I've no idea whether she does her tax or not.
She's Romanian, she started off being my cleaner until I realised that she was actually really good with the children too, so I just asked her to do a few extra hours to look after them. We only said we'd pay her during our holidays as we're the ones messing with her income, we never went into detail on what we would do if she is away. We wouldn't pay during her holidays like when she was a cleaner only (we pay her well otherwise), but if she is sick (and I believe her) it's a bit different and I'm not sure what to do...

OP posts:

ChristinedePizan · 05/04/2011 12:07

I would pay her - she's your employee effectively. Sounds legally a bit dodgy tbh

hatwoman · 05/04/2011 12:08

I would hazard a guess that she isn't registered self-employed and isn't paying any tax and you are her employer. in which case she is entitled to sick pay and you are liable for all the unpaid tax.

Original poster

connyrabbit · 05/04/2011 12:16

Ok got it. Thanks very much for your help all

OP posts:

pippin26 · 06/04/2011 13:10

are you serious? you are 'employing' someone - not paying tax, ni, insurances etc and you are asking about paying them sick pay? you say you don't pay her holidays either.

what you have is a cash in hand arrangement - which is illegal. is this woman legal in this country?

sounds like you want your cake and eat it.

SnapFrakkleAndPop · 06/04/2011 16:04

Romanian. Ouch. Check what circumstances she can work for you under. Cleaning is probably fine as cleaners are typically self-employed even if they do a fixed day, the childcare may not be (probably isn't).

Who determines her hours and days? Can she dictate her time off?

The likelihood is she should (right to work wise) be self-employed but the arrangement you have is skirting perilously close to employment. If self-employed then the norm is not to pay holidays and sick pay. If employed you are obliged to do this.

BradfordMum · 06/04/2011 16:44

Does she have a CRB?

Original poster

connyrabbit · 06/04/2011 22:06

Golly, quite a firework I've started here...

Bradford Mum, no idea. Her mother has done the cleaning for me for 4 years, then her older sister for one year. I trust that family and that's good enough for me.

SnapFrakkle, she determines her hours and days: she works every day for another family and I only get the few hours that are left. She can definitely dictate her time off.
From what point (number of hours?) does it become employment vs self employment?

K999, I work freelance. I do not get paid when I'm off sick.

OP posts:

menee · 06/04/2011 22:57

this lady cannot care fr your children in your home and recieve payment with out being registered. this seems like a private arrangement you have, and whether its right or wrong, she is by no means a registered childminder, be very carefull as neither of you has any rights.

nannyl · 06/04/2011 23:02

its not about the number of hours that she works

its more to do with the givernments definition of what is self employed

GENERALLY self employed people work for a number of different people and different location, and hours of their choice, and they can easily be replaced by another person / send someone in their place

employed people have their hours and place of work dictated to them, and it would not be accapetable for them to just send someone else in their place.

OP you need to be VERY careful.... if you 'employ' someone, even if its a legitimately registered etc self employed person who pays their tax etc, then you ARE liable for employERS NI contribution. If inland rev think that you are acting as an employer and havent paid YOUR NI to them, then as well as demanding the NI they will fine you £3000k

Equally if person is employed you HAVE to have a contract (or statement of work or whatever its called), you HAVE to do it within 3 months, its the law of this land.

nannyl · 06/04/2011 23:04

menee actually anyone CAN care for children in the childrens own home without being registered.

There is no requirement at all for a nanny to be registered, only if the employer wants to use child care vouchers do they need to be registered

HSMM · 07/04/2011 08:09

She sounds like she's self employed, if she's working for different families and choosing her own hours.

Ripeberry · 07/04/2011 14:52

Can't believe you trust this person to look after your child. What do you know of her history? She may be a mad axe murderess on the run.
Keep her as a cleaner but get yourself a proper nanny!

menee · 07/04/2011 23:00

Sorry I was under impression if you received payment for caring for children over two hours that you had to be registered

looneytune · 07/04/2011 23:11

That's true for childminding (which is in childminder's home) but not for nannying or someone coming to your own home.

indigostarfish · 08/04/2011 06:50

Menee- nannies can register but don't have to.

OP, if you can afford it and you feel she is genuinely ill then yes give her sick pay.

HarrietPartyHands · 08/04/2011 12:36

I wouldn't want a mad ax murderess as my cleaner!

(How do we know OP hasn't checked references?)

Strix · 08/04/2011 13:47

I have known plenty of non-registered nannies who are very capable of looking after small children. I'm not really about a piece of paper.

Could you please define "proper nanny"?

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