Do CM's own children count towards their number limits?

[briskwalk]

A simple question! Or does it depend on the age of the CM's DCs. Thanks.

yes if the child/ren under 8

I'm a CM. Our own children count in OVERALL numbers but the stupid Ofsted system means that they put on our certificate how many we can MIND, so have removed our own children from the overall maximum of 6 under 8s. It's silly as it's confusing for parents and it's a waste of paper/money/time when we have to get it changed when our children move age groups each time. My ds1 is 8 on Monday but they can't change the system UNTIL MONDAY and I have a parent wanting to start with another child on the Tuesday. Oh well.

Does that answer your question or do you want to give more details so we can advise?

Thanks so far. Looneytune could you translate this for me then, in the light of what you'v just said:
'(EYR) may care for no more than 4 children under 8 years; of these, not more than 2 may be in the early years age group'
CM in queston has 2 DCs of her own - 4 and 7 and one mindee who is also 4. How many other children in the early years age group can she mind? Thanks!

I hope Looneytune agrees with me but the CM already has 2 in the early years age group (her own 4 year old and the 4 year old mindee).

This means she has her quota and will not be able to take on another child under 5 years old until one of the 4 year olds is in full-time education. So basically when they start school (probably this September) then she can take on two children under 5.

The CM can also care for another child between 5-8 as she has her own 7 year old counted in the numbers.

Hope I'm right about this - I'm sure someone else will come along if I'm wrong!

Scarf, thanks for that. Now I'm slightly concerned as DD -14 months is starting with this CM in May! She has assured me her numbers are ok. Any advice is most welcome.

'(EYR) may care for no more than 4 children under 8 years; of these, not more than 2 may be in the early years age group'

I think that means that the CM has space for 3 children under 8 (as already has one mindee under age 8). The CM's own 4 year old is in the early years age group (unless attending full-time education) as is the 4 year old mindee. So that leaves 1 space in Early Years and 2 spaces in Early Years-8's.

No I think the numbers shes allowed to care for on the certificate are the number of mindees she is allowed as her own dc have already been taken out of the total number of children iyswim.

So a cm is allowed to care for 6 dc under the age of 8, of which 3 can be under 5. This cm has one 7yo and one 4 yo so take them out it leaves the 4 under 8 and 2 under 5 as stated on the certificate.

I think. Just went to check my own certificate but dp has taken it down and put it somewhere!

not nesseserialy scarf.

IF the CMs own kids are permanently knocked off her numbers, she may care for 2 in early years bracket PLUS her own child of that age. which would add up to the fairly normal 3 in early years.

for example - a CM I use has 2 children age 3 and 7 . Her registration is like this
The registered person:
* may care for 4 children aged under 8 at any one time. Of these no more than 2 may be in the early years age group, and of these not more than 1 may be under 1 year.

add in her two and its total of 6, 3 in early years.

Which sounds very similar to teh situation OPs CM is in.

Meanwhile our other CM has 2 children OVER 8.
The registered person:

• may care for no more than 6 children under 8 years; of these, not more than 3 may be in the early years age group, and of these, not more than 1 may be under 1 year at any one time (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register)

I'm a cm too and agree that scarf is in the wrong in this instance and the above couple of posts are correct.

Unless the 4yr olds are in reception in which case they are classed as 'rising-5s' and count in her overall number of under-8s but not in her early years numbers. Confused? Welcome to the club!

I'm a childminder too and I agree with UniS.

This childminder can childmind the number of children stated on her certificate as her own children have been accounted for by reducing the numbers on her certificate. Therefore she can mind two under fives and two five to eight year olds in addition to her own children.

You've got me more confused now! I was going by the scenario that the childminder's children are counted in the numbers but agree now with UniS if that's not the case obviously.

So the 14 month old starting in May will be ok.

Glad I was corrected!

She can have 2 children & her DC undet 5. And 2 school children and her DC at school, making 4 mindees and her 2. I think ... From what i can remember of your post, while i'm on my phone.

Is her youngest dc in full time school if so she may have three under 5's who are not in school plus her two dc's plus another child between reception year at school and age 8

If her youngest dc is not in full time school she may have two under 5's who are not in school plus her two dc's plus another two children between reception year at school and age 8

Don't forget if mindee age 4 is full time school she counts as over 5 in ratio

This all seems to be covered now, all sounds fine. As others have said, when these children start full time school in Sept (I think that's what you said), she'll be allowed 2 EY aged children as well as your 14 month old and will then be full as both her children and the older mindee will be at full time school. She'll need to get her certificate changed to show she's then allowed 4 under 8s of which 3 can be in EY age group (but by then it may be that her other child is 8 so would also be allowed another child in the 5-8 age group (if she wanted).