Charging full day while at preschool if cm CAN fill the space...

[StarExpat]

This is for a friend (let's call her X). Not for me. As all of you on the cm, nannies, au pairs etc board know, I am incredibly happy with my cm and she can do no wrong :) This is also not about my cm. It's a cm that I haven't ever even met (so, 2 sides to every story and all that, I'm aware).

Her DD is in preschool for 3 hours in the morning. She needs a cm to collect her at 12 and then have her until 4, 5 days/week.

I completely understand that cm's often need to charge for a full day in this case because they can't fill the other half of the day with a part timer.

However, X knows that this cm has another mindee that only comes from 8-11.30am 5 days/week (she knows the mother, Y). X has spoken with Y and Y is also being charged for the full day because cm says she "can't possibly find someone who just wants afternoons".

CM obviously doesn't know that X and Y know one another.

Now, I know that cm's are their own boss and can charge whatever they want to charge...etc. I know this. X just feels that it's dishonest for her to use that as her reason that she needs to charge her for the whole day when she knows it's untrue. If she were to have said, "no, I only charge a daily rate" then that would have been fine. But what she had said is a lie (according to X and Y).

X really liked the cm and thought she was great, but won't use her now because of this. She feels that since she lied about this, she can't trust her to tell her the truth about other things and she'll be looking after her DD all day... Y is also planning to remove her child soon.

They both have another childcare option which will be more affordable (another cm willing to take them both on as part timers).

My question is - do cm's usually take part timers (maybe with an increased rate even) without charging them for a full day rate? Is this an unusual thing to want/need?

Also - isn't it a bit off if she were to charge X full day and Y full day and have all other spaces filled as well? So she's ensuring she basically gets paid for another FT space, which she wouldn't be allowed as she already has 2 other FT's and a variation for her own dc.

I just think it sounds all wrong...

Some cms do take on part timers - if 2 like this came along at the same time it would be perfect, drop one off pick one up, space filled.
She sounds very dishonest with the money side of things, greed is all it is. It would annoy me but I don't think it would necessarily reflect her ability to look after the kids (although if it was me I would probably think the same as your X and Y and take my dc out)
I know a cm who charges a 50% retainer for school holidays when she has teachers children and then sells the space at full price to others, effectively creating free money for nothing (otherwise known as stealing)

I used to take children on just mornings, or afternoons, or whatever hours they wanted, at the same rate as everyone else and I know other childminders in my area who still do.

I charge a daily rate (0800-1800) and some children only come for part day (say 0900-1500). If they want to use their 'other' hours, they only have to ask, because these hours are available to them and they have paid for them. What would this CM do if one of the families asked to use the other half of the day, as a one off, or regularly?

It does sound as if she may not have been completely honest with them, if they are filling one space (and remember they may be filling 2 separate spaces).

I would consider 2 parents coming to me with the suggestion that they share a day, but I would prefer not to, because it would mean twice as much paperwork and also would mean I would have to be home at lunchtime.

Exactly, HSMM. That's what X thought - well, if I'm paying for the full day, then I should be able to use the morning slot as well sometimes if I choose to. But cm said, no, contract would state the hours as 12 - 4pm

Hi, I'm a CM and only charge for 1/2 day session but I do charge for school/nursery drop off as well. I think that x and y are being exploited.

Star - my contracts do state the child's 'normal' hours, but they can book extra hours within the day they have paid for, at no extra charge.

Though I probably wouldnt have done the same as this childminder, I understand why she does. I also dont believe its stealing. She's self-employed, hence can make her own rules.
A number of things;
If X leaves - then she wouldnt be able to fill that place and would be losing that salary. So in essence she's not lying. In childminding, the income is not always reliable. Its so fluid for some minders.

Childminders have to do a lot of paperwork, etc. Some may feel that its not worth their while doing all the work for less than a particular income.

I agree it would have been nice if she had just said, this is my policy, but maybe she was embarrassed.

It may sound like she's being greedy, but ....................

If she's charging for the space then that space should be available for use - clearly its not, so she shouldn't be charging.

Just as a question would either X need her full time when preschool closes in holidays?

No, cm not needed during holidays when preschool closed by either X or Y but of course even if they don't send dc then, they still pay (nothing wrong with that).

Fliss that's what I had thought. If she pays for it because she can't fill it, then it should be open for her to use whenever she wants. But it's not. Anyway, problem solved. Both finding alternative childcare arrangements.

Thanks everyone for replies :)

I would call her bluff and say that the child isn't going to go to pre school on one day so will be using the space that she has paid for and see what she says, its an ideal opportunity to say that she shouldn't charge for something she can't use but this will only happen if it takes her over numbers.

good idea, dan. It would take her over her numbers. She's just not going to use her service. She did tell me that she said to cm, "ok if you charge for a full day, then I'll just send her the full day, then" and cm said, "no, there isn't a FT space" (?? ).

I just know my cm wouldn't do this.

Hold on ... maybe the childminder has two (or more) spaces for under fives available and that's why she charges both parents for whole days ...
What was written in the contract. Does it say daily fee and contracted hours plus other times if required?

apotomak, I don't see how that is possible, because of my post just above yours. CM said she didn't have a FT space for her DD when she said if paying for full days, she may just send her full days.

And it's unlikely as X said cm has two other ft under 5s + a variation for her own dc.

I have no idea what contract says. Y must have one but X had not yet started with cm, cm just said that's what she would charge because she couldn't fill the other half day. X isn't going to use her anyway.

I would then confront her about that ... if there is only one space and the children are sharing it ... it is unfair then to charge full day price if the full day space is not available. Tell your friend to ask for a contract review

X was only in initial stages and hadn't signed anything yet. Y is just moving to other childcare. Now she won't get the extra ft space pay she was hoping for.