Apparently all the local CMs get together and agree to set their prices ... isn't that a bit ... you know ...

[doricpatter]

I'm sure that's Not Right.

That would be price fixing a bit well illegal.

I am an ex child minder and I'd be very surprised if it is done in a premeditated way. I know that new childminders joining the profession are encouraged to check out the local market and set their prices in line with what others are charging so as to ensure that they don't price themselves out of the market. I wonder if this is what's happening here?

Yeah I thought so. What can be done about it though?

£5/hr for the only source of childcare in a small town though - what options do parents have?

The wording was "we had a get together recently and I know they're all going to up their rate now but I've decided ..."

We don't do that in our area. We all offer different services and mostly charge different rates. In about a 3 mile square from £3 - £5 per hour.

They don't need to have a meeting to 'fix prices', they could just check each others details on the internet.

I saw one of my cm friends this morning, I told her some cm in my street are charging 70-75 pounds a day therefore I have decided to also increase my prices. Mind you, I didnt increase for 2 years.

This is what the OFT says:

"Anti-competitive agreements
The Competition Act 1998 (the Act) prohibits anti-competitive
agreements between businesses. In particular, you must not:
? agree to fix prices or terms of trade, for example agreeing
price rises with your competitors
? agree to limit your production to reduce competition
? carve up markets or customers, for example agreeing with
a competitor that you will bid for one contract and they will
take another
? discriminate between customers, for example charging
different prices or imposing different terms where there is
no difference in the circumstances of supply.
Any agreement that prevents, restricts or distorts competition
is covered (not just the types of agreement listed above). An
agreement could be formal (such as legally-binding contracts)
or informal (such as unwritten ?gentlemen?s agreements?). The
Act mainly applies to agreements between businesses with
a significant combined market share. But even the smallest
businesses need to avoid getting involved in anti-competitive
agreements, such as cartels. The OFT can also assess whether
an agreement may affect trade between EU member states"

This has been happening in my area for years that I know of!!

Thank God I don't need them anymore.

{going before a rant comes on!!}

I work within a network of about 8 CMs, we all charge different prices.

I charge the most £4.00ph, but include everything, nappies, food, outings, wet weather gear, all equipment.

Others charge £3.00 per hour, but charge for all the above.

Alot are inbetween.

Definately happens in my area. One cm friend told me the childminders in her area had increased their prices so she had too.

Though as someone said. Childminders would be aware of other childminder prices by looking on the internet. I know not all of them state their prices but some do.

We do all know what each other charge, and do talk about it, but in the end we all run different kinds of businessess, and in the end we can only charge what market forces will allow.

Agree with Shoshe.

Question about that Act though.......I have 1 family who pay me £5ph instead of the £4.30ph the others are charged. This is purely because that family INSISTED I was worth more and they absolutely wanted to pay me £5ph. I explained that they'd be paying 70p more per hour than EVERYONE ELSE but they still insisted. Please tell me that's not illegal! It's not like I chose to charge more. Also, I know some people put their prices up but agree to keep existing customers on the old rate. I don't do this but are those people breaking the law does anyone know?

Yes but all the different kinds of businesses here all charge the same - although in fairness most of them no longer provide food, none of them provide nappies, and they're all limited to between 8am and 6pm.

In all seriousness I think I should look into doing it myself. I spent 5 years studying to get into a profession I loved but at £10ph for two kids to be in childcare, even working split shifts will leave me with a pittance.

Anyone know where I can buy cheap room dividers?

Looney - 1 family is paying me 65 pounds a day instead of 60 pounds because they insisted on doing so.

So we're ok to do that then I presume? :)

Yes nobody has a say about how much you charge.

That's what I thought, just wanted to check after seeing this bit:

'discriminate between customers, for example charging different prices or imposing different terms where there is no difference in the circumstances of supply'

But it's not us discriminating, it's the parents insisting which is different :)

Looney - I read that bit about charging different amounts for the same service. The children who have been with me for the past 5 years are paying different rates to children I have taken on more recently. This is because they are still on an hourly rate and the new people are all on a daily rate.

I don't think I have discriminated as such (apart from by start date), so hopefully it's OK.

I think the extra payments you and Summerfruit are getting would probably be classed as bonus payments, or something?

HSMM - Following the parents who insisted on paying me more, I have decided to increased my fees so everybody is going pay me the same.

Summerfruit - could I ask where you're based? I hadn't heard of anyone charging £75pd.

[heaves bosom and contemplates putting prices up a tad]

I just have to reply to this thread and say childminders are self employed and trying to run a business so therefore i think they can charge what they want an if parents dont want to pay it dont pay it and dont go there then find someone else cheaper or a nursery.
Sick to death of listen to childminders being slated,
In our area "manchester" childminders charge between £3 - £4 ph/£25 - 30 per day.

I think that is reasonable as its roughly the same price as nurserys.

Shell I'm talking about an isolated area with no nurseries or other alternative childcare. local CMs already have a captive market and now It seems they're colluding to fix a pretty high hourly rate of £5 per hour. I'm not slating the profession - I've used CMs for years and found them to be very hard working and caring, but I feel that they are abusing the situation and manipulating the market. don't take It so personally (unless you're one of the cartel I'm talking about, on which case - I'm onto you!).

doric - how did you come to hear this and what was said, I can't grasp it, could you reword for me? this bit -''we had a get together recently and I know they're all going to up their rate now but I've decided ..." - who said it, who is the 'we' (sorry to be so thick)

Had it not occurred to you Doric that the person, presumably a childminder, who said that everyone else was about to put their rates up but that she wasn't could have been telling porkies or stretching the truth to make herself look good? This is at best hearsay. The fact that this one is saying she is not setting the same rates shows that not all minders are in fact doing the same.

That said, I don't think five pounds an hour is unreasonable for looking after a child. When you take tax, national insurance and expenses off that figure it's actually a very modest income (and I know in some areas the "going rate" is even lower.

What does strike me though is that you seem to have a very angry and hostile attitude towards your local childminders. That doesn't bode well for a happy and co-operative relationship. Surely you would want to leave your children with somebody you respect and value?

Minderjinx, I agree with your feeling about the hostility towards childminders, its such a shame, but I still think there is a lot of ignorance regarding the kind of people we are as childminders and the huge amount of services we provide, I see myself as a bridge between parents and the professionals due to the mistrust and lack of confidence some parents have towards health visitors, doctors, schools etc. I am available 24 hours a day should the need arise to my families. How many parents could say that about the nursery staff they use, do they give out their personal details to be contacted when parents want them for support and advise? I work very much on my own as I don't agree with the way the whole system is working now, I'm a Grandmother of 4 children under the age of 5 and have been involved in childcare for 35 years.