CMs - Ofsted Inspections and those who refuse to give 'Outstanding'

[looneytune]

Just interested to know how many of you have been told 'I don't give out Outstanding' when you've had your inspection? I've heard so many times and for some reason, I got annoyed thinking about it today so I emailed them to ask how this can be possible as they should be working roughly the same.

I'm waiting for their reply but in the meantime, thought I'd see how many on here have come across this?

TIA :)

Yes, but at a nursery. The woman marched in and announced that she didn't think any nurseries were outstanding and didn't give that grade to them. Before she'd even started to look around! Charming lady!

I was told by my inspector that they are not allowed to give Outstanding for a first inspection which I don't think she was supposed to say! Completely agree that there should be a bench mark that everyone sticks to.

That's def not true as I know of places graded outstanding on first inspection.

Trouble is plenty of the inspectors barely know what they are looking at- in the case of early years anyway, I'm less sure about upper primary and secondary.

For my first inspection - the inspector's first words were 'I don't give outstanding for first inspections'

I complained to my early years team who went [shrug]

It would be hard but not impossible to get outstanding on a first inspection. You need to be able to demonstrate evidence of impact on outcomes for children which is hard without historical evidence.

yes I agree hard but not impossible; if you have been registered for 6 months then you'll have a decent amount of evidence, plus if your paperwork is tip-top and the SEF started ....

(my gripe is from pre-EYFS, I think 5 years ago)

anyhoo, I ain't complaining too much about Ofsted at the mo

She said the only exception was if they had a childcare background before going into childminding.

Ofsted? Don't get me started.....

A fantastic cm round here was one of the first to be graded outstanding 3 yrs ago - totally well deserved. She's just been reinspected and only got good. Why? Because parents dont sign the diary every day and she couldnt quote verbatim what the next step was for the 20mth old in her care! This lady has been minding for 20+ yrs, is one of the few I would leave my own child with and is totally deflated as a result of some jumped up person - who probably doesnt have kids herself - judging her in a 2 hour window!!!!

Another cm has been given outstanding and you woulodn't leave your dead dog with her, never mind a child!

Ofsted are a law unto themselves. As long as my children and parents are happy I couldn't give a toss what they think about my setting, paperwork, policies/procedures etc. If I am writing up 3 diaries then who is looking after the 3 under 2's in my care????

Madness............. off to get a sugar lump for my high horse

Here I've got some sugar lumps..

Agree totally, Underpaid!!
Possibly why Ill never get more than a satisfactory, ho hum..

Sorry for the delay, had a mental night in the end last night. Anyway, 4 little ones now dropped off at nursery and pre-school so I've got a bit of time :)

I'm not expecting an Outstanding myself (well, I'm not due for a while) but I do think it's terribly unfair to tell someone 'I don't give them out' as surely they should judge you and then decide?!

Anyway, some of you will know about my 'situations' with Ofsted and how my confidence in fighting my corner has grown since I sorted those 'situations' out . Well, the reason for me writing to Ofsted is I want to know if I can say 'bye bye, send another inspector' if they dare to announce that on their arrival! .

I got a reply which I'll put below but I've thrown their response back at them as they didn't answer my question at all, which was how can an inspector get away with this 'I don't.....' attitude!!!

Anyway, I'll come back when I get my next reply but for now, this was their first one..........

In response to your enquiry, the following link is the guidance in which inspectors must follow upon making a judgement about childcare providers against the statutory framework:

www.ofsted.gov.uk/Ofsted-home/Forms-and-guidance/Browse-all-by/Other/General/Using-the-early-years-evaluation-schedule-guidance-for-inspectors-of-registered-early-years-settings-required-to-deliver-the-Early-Years-Foundation-Stage/(language)/eng-GB

Below is an explanation of a provision that would achieve an Outstanding:

'This applies to exceptional provision which is way above the norm. The standard of care is exemplary. It is highly effective at making sure that children make significant progress towards the early learning goals - given their starting points.

Overall, the practice is worth disseminating beyond the setting.

Inspectors make very few recommendations to bring about minor improvement.'

I hope you find this information helpful. However, if you have any further questions or concerns, if you can provide us with more specific information, i.e. an Inspector's name or your registration details, then we can look into these in more detail.

What a load of total tosh!!!!!

. Well I didn't like their stupid reply so I told them (politely of course) that they hadn't answered my question and could we try again! LOL. Now it's officially been passed to another team. They'll be in a hot sweat now all worried about what I'm going to do next LOL (after causing them so many problems at the end of 2009!! hehe)

Next reply......

In response to your initial question. All inspectors make judgements based on the evidence available to them and the outcome is never restricted in the way you describe. It could be that the statement you quote was part of an inspector's conversational style which was clearly misleading. As stated in my colleague's previous e-mail, if you wish to raise a concern and have specific information, please let us know so that we can look into this for you.

I hope this response has been helpful.

My reply back.........

Thanks for your quick reply. I know of inspectors who DO arrive and on the doorstep announcing they do not give an outstanding (before they've entered the door). All I want to know at this stage is that when it comes to my inspection, if I have an inspector who announces this to me, can I refuse them entry and call you to arrange another inspector?

Kind regards

Will let you know what they say

Their reply......

In answer to your question, if any provider has concerns about the conduct of an inspector they should contact the inspection service provider. I do not know where you live so I cannot tell you who that is likely to be in your area. Alternatively providers can raise a concern via Ofsted, but we will need specific details in order to investigate. It would be better to address issues of conduct in this way so that the incidence you are anticipating does not arise.

If you would prefer to talk about these issues you can of course ring our contact centre on 0300 123 1231. Also all advice, support and guidance is available from your local authority.

I hope this response has been helpful.

I too want clarification from ofsted. I am only 15 weeks into cming and find the grading system soul destroying. I have heard too many stories of how the outcome of an inspection is dependant on the inspector who visits on the day and what mood they arrive in. I know of an excellent cm who has years of experience, was previously graded outstanding, she is in the local network, attends training sessions in the evenings and weekends and goes above and beyond to help the children in her care and their families. On her recent inspection she was graded good because, and I quote what the inspector said,"I don't give outstanding to childminders who live in flats"!!!!

That is an unbelievable closed minded predetermined view, and unless this is sanctioned by ofsted and written in the guidelines for inspectors, it should not have been said.

Is there scope for appealing a grading?

If an inspector turns up at my home and tells me that they never give an outstanding for any reason other than that I have not reached that standard, then I want to know that I can ask that inspector to leave my home on the grounds that I believe there views would be discriminating against me and my setting. Especially if it is said before the inspection has begun.

Sorry, this should've said that the cm helps to train and advise other cmers on evenings and weekends and I am sure she has qualifications.

Yes, my inspector might as well have said that she 'doesn't give outstandings on first visit'. When she read my report to me it sounded like it was for an 'outstanding' grade (I've read them on the Ofsted website) so I asked her how I could become outstanding (rather than the 'good' she gave me) and her reply was 'do everything exactly as you are now and you will get outstanding next time, but you haven't this time because you're new, you're all enthusiastic now but give it another 2 years and you might not be!'

Errrrm??!

Anyway, my Early Years team actually phoned me to congratulate me on my 'outstanding' sounding report, I kid you not!

I've said it before.. if the Government want to make cost effective cuts, cut OFSTED (and defence estates, but that's another gripe of mine)and streamline them.

I'm looking for a CM at the moment and none of the local ones have been given am "Outstanding" grade, but I doubt anyone would make a decision based only on the grade given in a report - you've got to read the detail about the setting and activities, make a shortlist, then visit them before you make a decision. Does sound very subjective though, which is silly if there's a grading system. Can't see the point in having a grading system at all if it's not used in an objective way, measuring all provision against the same list of criteria.