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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

am I being unreasonable?

50 replies

FuzzyWuzzyFuzzFuzz · 08/02/2011 20:35

sanity check required...
Am I being unreasonable to expect my nanny to let me know where she's going during the day other than normal routine, to and from school, preschool or regular activities.
She used to let me know via txt msg as agreed from the beginning then she stopped and having discussed with her couple of weeks ago which seemed fine, she has now stated I am being unreasonable and that I should let her do whatever she wants to and not question it.

Frankly I like to know where my children are during the day.

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

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RedGruffalo · 09/02/2011 19:41

on the whole YANBU. I think a good nanny will have plans for the day ahead and it is nice/useful/helpful if at handover she shares those with you.

I agree that a blow by blow account on the go is a bit impractical, but a quick txt at lunchtime if plans have changed is courteous.

I don't think the issue is necessarily about trust as some pps have said - it is more about a mothers desire to know where her children are. That said would actually feel my nanny was hiding something if she wasn't willingly sharing info at this level with me.

Original poster

FuzzyWuzzyFuzzFuzz · 09/02/2011 22:41

thankyou for all your posts and responses.

Normal routine and planned activities I'm totally cool with. I was very clear from the beginning and in interview that I do want to know where the children are outside of this. It's not a permission or paranoia thing it's being a Mum, I have children of differing ages.

When she has notified me often she's either there or on her way to something.

However the communication has stopped completely and now says I'm unreasonable for stating I'm telling her what, where she can and can't go?! and to boot she's put it in writing that she has an issue with it. Disappointed because I raised it with her amongst other things informally to keep status quo and not p1ss her off and now I'm in the sh1t?!

To add to it now I came home tonight, asked if the kids r ok, reply from nanny yes all fine no problems and then I hear from DS he's been sh1tting 5 times today(like water) (nanny was told when arrived to work DS had been sick in the night (and previous day)...
Still sent to music class and playgroup today?!!!!

The problem is especially when they're ill, she still disappears off and takes them out to activities so spreading the sick/sh1tting bug around.

OP posts:

nannynick · 09/02/2011 23:23

So is it more that she isn't child focused? Isn't adapting to the needs of the children on any particular day, instead she is sticking to routines such as going to music class and playgroup - even when doing so could be considered to be inappropriate.

I hear from DS he's been sh1tting 5 times today(like water)
Age of child... I'm guessing around age 4. That may have only been happening in the afternoon, not morning. Nanny may not have been aware of it - if DS is toilet trained and deals with things himself.

DS having been sick in the night and previous day though is an indicator that it should be an easy relaxed day.

I'm telling her what, where she can and can't go.

You are the boss, you can tell her exactly that. Either she likes it, lumps it, or leaves. Coming to a workable compromise however may be for the best if you want to keep her. So moving forward, what would work? Would her sending you a text to say where they were going work best.

Putting things in writing should not make it any more of an issue than doing it verbally. In fact writing things down can help as you don't get sidetracked, stick with the issue at hand. Just be thankful that the issue has been raised, rather than having her sulk without you knowing why.

SnapFrakkleAndPop · 10/02/2011 06:50

So it's not that you expect her to text about things within thr normal sphere of activities even if they aren't timed/planned like school run and classes, more than if she's going out of the local area or to someone's house?

I think that level of communication is fine and appropriate. You dont seem to have been unreasonavle asking for that. Dud you find her initial communications saying where they were/were going acceptable?

Warning bells are ringing for me that nanny may be looking for excuses to leave, suspect you're not a 100% happy bunny and therefore may be inclined to provide a less than glowing reference mentioning the issues you've already raised verbally which she hasn't rectified so she's using a grievance in writing as a countermeasure to justify that to prospective employers. Was it a formal letter or just a quick note in the diary?

GORGEOUSX · 10/02/2011 10:22

Alarm bells ringing here. She sounds as if she might not be averse to a bit of litigation. She also sounds as if she has an attitude problem. YOU are the boss. SHE is the employee.

Whilst it's good to keep her happy, the onus is really on HER to keep YOU happy.

I would get rid of her. The reason she took DC to playgroup/music lesson, is it's one less to look after for that time.

chitchatingagain · 10/02/2011 10:51

Well you need to put things in writing now. Make it clear that during the interview process you made it clear that you expected to be informed. She can't change the parameters of the job without your approval.

Taking a sick child out to a playgroup is simply not on. Firstly, it is spreading the germs around, but more importantly, it is clear she is not taking into account what your DC are capable of before she is deciding to go out. I know my DC sometimes need quiet days at home, playing quietly on their own, reading stories with me, etc.

I suspect what has happened is that she has started 'chatting' to another nanny friend and has compared jobs and situations, and prefers the way her friend's nanny job is run.

That is the point at which I ran into problems with my nanny who up until then had been just fine for the previous 10 months! All of a sudden I was asking too much of her, not paying her enough etc.

StillSquiffy · 10/02/2011 10:54

Warning bells here too.

She is taking the p and thinks she is in charge, not you.

I would write her a letter in response to her, stating something around the following:

That - as her employer - you are perfectly entitled to tell her where to go and what to do each day and that an inability to accept this as part of the working conditions of the role has resulted in a breakdown of trust. She is paid to work for a certain number of hours and during those hours she is expected to follow whatever requirements of the role you have set out to her so long as they are child-related and would be considered to be reasonable roles for her to fulfill as a nanny.
That it is a requirement of the role that she follows any specific instruction with regard to the children that constitutes a change in schedule, and that you will clearly explain these to her as they arise
That it is her responsibility to adapt to the needs of the children flexibly during her hours and that if you have indicated that the children are unwell in any way she will be expected to cancel events at short notice
That it is a requirement of the job that she checks in advance by text before varying the routine of the children, unless she is cancelling an event and keeping the children at home because of illness. Where she has sent a text in advance she must await authorisation and that you will endeavour to come back to her immediately in such circumstances
That you would consider a significant breach of her duties to fail to follow any of these requirements and that you will consider take disciplinary action in such circumstances.

StillSquiffy · 10/02/2011 10:55

By the way, in your situation I would have fired a verbal rocket up her arse if I'd received such a letter from a nanny as the one she gave you, and then sent a letter back to her.

StarExpat · 10/02/2011 10:59

Start looking for a new nanny. She thinks she makes the rules. She doesn't. You're the boss.

There are plenty of lovely good nannies out there looking for work.

weathershore · 10/02/2011 11:00

I once was offered a job and the mum wanted me to text even if we went to the post box literally with in sight of the house. They were not allowed to go the park.
I currenty write playdates down in the book things do change ie i arranged a playdate for the girls in the playground at drop off.
If they seem tired or unwell then we will have a day at home ballet drama kungfu football dance can all wait a week. if we go further afleild then will talk about before hand. INn the school holidays then we might jump on a train to find a swimming pool as a treat.

Bink · 10/02/2011 11:03

Far more going on here than the plans-info - sounds like the relationship is breaking down.

How difficult would it be for you to change nanny?

Blondeshavemorefun · 10/02/2011 11:07

*To add to it now I came home tonight, asked if the kids r ok, reply from nanny yes all fine no problems and then I hear from DS he's been sh1tting 5 times today(like water) (nanny was told when arrived to work DS had been sick in the night (and previous day)...
Still sent to music class and playgroup today?!!!!

The problem is especially when they're ill, she still disappears off and takes them out to activities so spreading the sick/sh1tting bug around.*

i cant believe she took your dc out after a sickness bug and spread it around a music class/toddler group

i would be furious with that as sure the teachers/other mums would be if they knew!!!

GORGEOUSX · 10/02/2011 12:47

I think Stillsquiffy has given you excellent advice.

Samedi · 10/02/2011 15:11

I've had jobs where I've been expected to let parents know where I will be with charges all day, and some where as long as charges are happy and healthy they don't want to know all the ins and outs.

I would have a problem texting parents all day UNLESS THEY HAD TOLD ME TO. If they had told me to, then thats as much a part of my job as the care itself so I do it. If not, I don't want to be disturbing my boss in their stressful job or in a meeting or something.

StarExpat · 10/02/2011 15:20

Samedi - precisely!

I've had teaching jobs where some of the demands are quite "unreasonable"(IMO - like changing the display in front of my class weekly and making sure everything was perfectly symmetrical and straight ) in a different part of the world... however I accepted the job and that was what I had to do. I might complain to colleagues in private, but would never have told my boss she was being unreasonable and stopped doing it.

ohnoshedittant · 10/02/2011 19:53

'but would never have told my boss she was being unreasonable'

I think it's ok to politely raise it if you think your boss is being unreasonable.

Sometimes something sounds ok at interview/on taking the job, but when you get to grips with the day to day reality of the job it isn't practical. In that case the sensible thing to do it to politely raise it with your employer. To blindly carry on doing it when you think it's unreasonable is silly.

OP YANBU to want to know about any 'out of the ordinary' trips, but I don't think she should have to 'await authorisation'. I think she should be able to tell you what they're going to do and not have to ask (within reason obv).

StarExpat · 10/02/2011 20:11

Hmmmm, not when it has been politely raised and discussed before you came and everyone else tells you they have tried to change it... but it hasn't worked. That's not blindly carrying on.

ohnoshedittant · 10/02/2011 21:40

no, but I don't think that's the case here, is it?

StarExpat · 10/02/2011 21:50

No but is hope that if I was paying the very high cost of a nanny that she would do what was agreed at interview/contract time... And anyone who didn't want to do as I wished should look elsewhere for a job. Sorry if that sounds harsh.
My analogy doesn't fit all that well, admittedly :)

StarExpat · 10/02/2011 21:50

I'd not is

StarExpat · 10/02/2011 21:51

And she or he
sorry nannynick

SnapFrakkleAndPop · 11/02/2011 07:17

But sometimes what you agree is frankly unworkable (doesn't seem the case here) and it's only when you have to put it into practice you find out it is IYSWIM. That goes for any job, not just nannies, so cost is irrelevant really.

A nanny will (or should) do anything reasonably required, but some people can have very odd and unreasonable ideas which sound find in theory and then you have to raise them. Just because one person pays the other doesn't ALWAYS make them right.

Blondeshavemorefun · 11/02/2011 09:00

so fuzzy you are happy for nanny to go out and about (when dc are not ill) but that you would just like a text saying

off to the park
going to see blondes and dc
off swimming

etc

is that right?

StarExpat · 11/02/2011 09:32

Frakk, but then if you have brought it up and expressed your opinion, but the boss still holds on to the "unreasonable" requests...
then you either do what the boss has set out as expectations or you find a new job. Right?

I'm just saying that if I employed a nanny and s/he brought up that one of the things I required doing was "unreasonable" and I still didn't agree and wanted it to be done (like the OP), then I would find a new nanny who would be happy to do this. Maybe they are just not a good fit. I would not be happy to employ someone who is not happy to meet the expectations of the job.

I see what you mean, though, about the person in charge not always being "right". I do get that. Completely.

I just think that asking to send a text about where they are going (as long as OP is paying for her nanny's phone bill or better yet, providing a phone for the nanny to use for this purpose) isn't all that much to ask. If someone is that opposed to it and it's really important to the OP, then that nanny is not the right fit for the OP's situation.

StarExpat · 11/02/2011 09:38

This nanny just stopped doing what she was told was expected and had been doing... Surely, you bring it up to employer and do what you can... but if employer says, "no, I still want it done" (provided it's not harming a child or the nanny, of course!!), then you keep doing it, you don't just take it upon yourself to stop. Right?

I can't imagine what trouble I'd get into in my job if I just stopped doing what was expected. I could bring something up if I thought unreasonable and attempt to get it changed, but not just stop doing it.

(Not at work today, btw. Home with sick toddler ).

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