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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

Need a bit of advice.

22 replies

FeelingOld · 30/09/2005 11:58

I have a mindee 'x' who I have part time (2-3 days per week). His mum mrs x drops him off and picks up 99% of the time, mr x works away a lot so not around much in the week. Recently mrs x has been working a lot of weekends cos says she is not getting on with mr x, none of my business so that was all I knew.
Last night mr x comes to pick x up as mrs x working til 11pm, and mr x bursts into tears on the doorstep saying mrs x has told him to pack his bags and be ready to leave when she gets home as doesn't love him anymore. I thought mr x smelt of drink but thought cos I saw some beer in back of his car he had probably just bought some and maybe had had a swig.
This morning mrs x turns up and says mr x got caught for drink driving last night (not with x in car thank god had was at his nan's) and when the police let him go he went round to see mrs x and attacked her and police were callled and mr x was arrested for 2nd time in one evening and he apparantly will appear at local court this morning.
Anyway my problem is that mrs x says that if mr x turns up I am not allowed to let him take x or see x, just call the police.
Presumabley cos mrs x has been my main source of contact and signed all contracts I will be okay should mr x turn up and I say he can't see x?
I really hope he does not turn up cos I have other mindees and would hate them to be upset by anything.
If mr x does turn up and causes problems (he has always seemed very nice in the past!) do I tell mrs x not to bring x again until they get things sorted or just go along with it all??
Dh says if he comes I should not have x again until they get sorted but what would other childminders do please??
Sorry it's long but would be interested to hear other childminders opinions.

OP posts:

otto · 30/09/2005 12:17

I'm not a childminder, so have experince, but wondered if you should contact the nacm for advice on this. I don't think you should be put in this position. What if mr x turns abusive? You can't be expected to deal with that or subject the other children to it.

coralswhisper · 30/09/2005 12:37

Hi,

I don't think it is very fair to put you in this position. Everybody has arguments but it should be kept between themselves and shouldn't involve you.

How is the child coping, they must see all this happening? have you noticed any differnence in the child? Less talkative? sullen? Moody? etc etc...

I think you should have a sit doen conversation with the mindees mum and explain your concern and mention you have other children to care for.

If the mother has signed all contracts I think it is best to only give the child to the mother.

Maybe you can arrange to ring the mother if he comes to the door? I am not sure? Hard one.

Try and seek help from below sources, the main person I would be concerned about would be the welfare of the child in all this!

Regards

Original poster

FeelingOld · 30/09/2005 12:46

Thanks for your replies.
Child x seems just as normal, as I said, mr x works away a lot all week so is used to him not being around however he does usually look after him at weekends when mrs x is at work so maybe after not seeing mr x for a couple of weekends his behaviour may change.
mrs x said she wants x to keep coming to me as normal cos that is what usually happens and she wants to keep x's routine as normal as possible and this is the reason I let x stay today.
If mr x does turn up I would hope I would be able to explain what mrs x has told me to do and that if he has a problem with it he should take it up with her, I would only call the police if he wouldn't then leave. The good thing is mrs x works only a 3-4 minute walk away from my house so would be able to come quite quickly if called.
My dh thinks also I should not have been put in this situation but x has been coming to me for about a year now and coming is part of his normal weekly routine and my mindees happiness means a lot to me.

OP posts:

HappyMumof2 · 30/09/2005 12:59

Message withdrawn

Original poster

FeelingOld · 30/09/2005 18:29

bump

OP posts:

ThePrisoner · 30/09/2005 18:36

I have a sneaking suspicion that, legally, he would be entitled to take the child if he wanted unless there is an unjunction/restraining order in place.

However (and I have a vaguely similar situation with an absent dad), I wouldn't allow child to leave with the dad if that is what I have been asked to do by mum, but it agree with others that it isn't fair to put you in that position.

If your contract already has both parents' names down as able to collect child, could you redo contract and only put the mum's name down as the person allowed to collect?

We shouldn't allow a child to leave if we suspect person is under the influence of alcohol or drugs.

Original poster

FeelingOld · 30/09/2005 18:44

When mum picked x up I told her I need it in writng from her and that if mr x does turn up and causes trouble then I would seriously have to consider my position as I have other mindees to think about.
She says she will put it in writing but didn't seem very happy about it all. Dh had to walk out of the room or he would have got very angry as he thinks she should get things sorted before bringing x again (due to come monday).

OP posts:

ThePrisoner · 30/09/2005 19:16

I guess I can understand that she might not be happy, but that's hardly your fault! Chances are that as he hasn't ever given you cause for concern at your house, he probably wouldn't start now. It's probably worth ringing NCMA for advice just to check what your legal standing is.

katymac · 30/09/2005 19:19

I think you should call NCMA as well

Unless there is a court "decision" you cannot stop a parent from taking their child (afaik) I had a lot of problems with this 2 yrs ago with an older mindee

The Mum needs to see a solicitor - I think you are in quite a vunerable position

PeachyClair · 30/09/2005 19:27

I'm not a childminder, but whilst I see that it might be an unfair position for you to be put in, if Mum has genuine reason to think Mr X might collect her be drunk and / or violent, not sure what choice she has but to ask you to do this?

I would all NCMA, but would also hang on to child- not kiddies fault after all. Needs all the stability it can get.

Original poster

FeelingOld · 30/09/2005 21:39

I don't think the dad would cause any problems as everyime I have met him he seems a really nice guy who loves his child and has always been very polite etc, my main concern is that his personality may change if he has been drinking. I am after all responsible for other children as well as his so although I think the world of x and would be very sad not to care for him, the well being and safety of my other mindees is also very important. I am hoping that his drunken behaviour was a one off cos of him being so upset being told that his wife didn't love him anymore.
I think I will contact NCMA cos I am worried about the legality of refusing to let a dad see or collect his own child where there are no court orders etc.
Thanks again everyone.

OP posts:

UKMickey · 02/10/2005 00:26

Like you say Mr x to date has posed as no threat etc ... but to date you have Not refused him his child.

Original poster

FeelingOld · 03/10/2005 12:50

Well just thought I would update in case anyone else finds themselves in similar situation.
NCMA legal dept and OFSTED both advised me that if the father was to turn up I have not legal right to stop him from taking his child unless there is a court order stopping him.
So I guess when mindees mum drops mindee off tomorrow I will have to speak to her and let her know but I don't think she will react to this news very well.

OP posts:

edam · 03/10/2005 13:12

What about the risk of him drink-driving with his son on board? Or 'snatching' his son without the mother's knowledge or consent, to 'punish' her? Extremely concerned at NCMA advice - what does that mean for victims of domestic violence, when they and their children are at most risk when the victim leaves her abuser?

Would not like to be in your shoes at all...

Original poster

FeelingOld · 03/10/2005 13:22

They said that if the mother has concerns about the childs safety with mr x then she should get a court order because without it legally I can not stop him from taking his child cos he has equal parental responsibility for him. (Of course if he was drunk or abusive I would phone mrs x who can be at my house within a few minutes).
I was quite shocked at Mr x's behaviour cos he has always seemed like such a nice guy and personally I think that he was so devastated by the split he drank too much and made a mistake which he will be regretting. On the evening he was crying on my doorstep he said mrs x and their child was the best thing that had ever happened to him and that he still loved mrs x so much. It's so sad

OP posts:

Pol25 · 03/10/2005 17:17

Hi there,
I was a nanny with similar situation that dad would not let gran or grandad see they children as they were saying that thier father had killed their mum- he had not, by the way.
I think and I know its hard but at the moment your house and the life he has with you is the only stable part and I think it's important you carry on minding him for his sake. As hard as it is to call the police if mr.x won't listen that you have been told he cannot take the child then you would have to call police, although not sure what the police would say on this, afterall he is the childs father.
Maybe talking to mum and telling her your concerns would help.

Original poster

FeelingOld · 03/10/2005 19:04

According to NCMA and OFSTED if the father comes I have to let him have the child as he has equal parental responsibility for him and until a court rules otherwise legally there is nothing the police can do to stop him unless he is drunk or violent.

OP posts:

Xena · 03/10/2005 19:29

Are they married feelingold? (I know you call them mr and mrs)

Original poster

FeelingOld · 03/10/2005 19:58

Yes, they are married.

OP posts:

Xena · 04/10/2005 07:54

Then he has equal rights as youv'e been told.

If they weren't then he would only have equal rights should he have got a court order.

Do you know what the mother says about the father is true?

Xena · 04/10/2005 07:55

I would also agree with your DH that it is a very difficult situation to be putting you in. They should sort it out asap.

Original poster

FeelingOld · 04/10/2005 09:24

Xena - no I do not know if what she has told me is true cos I only have her word for it.
Is it true at all?
Is it true but exaggerated?
Is it completely true?

I do not know and really I do not want to get involved. I just want to care for x as I always have and leave them to sort it out between themselves.

I have told her if he comes to see or collect x I will phone her straight away and try to keep them both here, but legally I have no power to stop him taking x. She was upset but says she understands my position, she says however she would call the police. I told her I didn't think that would help the situation cos they have no right to stop mr x from seeing x either without a court order.

OP posts:

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