has anyone had recent experience of the royal free at hampstead?

[JoTo]

many of the threads on the royal free seem quite old..i am just wondering if things have improved at the hospital. The stories on the post-natal treatment do not seem great
best
J+T

NLondon - I transferred to the Whittington from RFH at around 32 weeks for similar reasons to what you have experienced (huge waits, lost blood tests, lots of chasing midwifes for results etc).

re: blood test for blood group - I turned up at 28 week appointment asking for anti-d and they'd lost the blood test done at booking..... and hadn't told me but as its wasn't my first pregnancy and i'm a blood donor i knew I was Rh-.

My sister-in-law is currently having the same experience at teh RF and is considering changing to either whittington or UCLH. I had a moan to my GP who said she knows there is a problem but she is sure that its a safe place to deliver!!!!

I am sure that others will come along and tell you bad ante-natal experiences at the whittington but for me it was the difference between night and day. i had in total 6 appointments (2 midwife, 1 birth centre, 1 acupuncture, 1 scan and one with the baby for a blood test) there after I changed and all running within 15 mins of their time. Different attitude - in that they followed up everything, calling me both at home and on mobile, and even got a 34 week growth scan as an extra.

Hi MumNWLondon, Ive noticed a lot of people opting for Whittington and UCLH and so I'm wondering whether they're going to be too busy! Do they ever get to a point where they decide that they've got too many mums due on a certain month and therefore turn requests to transfer down? You can tell this is my first time!

I received a phone call from the helpful midwife today re-assuring me that the blood test actually happened this time and that they now know my blood type. She said that it had been reported to a manager (who she named but I don't recall!) and that the communication with the ultra sound department is something that they're already aware of and trying to address.

Hi MumNWLondon, Ive noticed a lot of people opting for Whittington and UCLH and so I'm wondering whether they're going to be too busy! Do they ever get to a point where they decide that they've got too many mums due on a certain month and therefore turn requests to transfer down? You can tell this is my first time!

I received a phone call from the helpful midwife today re-assuring me that the blood test actually happened this time and that they now know my blood type. She said that it had been reported to a manager (who she named but I don't recall!) and that the communication with the ultra sound department is something that they're already aware of and trying to address.

NLondon: It didn't seem to be a problem to transfer late. You can refer yourself by email so don't need to go back to your GP. I called first to check it would be ok and and they never suggested it would be a problem... you can go and have a look around on a saturday...

It took around 2 weeks from me sending the email (33 weeks) to my booking in appointment - but I did call every few days to set up my appointment with the birth centre because that has to be done at 36 weeks and I was getting close - I couldn't set it up until I had a hospital number....

HTH. Don't know about UCLH.

I gave birth at the Royal Free on 1 May and was very surprised to be told, when I got there, that there were no rooms available in the Birth Centre!

I had been to the hospital a couple of times before (2 maternity visits and one water birth workshop) and the birth centre was completely free in all occasions (all the 3 rooms). The midwives told me that usually the women would want an epidural so they would go straight to the labour ward - that's the reason for the empty birth centre.

I suspect the reason women go to the labour ward is that they are forced to, like I was!! They just say the birth centre is full and force you into the labour ward.

As someone had already mentioned here, they have a beautiful natural birth discourse, saying that they encourage you to be mobile and do the pushing in positions that are not laying with the legs on stirrups but guess what? In the end that's precisely what I got!! A labour ward birth with pushing in stirrups!!

And I ended up with second degree tears, which I wonder could have been avoided have I used a different position.

Apparently it is a safe place to give birth, but don't believe in the birth centre, as they may not let you go there anyway.

And I got a horrible stupid midwife in the postnatal ward. Next time I'm going private.

schroedingersdodo - sorry to hear about your experience - interestingly when I was chatting in labour (DS2 born on 17th April) to the midwife at the whittington birth centre about the RF birth centre (where DS1 was born on 1st May 2006) she said that from what she understood the RF birth centre wasn't really a birth centre at all - she said she'd been for a meeting there recently and the only pool was full of supplies or something and hence out of action.

when I had DD (2003) and DS1 (2006) at the RFH you could book into the birth centre in advance so when you called up in labour before you went to hospital you were reassured that there was space etc... when it came to DS2 (2010) they no longer allowed you to book in and TBH that was the reason I didn't want to go there anymore as I did not want to take any chances of turning up in labour and being told I was going to the labour ward.

MumNWLondon,

Unfortunately I found out the hard way exactly the same you found out in your chat with the midwife. The birth centre is just for show, not to be used at all.

I'm feeling cheated and very sad. Unfortunately, I lost confidence in the NHS so I'm not sure if I'm ever going to try any other birth centre in the future (I shouldn't worry about that now, I know).

I'm finding the post labour care at the RFH crap as well. I've been there again yesterday panicking thinking I had a prolapsed bladder (apparently I was wrong), after a week of constipation and after straining my bits really hard trying to poo, and spending a whole day afterwards with weird pains and cramps.

The midwife and doctor simply didn't believe when I said I was already having Lactulose, prunes, loads of water, fibre, etc etc for a week.

If they don't believe what I say, how can I believe what they say????

Basically, they just refuse to give you anything that works for constipation for days and days, then after you strain everything in the loo they say it's just that and everything will be fine.

PS: If someone reading this thread is having constipation, tell the midwives to s... off, go to Boots, buy glycerol suppositories and solve the problem. They will never give you anything that works, so you'd better sort things by yourself.

schroedingersdodo - sorry again to hear about what happened to you, but I don't necessary think its the NHS you should loose faith in, rather the hospital you went to. I just had a great NHS experience (DS2 now 3 weeks old) - and I don't think it would have been any different even if I had paid privately.

What I have learnt from the experience though (of crap ante-natal care at RFH and then when I found out I couldn't book into birth centre in advance there) is that with the NHS you need to leave as little to chance as possible and be clear and forceful about what you want (although this is hard when in labour).

I don't think there will be a next time for me as i now have 3DC but if there was I'd only go to a birth centre that i could book in at in advance etc. Or have a homebirth but not sure I could trust RFH midwifes though. I did briefly consider edgware as well but had heard good things about the whittington birthcentre and so decided to go there.

Did you see the recent article in the evening standard - i posted a link on this board a few weeks ago.

re: constipation - I was given co-codamol (sp?) after DS was born at the RFH and I was constipated for ages afterward, my GP said common side effect, so IMO pretty stupid painkiller to give postnally! I also bought glycerine suppositories which sorted problem out. This time I had a suppository painkiller which was great and had no unpleasant side effects.

Hi MumNWLondon,

I agree with your opinion about the NHS (being forceful and not letting much to chance). That's basically what I have been doing so far, always researching things before talking to doctors and nurses (so they know I'm not stupid or clueless).

But as you mentioned, this is a bit difficult to do when you're in a fragile situation (in labour or just plain scared of something).

The doctor who last saw me asked twice if I was taking painkillers - apparently, they still give the same thing to women after the birth, and they still get constipated because of it. Doesn't make much sense in my opinion either.

(I believe they think so low of people that they won't let you use suppositories by your own - the doctor even told me that in cases of severe constipation they would give the suppository in the hospital, and not give you the whole pack of it. I'm convinced people in the labour ward think we patients are all hopeless morons)

I read the link you posted from Evening Standard, but (o arrogance) thought that wouldn't happen to me...

By the way, so you had your birth in the birth centre of Whittington and it went well? Good to know that you made the right choice, and there are good "real" birth centres around.

schroedingersdodo - yes I had a really good experience at the whittington birth centre - i booked in at 36 weeks (I had all earlier care at RF) - (I had a meeting at 36 weeks to discuss my expectations in labour from them - I took DH to this), then they give free acupuncture from 38 weeks but I only had one session as DC3 was a week early. I called in labour and they advised to come in early as it was DC3 and they didn't want to take any chances.

they read and respected my birth plan and followed it as far as possible, including leaving us on our own, no internals at all, hands off as far as possible, advice with turning down lights etc etc. i didn't deliver in the pool as i was far too calm and had no regular contractions they didn't believe i was actually in advanced labour and then my waters went and he was born before chance to fill pool.

i asked why women transferred to the labour ward - they said generally because they change their minds and want epidurals rarely for any other reason. from what i saw (and I have other friends who delivered there) that it really is a genuine birth centre there. Because its downstairs it seems completely separate from the labour ward.

I totally agree re: fragile situation, thats why I refused to go back to the RFH when I found out about the triage arrangements. No way was I leaving something like that to chance. I felt at the whittington it was all sorted out in advance at the 36 week meeting eg I have a medical conditon and I made sure the birth centre were fully aware so there would be no surprises on the day.

re: constipation - i agree they should at least warn you - i had no problems this time with that so conclude it was the co-codamol when DS1 was born that caused it.

the aftercare was fab too - stayed with DS2 and DH in the delivery room (think spa room) for around 14 hours while the midwifes/paed popped in etc. We both spent a lazy saturday in bed with the papers! We did not see or hear any other patients AT ALL (although I know there were other patients in other birth centre rooms).

NumNWLondon,

Wow, my experience couldn't have been more different from yours. I can't even start to talk about the differences (such as being pushed to the labour ward shortly after birth, etc). I'm very glad you had the birth you wanted.

The only good thing about my experience at RFH is that it's over now What I have to do is come to terms with that and think about all that again only when I decide to get pregnant once more, which won't happen in the near future...

Thanks a lot for telling me your story, and I hope this thread will be useful for other mums too.

by "pushed to the labour ward" I meant, obviously, "pushed to the postnatal ward" ;)

thats not very nice either, certainly adds to the bad experience... i have been lucky after each birth to be able to stay in the delivery room for hours (from 1pm to 9pm with dd) from midnight to going home at 10am with ds1 and from 7am to going home at 9pm with ds2.

i couldn't really understand why the delivery rooms at the whittington birth centre have double beds and flat screen tvs until i realised what a good idea it was if you were there for hours after the birth. they say that they like to keep you in the delivery room until ready to go home provided its within 12-14 hours of the birth although some people leave a little earlier

does alarm me that no one has been able to come to this thread with a really good recent experience.

also further up this thread is the email address of a consultant there - if it was me i would email him to share your experience...

Well, I may email someone about my experience. I didn't feel like that in the first days after the birth because I was still a bit hurt about everything, and have been procrastinating since then. But you're not the first one to tell me I should write about it and let things be known.

Re this thread, I was hoping someone from the hospital would show up and say something, as happened in older threads about the Royal Free, but apparently this time no one could be bothered...

(I had been told during the maternity visit that if possible, mothers would stay in the delivery room until discharged. Just one more of those empty promises...)

Hi Neshi,

I had a tour of the labour ward and birth at The Royal Free centre last week, it looked Ok, not scary or dirty.

I'm planning a home birth - 39 weeks +5 days today, but wanted to see where I might end up if I do need to transfer or if they end up inducing me. Well worth having a doula or coaching your husband to make demands on your behalf so you don't need to get into any confrontations, as you will have enough on your plate with the labour and all! Printing off a detailed birth plan that the hospital must take notice off should also help.
Some of these stories are so horrific mrscardoso in particular, what happened to you sounds so dreadful, I hope you have recovered from your experience? It would have left me feeling totally violated.

The anti natal care from the community MW's has been absolutely fantastic, I cannot fault them at all, I felt informed an supported from the off.

Anti Natal care at the hospital itself has been hit or miss depending on which obstetrician I have seen, one was amazing and made me feel really good about my home birth choice, the other had clearly not even bothered to read my notes and suggested I was induced at 38 weeks before I had even sat down.

My main gripe has been with the ultra sound department. I was booked in for an emergency growth scan at 34 weeks and the earliest appointment I was offered was ten days away (I would have been 36 weeks at this point) - and I was told by the sonographer that they had looked at my notes and my case wasn't urgent, later they admitted they had been having ' a particularly busy day', now I have the stress of asking not to be seen by that particular sonographer every time I go in for a scan. I made a serious formal complaint as I know they did not have my notes and even if they did, they were not in any position to pass judgement on my case, as they are neither MW's or Obstetrician's, they are simply there to comply with the referrals made my anti natal care as quickly as possible. My complaint was sent off with a copy of my pregnancy notes clearly stating URGENT GROWTH SCAN REQUESTED at 34 weeks.

The senior consultant obstetrician is a firm but fair lady and if you do have any issues with your anti natal care I would ask to speak with her and also with the consultant MW, who is just amazing.

Hi Neshi,
You will unfortunately hear sad and sometimes horrific stories about for every maternity unit in the UK, childbirth will always have an element of risk and there will always be some poor outcomes. Part of our role as maternity professionals is to minimise these occurences and promote a safe environment for mothers to have their babies. Please do remember for every horrific story there are many more very happy pregnancy outcomes that unfortunately will not be high-lighted on these forums!

The prospect of childbirth for a first time mum can be a frightening one, whichever maternity unit you are booked at. Remember the role of all maternity staff should be to support you through the process.
It really does help if you have had a chance to talk through the options and formulate a birth plan with your CMW whih is placed in your hand held notes for all staff on the LW to become familiar with when you are admitted in labour. It gives you and the staff a framework to try and follow. The important thing is to retain a degree of flexibility, first labours more than others are unpredicatable in nature and too rigid a birth paln will lead to unfulfilled expectations.

Do stick with having your baby at the RFree, if you have any concerns or problems antenatally you can contact me by email at the Royal Free ([email protected]) and I will see if I can help!

Mrs Cardoso - I too am sorry to hear of the experience you have had. If you ever want or are able to talk about it you can contact me directly or our Consultant MW Emma Hardwick. I think you would benefit from some debriefing following your experience.
Otherwise I too would endorse umf's advice, and when you feel able to, consider contacting the Birth Trauma Association.

I've heard a number of bad comments about the Royal Free and it has disturbed me, as I am currently under their care. My reason for choosing them was because I have other medical conditions and my consultant for that is at the same hospital, so I thought it was easier having intergrated care. I'd like to stick up for them a little. I've had a very complicated pregnancy so far and was admitted on a number of occasions. My experience of the Early Pregnancy Unit has been fantastic, I've had to have many emergency scans and they have been supportive patient and very helpful and very reassurring.
My antenatal appointments, I have not always seen the same midwife or doctor but the staff I have seen were fully upto date with my case and always have time to answer any of my questions and I've found them friendly and patient. Plus even though I haven't seen the same doctor or midwife. I have often seen them in reception and they have remembered my case and enquired on my progress.
I was recently admitted to the labour ward which so early in the pregancy was an extremely upsetting time, but while I found they seemed understaffed and often working under extreme stress, they did their best to be supportive my whole stay.
However I was there for a few days and observed a number of womens labour experiences, some of this echos many of the complaints of various other patients.
Ward 5, I think needs a serious mindset change. There appear to be a couple of midwives that have a very fixed idea of what their role and involvment is, they take control and sometimes ignore the wishes of their patients. They seem very old school in their attitude back to the days when patients couldn't really make informed choices for their care because information wasn't readily available to them. Times have changed and overall Royal Free has moved with these, like most of the NHS to patient centred care, but some of the staff haven't moved with the changes.
I think some of the issues are they don't have the luxury of time that they may have at the birth centre or other hospitals.
I truly hope that some of the complaints are read and addressed by the team, who by whole work hard and effectively under a lot of pressure. I truly hope by the time I attend the labour unit again fingercrossed not until many months, some changes have been made to address many of the complaints.
I think more awareness of the individuals birth plan, more availbility for Epidurals. I think a concerted effort to perhaps intergrate many of the successful methods that work in the Birth Centre, onto the wards would help. Just because your pregnancy may be higher risk or have to be induced doesn't mean you wouldn't also benefit from massage water, mobility and greater control over the postion you give birth in, unless of course there is a medical reason to support restricted movement and/or instrument intervention, but those reasons should be explained. I saw a couple of women seemed most distressed because control of their labour was totally taken away from them, lack of pain control and they became like an object in the room that staff were doing things to and I think this is what often is the cause of greatest distress.
I'm sticking with the Royal Free I just hope they don't let me down.

I just wanted to add some initial feedback here. I just had my booking appointment with the Royal Free - I was a bit apprehensive about the care after reading some bad things and hearing that the RF was not great. The midwife I saw was great and v thorough. I have an appointment to see one of the anesthatists to discuss why my epi didnt work first time round and also have an appointment with consultant midwife to debrief after traumatic birth first time round. I didnt have to ask for these things - they were offered. All my care is going to be community based but I just wanted to offer my opinions so far. Lets hope all continues well!