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Childbirth

Share experiences and get support around labour, birth and recovery.

What do you think? Epidural or not?

25 replies

constancereader · 04/06/2008 20:01

It has been suggested that I have an epidural very early on in my next labour as I have a severe phobia of internal examinations.

Does this mean I am more likely to end up with an emcs? My last one went so wrong that the doctor thought she had sewn my cervix into the lip of the wound and kept apologising afterwards. (Particularly bad for me as the only way to find out is to do an internal or have an exam under GA). I would do anything to avoid another c section. It did not heal for four months.

But I worry that I ended up with a section last time because they kept me flat on my back to continuously monitor me. I did not argue at the time as I felt really guilty over my phobia. The reason the c section was so hard was because it was so late stage, but no one could get up there to have a look iyswim.

Would it be better to insist on an active birth with no internals? Or go with the epidural in order to help the phobia?

OP posts:
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whomovedmychocolate · 04/06/2008 20:04

Okay that doesn't sound like a phobia, that sounds like a healthy response to a medical fuck-up.

You need to find a way to get past this - how about a homebirth? Perhaps you could try hypnotherapy - I'm using a natal hypnotherapy CD for VBAC and I'm much more relaxed about the whole thing now.

But no-one is shoving their hand up my fanjo in any case, I just decline, politely at first and then more forcefully.

An epidural isn't going to help your phobia, you need to face it, decide how you want to give birth to this baby and stick to your guns. And YOU WILL DO IT!

ib · 04/06/2008 20:08

I don't understand - surely with an epidural they will need to do more internals?

I would go for an active birth with no internals, what is the problem with that?

Sorry, I'm a bit confused.

whomovedmychocolate · 04/06/2008 20:11

ib makes a good point - they would do more internals with an epidural - I guess they are saying 'well if you can't feel them, you can't/won't object'. Which is a bit like saying: we'll chop your foot off unnecesarily but that's okay because we'll knock you out first so you don't feel a thing'

constancereader · 04/06/2008 20:13

I don't think I expressed myself well - an epidural would probably help my phobia because I wouldn't be able to feel them doing an internal.

I planned on an active birth with no internals but I felt that because I was being so stupid ( no one made me feel that way, it is just that I am very ashamed of my phobia) I couldn't insist on no cfm. And because of my last section they want to continuously monitor me again. I am also very bad as arguing with hcps.

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NotABanana · 04/06/2008 20:15

Do you have to have an internal?

With DS2 I had one but it wasn't totally necessary imo.

whomovedmychocolate · 04/06/2008 20:15

CFM has not been shown to improve outcomes and you have every right to refuse it.

Don't be ashamed of your fears, they are understandable. I do think you should do something about your fear - for your own peace of mind, but honestly midwives see women every day who have various fears and they don't mock. It's just normal for them.

StarlightMcKenzie · 04/06/2008 20:22

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constancereader · 04/06/2008 20:23

Thanks for your responses - things might be better with the phobia anyway as I managed a smear test last autumn but I worry about regressing under pressure of labour!

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Eaglebird · 04/06/2008 20:48

I had an epidural when I had DS and didn't have loads of internal exams.
The only time I was examined after having the epidural was when I shouted 'I think my bum's going to explode'. The midwife then asked if she could have a quick look, and declared I was fully dilated.

constancereader · 04/06/2008 21:41

lol at minging fannyfeelers

I am feeling more assertive already. Thanks.

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tittybangbang · 04/06/2008 23:01

'minging fannyfeelers'.....rofpml

I'm saving that one up for future reference....

Niecie · 04/06/2008 23:07

I had an epidural but I had to have an internal first to establish whether I was dilated enough to have it - they don't like to do epidurals too early on.

Admittedly I don't remember the ones I had after that though so that has to be a good thing!

expatinscotland · 04/06/2008 23:09

i agree with whomoved recommendation of hypnotherapy, and perhaps some counselling or CBT.

i think you had a bad experience and need to deal with that no matter what route you chose.

LynetteScavo · 04/06/2008 23:14

It's late - so I might mot make much sence, but with DD, which was a home birth, I only had 1 internal (to see how dilated I was). I don't think it's really neccessary to konw how dilated you are, it's just useful for the midwives to guess how much longer there is to go.

I strongly recommend you look into having some sort of hypnotherapy - partly to help with your phobia, but also hypnobirthing could really help if you are not having an epidural.

jamila169 · 04/06/2008 23:20

with my two homebirths I only had 2 between them, just to check i was in active labour so the M/W could cover her clinics etc, with ddc4's birth i had 4 in total because of an APH. I have a huge problem with strangers feeling me fanjo , always have, but they were only done on my terms and with the provision that if i said stop, it stopped

StarlightMcKenzie · 04/06/2008 23:22

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StarlightMcKenzie · 04/06/2008 23:24

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jamila169 · 04/06/2008 23:28

Bolshy is the dogs bollocks Starlight -I heartily recommend it!

StarlightMcKenzie · 04/06/2008 23:35

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DaisySteiner · 04/06/2008 23:44

constancereader - I'm a doula and have just supported a woman giving birth with vaginisimus, which it sounds as though it might be something you have?

The woman I supported had a number of appointments with the midwife counsellor at her local hospital and discussed the issues surrounding vaginal exminations, epidurals and even elective cesareans and then saw the consultant so that everything was written up in her notes in advance of her going into labour so that there weren't going to be any arguments on the day.

Generally, before an epidural is administered the midwife or doctor will want to do an internal exmination to check that you're in established labour. The main problem with early epidurals is that they may increase the likelihood of having a cesarean, although the evidence on this isn't clear-cut.

However, my client was so obviously in established labour that they agreed to put one in anyway before they did any examinations so that she wouldn't feel very much when it was happening. Once you do have an epidural in though it does generally mean that you're going to need regular vaginal examinations to check progress and you would also need to be continuously monitored which you mentioned as being a possible issue with your first birth.

Another thing which might be an issue for you is that even with an epidural in place you will still be able to feel the sensations of pushing a baby out. According to the midwife caring for my client about 50% of women with vaginisimus find that giving birth more or less cures them, but the other 50% find that it can cause things to become much worse than they were previously. If you don't like the sensations of the baby in the birth canal then they can give you a much stronger epidural, but this can then mean that you need help getting the baby out - ie forceps or ventouse.

Another possible downside with epidurals and a VBAC is that they can cause contractions to slow down or stop which can necessitate drugs to speed up labour ie a syntocinon drip which can increase the risk of uterine rupture, so again this might be something to discuss with your consultant.

My client also did hypnobirthing which she said she found very helpful. As somebody else said, another option is a homebirth where you are likely to feel more relaxed and comfortable generally. At home or in hospital you don't have to have any examinations, but it might be worth discussing your plans in advance as mentioned earlier so that it can all be put in your notes. I know I'm bound to say this, but do consider having a doula as they can be really valuable in helping you in planning your birth and also with negotiating with doctors and midwives.

Hope this helps!

MarsLady · 04/06/2008 23:48

I don't think any woman in labour needs lots/many vaginal exams. A good mw will be able to know what's going on with you by your sounds, your body language and the way that you look.

I don't think that an epidural will cure your phobia. You need what all labouring women need.. to feel safe, secure and private.

Are you able to explore the Doula option?

MarsLady · 04/06/2008 23:52

Like Daisy I've supported a woman with vaginisimus but she didn't have an epidural because actually the epidural wasn't going to banish her fears. She did very well actually and managed her pain nicely. It's not a given that a woman should have an epidural if she has vaginisimus, after all that is the tightening of the vagina and an epidural doesn't work there.

ButterflyMcQueen · 05/06/2008 00:00

my best midwife 2nd of 5 births and 14 years ago - never went near me!

constancereader · 05/06/2008 07:01

Thank you so much for your replies.

I was considering hypnobirthing for my second delivery when I found out that they would want to continuosly monitor me again (which they did last time BECAUSE I refused internals). If only I had known that internals were not necessary I perhaps would not have been so compliant, but I did discuss my fears with my midwife and although sympathetic, at no point did she say it would be ok to manage without. I had several sessions of hypnotherapy beforehand but it seemed to make little difference.

My phobia developed after a specific life event and I have made some progress in overcoming it since the birth of my child as I managed a smear test (thanks to a brilliant and understanding doctor).

I think I will now revert to plan a and book myself on a hypnobirthing course. I will re-read this thread before my appointment with the consultant to give myself courage to argue my point! A doula also seems like a very good idea. DaisySteiner and Marslady, you don't work in Wales by any chance? !

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tittybangbang · 05/06/2008 09:47

constancereader - you might find some useful things in this article from the ARMS website:
www.radmid.demon.co.uk/abuse2002.htm

(not making assumptions about what has happened to you to make you feel the way you do - I just think this article highlights important issues about control and body integrity that are important to many of us in childbirth)

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