Elective Caesarian

[Hv]

I've just had a second caesarean. My first was an emergency after 'failure to progress' - 48hr labour. I was determined the second time to have a 'natural birth' but my due date came and went and the consultant and we came out with a date for a second caesarean the next day. That afternoon i went into labour and was excited that i might be able to do it myself. I went to the hospital at about 11pm with moderate contraction pains every 7 mins. I hadn't dilated so they sent me on a ward on my own to labour thru the night. By the morning I was having regular very painful contractions but much to my dismay I hadn't dilated at all. So we went ahead with the caesarean. I have recovered well and quickly and have another beautiful son. HOWEVER - i just heard from my 5th friend who has had their second child and had a 2 hr labour, got to the hospital just in time and popped their child out. Although extremely pleased for all these people I am left with a feeling of failure that my body doesn't work properly and that i have
been robbed of an experience that i will never have. I am sure i am just being hormonal but I'd be grateful to hear from anyone that has
got over these same feelings.

HV, I am so sorry it didn't go as planned. (I too had an emergency c-section first time and am now 32 weeks pregnant and hoping for a natural birth so I sort of know how you feel). I must admit that the first time around I was so pleased to just have a healthy baby (as her heart beat went perilously low) that I used this to focus upon and I never felt too sad. I know it can be so disappointing to not feel like you 'experienced' childbirth but you nearly did, you had the contractions that everyone else has and I assume you held your baby just after it was taken from your body so you only missed out on a tiny bit! Most of all please don't dwell on it, it was just meant to be, and concentrate on looking after yourself too. Take care.

I'm sort of in the same boat as Janus, I'm 31 wks, had an emergency c/section first time round - but I honestly don't mind what happens this time as long as I don't have 'both' again - ie long, worrying labour then an emergency c/s...but shouldn't as the trial of labour is only supposed to be short in case anything goes wrong. feel torn about having an elective, and definitely not anticipating feeling 'cheated' if I don't get a vaginal birth this time. just want a healthy baby.

HV, I do sympathise - the difference between a first-time emergency c/section and one the second time round is enormous, especially as for most people the second labour and birth can be a lot easier. WIth a toddler to look after and having had an emergency c-section last time I'm considering an elective 2nd time just to avoid a potential emergency c-section (yours seemed to have been a combination of both!). The childcare implications are just too much to cope with.

Congratulations on ds2. Another c/s makes the first few weeks harder, but in a couple of months you will have fully recovered and be able to feel more positively about the birth.

Hv - I can empathise. i had a very similar situation. I wanted so much to deliver DS2 'naturally' that I even hired an independent midwife and planned a homebirth to give myself what I considered the best possible chance. When I went overdue at 42+ weeks I decided to opt for induction in hospital (waters broken - no induction drugs)and went into labour rapidly. Unfortunately labour was identical to the first and I simply couldn't get him out, so after pushing for 2+ hours we went for another c-section. All I would say is, don't feel a failure, sometimes these things just have to happen. What's important is that you have 2 beautiful babies and that you are OK. Don't let anyone 'put you down' with the language they use (a friend of mine had her MIL say "oh what a shame you couldn't deliver her naturally" after an emergency c-section...). And try to think of some positives. When a someone said to me recently asked if I was disappointed to have had another c-section I said no, because at least only one part of my body had been ruined by childbirth, and my pelvic floor muscles were in good shape for sex!

Oh, HV, I do sympathise. I ended up having 4 sections. The first was done because the baby (10 days overdue) was diagnosed as distressed - the second because according to scan I was 2 weeks overdue; by my dates I was just due but they ignored that - and the 3rd and 4th were inevitable because of the first 2.

I was most distressed by the first as it had never occurred to me that I wouldn't go through a normal labour. As it is I never even went into labour at all, none of my babies was really ready to be born and I had great difficulties with breast-feeding because of that; at least your body did what it was supposed to up to a point! (How are you doing with b/f, as a matter of interest?)

Anyway, my dear, although all these things seem terribly important at the time of birth, even a couple of months down the line they matter less and by the time the child goes to school it's all academic (sorry!), honestly! So please don't feel bad. It's mostly hormonal I think - lots of emotions swishing about post-natally. You and your new baby will do just as well this way as the other!

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Everyone knows what I think . I'd say go for it if it's what you want. It will hurt a bit afterwards (how much really depends on your pain threshold and the proper delivery of pain relief), but the procedure is quick and painless and you can be totally awake and aware as normal throughout with your partner with you. Did you know you can ask for the baby to be delivered on to your tummy and be given to you for b/f right away? I forgot to tell my consultant that was what I wanted so I only got to hold my ds after he was weighed and wrapped (about five mins but I would have preferred to get him right away!). BTW elective isn't quite the right word, as it simply means pre-planned and can be for all kind of medical emergencies. Anyway, where are you in the country? I personally don't think private hospitals are great places to have babies - not enough special care if anything goes wrong. I had a private c-s (on my work health insurance, hooray!) at Kings in SE London. I couldn't possibly have afforded it otherwise and my consultant was Maggie Blott who was fab and is a top woman in her field, but very expensive indeed. There are usually consultants at any good teaching hospital who do private work. You can ask about them when you go to antenatal appointments. You can also have NHS antenatal apps and screening and then have a private op and post-op stay. I would advise you read as much as possible about your consultant and the procedure as possible and ask lots of questions. I had to chase an anaesthetist down the corridor to get anyone to answer my questions about spinal block v epidural! Two of my friends have had private c-s with private care (both quite rich!) and were pretty happy with their choice. The Good Doctor Guide ( a book) recommends surgeons in various specialities if you decide to go down this route.

obviously my previous post was aimed at Claire.

Nobody can possibly be a failure in my book who has a baby. and a healthy, happy baby is such a lucky blessing. Also, nobody's body works perfectly! I can't do backflips or run a marathon - and so I never will. Would you feel a failure for having arthritis, or a migraine? Also, giving birth takes a few hours, but to put it in perspective, you'll be a mother for every second of the whole of the rest of your life - which could be 60 years or more. I think it's definitely more important to get the next bit right.

Absolutely, Aloha - for the few months prior to and after the birth the way it happens can feel like the most important thing in the world, but honestly, a year down the line all the other memories of the real, living baby become so much more important than how they arrived.

For both of you to be happy and healthy, that's the important thing.

Now I'm going to get a bit more controversial: I'm sure that there are stats out there about post birth damage - both for caesarian and vaginal birth. My best guess is that they probably show similar levels of benefit/damage, otherwise people would be voting with their feet based on anecdotal experience. Let's face it, both ways can inflict damage - some of it temporary and some of it more permanent (both physical and pyschological). How you come out of it depends on your physiology, state of mind and luck.

Since both ways have inherent risks (and benefits) I tend to be of the 'its the woman's choice and nobody else's business' school of thought. With one exception. I find it hard to accept that a scheduled elective caesarian, for reasons of social convenience or appearance, is a good use of tax resources.

I'm sure that this is a very rare thing anyway (probably the press makes any examples up) but if people are encouraged to believe it is a good use of NHS resources then we run a long term risk of those resources being diverted from, for example, necessary emergency caesarians.

If people want to pay for elective c-sections privately, fine. If there are sound medical or pyschological reasons (including a morbid fear of childbirth), fine.

FWIW I used to be much more hardline anti caesarian but reading this thread has given me a little taste of what it must be like to want an elective caesarian - I think Claire has not been very well supported here and I'm not surprised she didn't post again.

There, that's my dose of plain speaking for the day. Anyone want to join in?

I had an emergency section the first time round (failure to progress) and was given the option second time round. I chose a section. As it happened Ds was a footling breach anyway, so even if I had wabted a natural delivery I would have ended up with a section. When I had the section the doctor told me that my first section scar was very thin, and could well have rupture had I elected for a trial of labour. So some 'elective' sections could be life savers. But I also realise that Vbac is fine for many women.

robinw, I really sympathise with you, the exact same thing happened to me with DS1. A bad vag delivery can be very damaging, as my bottom still attests. Due, in part, to this damage, DS2 was elective c/sec. And you were right about them running around while you were still suffering - my recovery was FAR quicker with an elective C. It was a walk in the park compared to DS1. I would do it again if it was just the birth (problems with severe preg nausea and breast feeding pain has made me decide that I've done my bit, thanks heaps ...)

Eulalia - you ask what sort of vaginal damage? Well obs and gynae staff will have seen their fair share of fourth degree tears, recto-vaginal fistulas, long term incontinence - all requiring further surgery/long term physio etc - resultant colostomies, subsequent loss of careers etc etc. And no, that's not what a vagina is for.

Staff at St Marks Hospital (which has the country's leading specialist unit for these types of injuries) are advised to refuse forceps or ventouse and have a c section if their labour doesn't progress normally. Now that's something they don't teach you in ante-natal classes.

That seems amazing Willow. I thought that ventouses were pretty common? (I had one first time around). Out of interest, how quickly can an emergency C-Section be organised if you haven't already had an epidural?.

bells2 - basically they have seen the sort of damage that can be done and would rather a c section than forceps. Also, a friend of mine gave birth at a South London hospital and noticed that the forceps were missing from where it said they should be on the equipment holder - she was told they haven't used them for years.

bells2 - my emergency c/section was organised in about 4 minutes flat - I hadn't had an epidural, had been induced but the baby was in distress so they needed to do the op very quickly - I was already on a trolley, it was shoved into the lift, DH had to carry some of the equipment, a consent form was shoved under my nose & I was knocked out & DS was whipped out!! All very traumatic for DH who wasn't allowed in the room due to the speed of it all ....... must admit I was oblivious to the whole thing by that stage!

Kia - we took my placenta home and dh fried some of it up and ate it. I refused (I'm a veggie)! He said he wanted to do it as he knew people ate it and to him it was just food so he wanted to taste it, nothing spirtual or anything. He said it was a cross between liver and steak and was ok. We still have the rest of it in the freezer 10 months later and plan to bury it under a tree on dds first birthday.

forest - isn't placenta approved by the veg society? I'm not sure if that's true or just a rumour/urban myth

On emergency sections - I think the target from Go to baby out is 30mins but may be 20.

I suppose an animal hasn't been killed to obtain the placenta so there is no ethical reason why you shouldn't eat the placenta. So theoretically the veg society should approve of it. I just don't like the idea of eating meat plus I'm a bit squeamish about the whole thing.

Isn't it cannibalism though !

Only if you are a placenta.

LOL Jahn.
I wish I'd had the courage to eat mine - might have prevented PND.

JanH

Does anyone know what the hospital does with placentas? A friend of mine who used to be a nurse told me that they are sent (sold?) to the cosmetics industry to go into anti-ageing face creams,etc. Yuck!

Placentas used to be sold to companies and the collagen was extracted which could be used for burns victims. However, since the detection of blood borne viruses such as HIV, placentas are now collected by clinical waste companies and incinerated.