Free birth

[Bluffysummers]

Any one free birthed? What was your experience and why?

I’m not pregnant nor do i plan to be. But I follow a few doulas on social media and they often refer to a free birth, basically for any one who doesn’t know without any trained medical personnel. I’m just really curious. Home broth I can definitely see the appeal, although not for me personally but can see why someone would want to. For a freebirth the fact no one medically trained is on hand is a little scary to me, the what ifs would worry me, esp in light of the ambulance crisis in the UK

This is a no judgement no shaming post, I’m just really interest in experiences. Why, if the lack of medical personnel in event of emergency did scare you, any regrets?

I myself have a had 2 hospital births, 1 delivery unit and one MLU (definitely preferred the MLU)

Fwiw again only from the women I’ve talked to, they all had a much much better preparation to giving birth than I’ve ever had (Incl NCT etc…). These were women who had done their research inside out.
This probably also explains why they felt in control enough vs let’s say me who was very much relying on the MW to guide me throughout the births.

@vipersnest1

I'm interested to know why you are asking for opinions when you claim you have no interest in being pregnant or planning to be... If you are carrying out research, say so.

Hardly an effective research methodology to create a post on MN.

I said in my OP, I was toying with a home birth with my second, decided against it as a) the clean up and b) the just in case. I follow a few doulas on social media and they talk about free birth often, I’d never heard of it until then, never met anyone irl who has free birthed. Been wondering for a while, finally made a post and here we are

I had an unplanned free birth. Hospital didn’t believe a primip could have gone from stretch and sweep at 1cm to 10cm and pushing in 2 hours and low and behold, DS was born right by our front door before the paramedics could get there. It was terrifying and horrific. But I think that was more the situation. If it had been planned it might have been different.

I'm a midwife who has seen the horrendous aftermath of a couple of planned freebirths, both have ended in the death of the baby. One due to an obstructive doula who completely brainwashed her client into thinking that healthcare providers were evil. By the time we managed to plead with the mother to listen to the fetal heart and for her to agree for us to do so, her baby had died. Her stupid doula then wouldn't allow the woman to pass her baby to us for attempts at resuscitation because she needed to have skin to skin with her baby. I've had to have a lot of counselling around that case. Note: I've worked with some bloody brilliant Doulas by the way. She was just totally dangerous.

Another mother declined intervention and laboured at home but had been in active labour for so long (like 48hrs long) that her baby was in such distress they couldn't be saved. She also nearly died herself due to a massive PPH because her uterus was just exhausted.

What I struggle with, is this attitude that we're not good enough to provide the best care we possibly can,but we are suddenly good enough for freebirthing women to present at the hospital to deal with an emergency?

Midwifery is on its knees at the moment, and I scroll through the threads and my heart breaks for the amount of women who complain or are traumatised because they haven't been cared for adequately, so much so that some of them decide they're going to freebirth next time.

If I had my way, I'd just want to be there, even if it's in the next room, so I can at least be on standby and for there to be a professional to advise step by step. Legally, if the mother declines there's nothing we can do. We are at our hearts, a woman centred profession and strive to provide the best care we can in quite frankly, dire circumstances at the moment.

Selfishly, I have been involved in the debriefs of completely broken midwives, who have been legally obliged to be present at home births where a mother has actually locked herself away in a room to essentially freebirth, with the midwives powerless to help as they weren't allowed in the room, but equally could not leave. Its a horrible situation to be in.

@AnotherVice

I freebirthed by choice. Essentially I considered the risk of being interfered with higher than the risk of a true obstetric emergency (cord prolapse, shoulder dystocia, pph). It was my fourth baby. I had all antenatal care. Previous two were homebirths attended by midwives. Their very presence meant I was on a timer to give birth in their strict parameters (so many hours from rupture of membranes etc....) I know these exist for a reason but the goalposts kept moving based on no evidence (12hrs or 24hrs or even 48hrs depending who answered the phone) The midwife only served to heighten my stress and slow my labour. I have also worked in varying capacities in obstetric theatre, labour ward and the ambulance service and seen the very worst outcomes, rarely. I also know it takes several minutes to prepare the theatre staff for a crash section in the event of obstetric emergency so could have been at hospital in that time frame anyway. It was a risk, I accepted that and it paid off. You risk your life and that of your baby just by getting pregnant. I won't be drawn into a debate but I wanted to answer OP's questions as there aren't many of us who have done it or will admit to it.

Thanks for answering honestly @AnotherVice. Were you worried about baby during labour? In my MLU birth they had the doppler on me every 15 mins. Did you have a doula? Do you live far from the hospital? Was it recent, ie with the current ambulance crisis? Sorry for all the questions, I’m not debating you, I’ve just never ever encountered anyone who’s free birthed even digitally lol :)

@Bluffysummers, 'Hardly an effective research methodology to create a post on MN.

I said in my OP, I was toying with a home birth with my second, decided against it as a) the clean up and b) the just in case. I follow a few doulas on social media and they talk about free birth often, I’d never heard of it until then, never met anyone irl who has free birthed. Been wondering for a while, finally made a post and here we are'

That explains my question somewhat, but your reply quotes home birth rather than free birth - and there's a huge difference between the two.
It would be helpful if your post titles were more succinct in future. (FWIW, I considered home birth with one of my deliveries, but would have never considered free birth to be an acceptable option for me.)

@USaYwHatNow that’s harrowing! What was that doulas reason for skin to skin with a baby that’s passed and to not allow ressus? Are there any legal consequences for someone like that?

[quote vipersnest1]@Bluffysummers, 'Hardly an effective research methodology to create a post on MN.

I said in my OP, I was toying with a home birth with my second, decided against it as a) the clean up and b) the just in case. I follow a few doulas on social media and they talk about free birth often, I’d never heard of it until then, never met anyone irl who has free birthed. Been wondering for a while, finally made a post and here we are'

That explains my question somewhat, but your reply quotes home birth rather than free birth - and there's a huge difference between the two.
It would be helpful if your post titles were more succinct in future. (FWIW, I considered home birth with one of my deliveries, but would have never considered free birth to be an acceptable option for me.)[/quote]
Why would I make that a post title when that’s not what the post is about?

It’s not about me or my births I’m asking about free birth. I’m not conflating home birth and free birth. I considered a home birth and followed a few doulas on social media because of that they often reference free birth. I’m asking about free birth out of curiosity.

Birth may be natural but it's also dangerous, for both mother and baby. See also: arsenic, being struck by lightning, killer whales. All natural, all dangerous.

There's clearly room for improvement in the way we look after pregnant and labouring women in the UK, but refusing all medical treatment is not the way to do it.

DD was free birthed by way of the mw not getting to the home birth in time. The rapid response paramedic arrived 2 mins before she crowned but was so shit scared that she sat on the end of the bed on the phone to ambulance control and did nothing. DH caught DD, which is a naice story but it was stressful and I’d not recommend it.

Tbf I think that stories of accidental free birthing will have nothing to do with the experience of women Wo decide to free birth.

@USaYwHatNow these stories are heartbreaking.

I have to say, having move in those circles, some women/doula are really extreme in their beliefs re what birth should be….
And yes, as you say, it’s often the MW they so wanted to avoid that are then called to sort problems out :(

I agree that unplanned BBAs are nothing like a planned freebirth. In my case OP no I wasn't worried about the baby during labour, it was active and there was no meconium or blood in my waters. I never had that frequent monitoring during my hospital or midwife attended home births either. I didn't have a doula as I felt confident on my own. My husband left me to it but kept checking on me and caught the baby in the end. This was over five years ago so before the ambulance crisis. However PPs are correct, ambulance staff have very little experience of birth. I was about 15mins from hospital so it was a risk. But so is induction at term plus ten like I was bullied into first time round. I don't regret it, it was incredible. The one thing I will say though is that as soon as he was born I felt a wave of responsibility towards him I hadn't felt whilst pregnant and phoned the midwife to come and check him over. I delivered the placenta into a bucket before she arrived. She was fab although missed his tongue-tie.

@TravellingFrom

Fwiw all the women I know who chose free birthing all did it for a third/subsequent births. I think they all were very confident in their own body ability to handle birth but also very aware of the legality of it and therefore very careful not to put someone in a place where they could be legally liable iyswim (eg a partner)

And they were all ok with the subsequent referral to children’s services for a concealed pregnancy and non engagement with midwifery services?

Thanks for sharing your experience @AnotherVice! Interesting to hear. I’m impressed you can feel baby in labour, i just couldn’t due to the contractions, especially when they got more frequent x

I think @Kitkat151 all healthcare in the UK including ante natal is opt in. Think the only thing you ‘have’ to do is alert services to the birth and register the birth

I would never have a free birth but after some of the birth stories you read on here with people being treated awfully by the people taking care of them during labour... I can't blame people for not wanting that.

@Notwithittoday

I got a ‘warning’ when I joined one of those fb groups. I’d joined it because I’d had very fast labours previously and thought I might end up with an unattended birth so thought there might be some useful info. I dared to suggest that a newborn needed to see a doctor as it was head to toe in a nasty rash and had a temperature. I was told that baby had everything it needed in its mother and no medical professionals were needed. I left the group after that

Wow. Some people have really reached a whole new level of crazy. Jesus wept.

I've been told to prepare for free birthing as very real possibility no medical professional could get to me in time . Not something I would choose to do though!

@Bluffysummers the doula just quite clearly had no fucking clue what she was doing and had no medical training. We had to have her removed from the room and I'll never forget that mum and dad. They truly believed in what the doula was saying and the crap she was peddling. I think they were led to believe she was more qualified that she was.

Interestingly, I have recently had updates with one of our safeguarding team, and they have also reiterated that maternity care is opt in in the UK. A baby has no rights until its born, however they will usually come from the angle of 'putting the baby's health needs first' kind of thing with deliberately concealed pregnancy or opting out of maternity care

@Flittingaboutagain sorry, what? Your midwife has told you to prepare to freebirth??

Many years ago I was on a Freebirth Yahoo group there were loads of women posting throughout their pregnancies, during birth, and birth stories. Most were from the USA. They would not have had a doula present during birth.

One time someone posted to ask if anyone was available and due to the time difference I was the only one who replied - she was in labour in the bathroom scared and her DH was posting on the fucking Yahoo! group. So I talked her through her birth via email with her husband reading the emails to her. Holy mother of god what was I doing. I didn’t want a freebirth but I wanted knowledge and they had it so I read along.

When a baby would die in birth it was generally accepted as to be expected or natural - I can’t quite remember.

Also, there was a lot of Christian women who I believe were not given much choice in the matter, they were essentially forced to freebirth due to religious fundamentalism. That was when I left the group as that cohort became more and more apparent- that was awful.

And also very few of them would have medical care during pregnancy. totally terrifies me thinking about it now.

@SockFluffInTheBath

DD was free birthed by way of the mw not getting to the home birth in time. The rapid response paramedic arrived 2 mins before she crowned but was so shit scared that she sat on the end of the bed on the phone to ambulance control and did nothing. DH caught DD, which is a naice story but it was stressful and I’d not recommend it.

Time and again I see people say they want to have a home birth and will call an ambulance if necessary as if that means they will go from deciding to go to hospital, to being in hospital and giving birth there. That's rarely the reality when you call for an ambulance, as it sounds like you have found out.

For me I was more relaxed in the hospital knowing my baby was being monitored at least every 15mins and also that there were doctors and midwifes allover the place…

As it turns out DDs heart rate was low and they helped her within moments. I would never have known at home which is a terrifying thought.

It’s all well and good denying yourself medical care but to do it to the baby is unfair IMP. If anything happened that I could have prevented by accessing medical care I wouldn’t have been able to justify my decision to either child.