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Childbirth

Share experiences and get support around labour, birth and recovery.

To ECV or not to ECV.....

16 replies

muchostinky · 10/05/2007 19:03

Hello
This is my 2nd post ever,but I have been lurking - so I apologise for the same question again.
I am 35+ 4 at the moment and have been to see the consultant today for what I thought would be a scan as the baby was breech 3 weeks ago and a chat about what I would like to do. But what actually happened was a quick feel of my tummy and someone saying 'oh yes that feels like a head' just under my ribs and him saying that as I have a heart problem I might be better to have a c-section. Which to be fair is what I was thinking might happen anyway as the baby is quite big and I wouldn't be able to push for very long.
Then 2 minutes later another consultant came in (the one I was supposed to originally see) and started talking about booking me in for ECV next Wednesday as this would be better. Now none of them explained what this was - I do know though as I have been reading the baby books and here since I knew the baby was breech - but they just sort of presumed I would want it.
After I talked to him about my heart problem coz he clearly hadn't looked at my notes he looked at me as if I was 'too posh to push' and said that it was my decision but an ECV would be much better and if I planned to have any more children I should have a vaginal birth. Now this is my first, so it's not as if I have had my 'limit' of caesareans and I would definatley try to have a vaginal birth next time if the baby wasn't breech.
To be fair all I would like is a bit of advice on what you would do. I was thinking that getting them to turn the baby if they could and trying for a vaginal bith was a good thing until I saw the consultant. But because he was such a condescending p*k (sorry about the bad language, but he was!) I sort of feel like just having the Elective regardless of what he thinks.
God I can tell that I am pregnant - so emotional and pig headed about it all.....
But what do you all think???
Sorry about the long post.

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Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
barbamama · 10/05/2007 19:07

Hi I had a similar appointment with a consultant today at 24 weeks who labelled me as high risk and said i would have to give birth lying on my back on a bed - she really wasn't listening to me at all. They just see us as cases to be processed as soosn as possible and to be got through the system with the minimum of fuss.

Anyway, does your heart condition mean you can't have a natural birth? If it doesn't and you can then I personally would try everything not to have a ceserian. Is there a nice midwife you could talk to to get some better advice?

albertson · 10/05/2007 20:25

I was breech with first baby (and with second due next week too) and felt I was bullied into an ecv. I don't know why but I really didn't fancy the idea but the two consultants I saw made me feel like a wimp, so in the end in a doctor knows best way, I went along with them. Happily (sort of) on the day, the consultant who saw me said the baby had engaged it would be very difficult to turn it and he wasn't going to even bother so I was let off the hook.
I'm not saying ecvs are a bad idea, because if you don't want a c section they're absolutely worth trying. What I am saying is consultants (and midwives and everyone else you meet in the birth factory) can pressurise you into decisions you're not happy with because of some agenda of their own.
During your first pregnancy you are especially vulnerable to what those in authority tell you, with your second pregnancy everyone is a lot more militant and prepared to do what is right for them and them alone. Only you can know that. It is rubbish to say if you want more children you must try for a vaginal birth, plenty of women have three, four, five and more c sections with no problems at all.
In your case, it sounds like the root of it all is your heart problem - how much advice has anyone given you on the likelihood of a c section, regardless of the baby being breech. If it is very likely I'd skip the ecv and go for the section. Remember doctors are under huge pressure to reduce the number of sections in their hosptial for financial reasons - that is their problem, not yours and you have every right to an elective in your circumstances. However, doing it just to stick two fingers up at a condescending tw*t probably ain't the best reason - he won't care really either way. Really good luck whatever you decide

muchostinky · 10/05/2007 20:55

Thank you to you both.

I do agree that 'just coz I am p'd off' isn't a good reason and I do have some time to think about it and decide.

Just have to get my head round it all I guess and I am going to give the midwife a call tomorrow to see what she thinks.

Thanks again.

OP posts:
DarrellRivers · 10/05/2007 20:58

We decided against an ECV at 37 weeks as I wasn't convinced about how successful they are, adn I could n't stand the thought of being in hospital for a day.
I opted for a lscs first time and then had a successful VBAC second time around.
Do what's right for you and take your heart condition into account, people thought we were mad when we cancelled the ECV, like have your asked your Docs permission to cnacel it , err no, it's our decision

barbamama · 10/05/2007 21:17

the arrogance of consultant obstetricians is astounding sometimes. Last time I was booked an induction that I didn't want at 39 weeks by writing it in my notes without telling me and the midwives asked whether I had been to ask the doctor when I told them I didn't want it, hadn't asked for it and wouldn't be having it. So when they booked me a second one under similar circumstances I just didn't turn up ha ha

evenhope · 11/05/2007 14:24

I had an ECV recently which was very painful and unfortunately didn't work. But we were given the choice of whether to try to turn the baby or just opt for a CS- very much our decision. Despite the outcome I would do it again because it might have worked.

Depends whether your heart condition means you shouldn't try to deliver normally.

muchostinky · 14/05/2007 02:08

Sorry shameful 'bump' here.

Have another day or so to make up my mind and would like some more comments if poss.

Thanks to everyone that has posted though.

To answer your questions about my heart condition, they haven't said that I can't have a vaginal birth. Just that I wouldn't be able to push for very long and would probably have to have an epidural.

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McDreamy · 14/05/2007 05:23

My first baby was breech adn I had an ECV - not successful. My second baby was not breech but he he had been I would NOT have had an ECV and gone straight for a section. As it happened my second labour resulted in a ceasarean for different reasons. We are now trying for number 3 and this one will have to be a caesarean.

There is no limits to how many you can have now but the risk of complications is increased slightly the more you have. Not sure if this will help you, good luck

snookie28 · 14/05/2007 19:53

They didn't find out dd was breech until 39 weeks. Was booked in for the ECV the day after. After a really detailed scan and some gentle prodding, the consultant decided that the baby was too big to try to turn. There was no pain and it was a good experience. I ended up having an cs even though he had offered to attempt a breech vaginal delivery

Am glad that I tried the ECV if only for the wonderful scan that they gave me. It was the first time i had seen the baby since the 12 week (don't do 20 week scans in Glasgow).

Next time if breech again I would definitely push for an earlier ECV as I would prefer to avoid another cs

mrsmalumbas · 15/05/2007 12:57

Hi muchostinky - do you know why they have said you would probably have to have an epidural? It could be because epidurals lower blood pressure, which can be a good thing depending on the nature of your heart condition. But they can also slow down labour, and tend to make the pushing stage harded - which is not necessarily a good thing if you don't want to be pushing for too long or too forcefully. If you do have an epidural, it might be worth asking if they will allow passive descent, that is basically avoiding any pushing at all until the baby is almost crowning. It can take a little longer but it takes a lot of stress off you and the baby.

In terms of the baby currently being in a breech position, the first thing is that you are 35 weeks - could still be 5-7 weeks to go, so there is still time for your baby to turn. You could also consider some of the "natural" ways to encourage him or her to turn such as acupuncture, moxibustion or hypnosis. Chiropractors with experience of something called the Webster Technique might also be able to help. There are loads of ideas on the net if you google it.

But if you get to 37 weeks and baby has not turned, you do have the option of the ECV. As another poster said they should do this in combination with ultrasound to see what position baby is in - bottoms and heads can feel very similar at this stage! Yes ECV can be uncomfortable, but they shouldn't be really painful, and they may be able to offer you some gas and air during it. Yes it's true that sometimes they don't work, although sometimes they can work on a second try if not on the first. Of course if it works then all well and good!

The main thing really at this stage is to think about what you really want. I can completely understand you feeling stressed and hormonal but is opting for a section just to get your own back on an unpleasant Dr. really a good idea?! Bear in mind things like the recovery period afterwards, impact on your future fertility, plus increased risk of problems such as placenta previa with future pregnancies, as well as the impact on the baby - in general vaginal births are safer for babies than elective cesareans. Of course with a breech baby there are more risks with vaginal births, but these still have to be weighed up against the risk of a cesarean.

Bear in mind too that if you have the ECV and baby does not turn, you might have the option of allowing yourself to go into labour naturally before having the cesarean. This might be worth asking your Dr. about. This would give your baby the benefits of the hormones your body will create when labour begins, which means they are less likely to have breathing difficulties etc when they are born (a common problem with elective cesareans).

The other thing is - would you and/or your doctor consider a vaginal birth even if the baby does not turn or is that completely out of the question? Remember that you can always opt for a cesarean at any stage if things look dicey (and if you do have the epidural, can be whipped straight into theatre).

Can you sit down with a piece of paper and write down all the pros and cons of each course of action i.e elective section, ECV, etc. ? Sometimes this can help to make things clearer.

Good luck with whatever you decide - only you know what is right or wrong for you and your baby.

albertson · 15/05/2007 15:15

Muchostinky ,Mrsmalumbas is talking good sense. Basically, it all comes down to how you feel about a c section, I have never been frightened by the idea of one, preferring that sense of control to having an unpredictable birth but I totally understand why someone might not like the idea of a major abdominal operation at all. Your initial post implied you're braver than me and were keen on a natural birth, despite possible problems, so I would go for the ecv and then if it doesn't work decide again if you're brave enough for a vaginal breech birth or want to go for the section. Either way do let us know! Take care

muchostinky · 15/05/2007 18:20

MrsMalumbas: Thank you for all of the information!!

I am now 36+2 and tomorrow is the big day for the ECV. I have pretty much decided to get it done tomorrow as I would like to at least try and have a vaginal birth, but am quite a bit worried.

The midwife has been over today though and thinks that there is a possibility that the baby has turned by himself, so I am sort of hoping that I won't need to get it done!! She also said that he is quite big though and if not turned is sitting very low, so maybe has engaged bum down. Just have to wait and see until the scan tomorrow.

They have said about the epidural because it would keep me calm and the thing about my heart condition (tachycardia) is that if I stress out it does get worse. Obviously it wouldn't be a good thing for me to pass out during the birth!

They have said that if the baby doesn't turn they with book me in for elective caesarean at week 39 and wouldn't try to put me through a vaginal breech birth because of my heart. So that's one decision made for me I guess...

Thanks again for all of your comments and I will hopefully be able to update you all tomorrow and let you know what's happened.

OP posts:
mrsmalumbas · 15/05/2007 18:29

Muchostinky - good luck with the ECV (if you still need it, maybe bub has turned!). Let us know how it goes...

MrsM x

muchostinky · 16/05/2007 22:28

Hello everyone

Just wanted to let you know that after all my thinking and trying to decide what to do the baby had blooming turned - all by himself....

All that worrying for nothing.

Thanks again to you all for all of your comments.

xx

OP posts:
muchostinky · 16/05/2007 22:29

Hello everyone

Just wanted to let you know that after all my thinking and trying to decide what to do the baby had blooming turned - all by himself....

All that worrying for nothing.

Thanks again to you all for all of your comments.

xx

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snookie28 · 17/05/2007 20:02

Great news. Hope you everything goes well and you get the birth that you want. Let us know how things go.

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