Why is C/Section such a 'dirty word'?

[Shoeshopper]

Hi ... why is it so hard to get a C Section ... I asked at the hospital yesterday and you'd think I asked them for an abortion or something worse.
Is there anywhere one can go to have the choice?
I do realise this is fairly contriversial .. but shouldn't we be able to have a choice?
Also - as a preg Woman, are you allowed to choose the hospital you give birth at?

I had to have an emergency c-sec and I would not recommend it.

There are higher risks associated with c-sec, to you and the baby. The actual operation, the baby is more likely to suffer from problems such as respiratory distress, more likely to die (good article in The Times the other week), more likely to have PND, in future pregnancies you have a risk of uterine rupture.

Talk to your midwife about how scared you are, she might be able to suggest something.

I'll tel you why it is a "dity word". Because because of comments like many of those posted on this thread.

This is not an unbiased informative conversation.

You can get a section on the NHS and you can (probably) choose your hospital. Only you can make this decision. IF you decide you want a section, CAT me and I'll tell you how.

I have an emergency section followed by a planned one. You couldn't persuade to attempt a vaginal birth now. (of course you also couldn't persuade me to have another child so it really isn't much of an issue )

Birth is a medical necessity no matter how you go about it. It is not an option treatment the NHS should stop offering. "Too posh to push"???? I can't believe I still here that phrase. It is SOOOOOO insulting. How bout we stop offering angioplasty to those who are too posh to diet????

have a look at

info for maternity hospitals nationwide

this might help you choose where you wish to give birth..however you want to give birth.....

HTH!

You might also want to look at www.drfoster.co.uk.

Also, you should ask for a referral to a consultant ASAP and ask him/her what your options are. Midwives are not experts on sections and tend to prefer the vaginal route (not all are like this of course but many are). And it could be argued that consultants tend to lean towards a medical approach (although this has not been my experience). But, you should talk to both and then make up your mind on which you prefer.

There is one thing I'll add, I think if you want a lot of children (4 or more) than having a section on the first one might not be a great idea.

I personally think a section is safer for mother and baby than a vaginal delivery. This will be a very controversial statement, but I think this thread is giving you very biased advice so I'm typing the other side of the coin.

Yes, Boowila, I believe that "too posh to push" elective c-sections should not be allowed on the NHS. And if you read my post carefully you'll see that I do believe that elective c-section should be allowed on the NHS for a variety of reasons including maternal fear/distress. By TPTP I simply mean those who can't be ar$ed to give birth "naturally".

I don't think the thread is overly biased because no one is saying "you can't have a section" to the OP. I think everyone's saying that there's plenty of time to address her fears and she can decide nearer the time if those fears have not been overcome.

"Angiopalsty" is hardly the same as a non-medically required c-section is it?

Sure it's the same. It wouldn't be required if the the person wasn't too posh to diet and exercise.

The thing is maternal stress is generally referred to as "too posh to push". Nobody belongs in the "can't be arsed" category. I've never met a person in real life who had a section because they couldn't be arsed.

My point is if the NHS is going to start qualifying various treatments as optional and threfore not offered on the NHS, they better be prepared to add a lot more to the list before they target sections.

Is IVF medically necessary? What if you have children? What if it only has a 10% change of working? And does that mean overweight people should be exempt? What about liposuction for obese teenager? Liver transplants for people with a history of alchohol abuse? This list could go on and on. And i thinkit's horrible that we want to start with childbirth.

i agree with soupy

Boowila, no.natural childbirth is not a "medical necessity." You make it sound so clinical and managed. it is a nessecity if you are going to haver a baby.
Actually there are a huge number of women for whom natural childbirth matters. The seriousness of having a section should never be played down.

And it also shouldn't be played up. The OP obviously states she wants a section. She did not come here saying she was undecided and wants to know about the benefits of vaginal birth.

Okay, it is a medical necesity to give birth once you are pregnant. It's coming out one way or another.

i think this is going off topic slightly...and Shoeshopper has to decide ultimately, based on reasonable information on both sides of the fence...what she should do for the best....

unfortunately, until you have given birth, you are reliant on other peoples perspectives..and the c-section v natural birth is hard to describe to someone who has had neither yet

I truly believe if women's fears re childbirth were full addressed, this sort of debate would be a lot less frequent...

there are pros and cons for each....neither is risk free or pain free....to my mind, having had both, women's bodies were designed to deliver vaginally, not abdominally. so i would recommend that personally ....unless physically unable to give birth!

Boowilla:

By Shoeshopper on Wednesday, 25 October, 2006 2:19:42 PM
WOW, thanks for your opinions and advise.
Yes, I think it may be a plan to look at councelling/midwife/hypnotherapy... I get so freaked just thinking about it.
Yes, I've heard so many scary stories... many of my friends have had to push for the likes of 3 days before having an emergency c/s and the distress has been awful.
Like the idea of hearing positive stories Ellbell - perhaps a thread I should begin.

"I have the most terrible phobia about natural birth"

i think it is fair that other posters address that fear and offer a way to overcome that. rather than saying, simply, have a section.

The OP said she was scared of natural childbirth.
I don't think the right thing to do is simply offer a section. I think that other avenues need to be explored too, like counseling etc.
I'm afraid I have to disagree with you. Natural childbirth is VERY important to a large number of women , as I have said and so it should be IMO.
I am not a fan of elective sections on non medical grounds.

"Hi ... why is it so hard to get a C Section ... I asked at the hospital yesterday and you'd think I asked them for an abortion or something worse.

Is there anywhere one can go to have the choice?"

Not many shade of grey there either.

Shoeshopper ..

NICE - do a search for caesarean and it will give you the clinical guidelines re csections!

I have quite a bit of sympathy with your POV, Uwila, but at the same time I can't just demand a liver transplant, or an angioplasty, or any number of other treatments, because the medical staff would quite properly point out that there's no reason to suppose that my existing liver and arteries can't manage perfectly well as they are and so there's no medical justification for the procedure. Why should it be any different for childbirth?

I'll stick my neck out and say that I think NHS money spent on "no medical reason" c-sections would be better spent on free cycles of IVF treatment, which are STILL generally not available in many areas (and almost nowhere are the recommended three cycles available). But a genuine phobia of natural childbirth may well be a valid medical reason.

to move it off shoeshopper's thread

Hi Shoeshopper, you are very sensible not to rule out options to overcoming your fear.

This is just to say that if you cannot get over your fear of childbirth, then an elective section should be open to you. You must be prepared to insist and hold firm. Take Boowila up on her offer.

Despite gearing up for an active natural birth, I was very disappointed with a failed induction and em cs. For my second, I considered all the risks and the conditions in my hospital and went elective. My experience of an elective was very positive and after 5 days, I was happily purring around and did not feel like I just had major abdominal surgery. My experience is not unusual.

The problem is that the NHS is not great at supporting mothers wanting a natural delivery under hospital conditions (check out threads on mn) which could lead to a cascade of intervention. That being so, until the NHS sorts out its issues (like understaffing, overcrowding, lack of emotional support for traumatic delivery), cs is a valid choice in your situation, if you do decide to go for it. All the best.

boowila, giving birth isn't a 'medical' necessity; it's a physiological one, not a medical one!

As I know only too well, it can and should be medicalised depending on the situation and the wishes of the woman.

I hope the OP gets whichever sort of birth she wants

I asked for a c section based on experiences of dreadful 1st birth ( I was really scared all through 1st pregnancy, and the horrible birth to some extent underlined my fears.) Fear of childbirth is caused tokophobia and is a genuine fear/phobia.
The hospital were very supportive and hepful. The birth was the best experience ever of my life, whilst the first birth was probably the worst, (despite ds). The recovery from c-section was much much faster than first "normal" birth. I was still absolutely wiped out 3 weeks after
1st birth, and was up and around 1 week after c-section. Also c-section scar was much more manageable and a lot less painful than horrendous episiotomy.
You can ask for a c-section on the NHS, and you can ask for a second opinion if the first consultant refuses it.I found my consultant very supportive, and I got the birth I wanted which proved to be the right choice for me.

Boowila... most of the advice on here was extremely constructive. 99% of posters agreed that shoeshopper should be able to choose a c-section if she felt that this was the best way forward for her. But we also made the point that there are things that can be done to counteract fear. And this might be a good thing for her to do (imho) even if she goes ahead with a planned section. (What if she went into labour before the date of the section, for example?) I have suffered/suffer from phobias, and I know how painful and life-controlling they can be. But I also know that it's possible to overcome them (at least to some extent). I hope that shoeshopper gets the help she needs with this and I hope that she has the birth experience that she wants.

Haven't been able to get on line sooner and I SO apprecaite all the comments. I'm really keen to find out all the facts. I also want to find out where this irrational fear that I have comes from (and if it is in fact a phobia). If it is, then I'll have to start saving like mad ... private charges are hectic! (Thanks for the hospital names Lulama, had a quick look).

Thanks Lulama & Frankie ... that's a good and reassuring thread .. hopefully I can add a positive note to the end of it in a few months time!!!

Out of interest, is there as much controversy about breastfeeding? I would really like to breastfeed, but most of my friends don't do it... they say it's too sore. (Shouldn't say this, but is there a 'too posh to be sucked' phrase? )