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Childbirth

Share experiences and get support around labour, birth and recovery.

Epidural - why wouldn't you?

231 replies

lbsjob87 · 31/05/2014 23:58

I started a thread on AIBU about pain relief in childbirth yesterday that led me to wonder something. Lots of women said they didn't have an epidural because the idea scared them so much, and I just wondered why?
I am 35 weeks with No 2 and am starting to think about a birth plan (although last time has taught me they are not worth it half the time, but anyway.....)
I'm aiming for a VBAC but may yet be advised to have an ELCS. If I do have a VBAC, I will take it as it comes, if it gets too much, I'll probably have an epidural. Last time, my DD was back to back and had shoulder dystosia and an epidural couldn't come quickly enough.
I know it's personal choice/circumstances but I wondered what frightened people about it? Is it the initial needles in the back, the loss of feeling in the legs or a fear of not being "in control" of the pushing?
Last time was a blur, tbh and I really don't remember much about it.
I'm not trying to scare myself, just wondering what others experiences are.

OP posts:
fourtothedozen · 04/08/2015 07:04

I wouldn't want one.

I would prefer not to increase the risk of someone taking a scalpel to my vulva.

I like to be upright and moblie, and want to decrease my recovery time.

GraceGrape · 04/08/2015 07:23

Interesting reading. I was refused an epidural both times I gave birth because I was too far along by the time I got to hospital. 1st labour ended in emcs due to awkward presentation so I had an epidural then it was lovely.
2nd birth was a vbac. I ended up lying on my back anyway because that was the most comfortable and had ventouse delivery plus a 3rd degree tear so I had to have an epidural for surgery. I have all my contractions in my back due to the position of my uterus and I never felt the urge to push either time. Ended up with a very long pushing stage. I had no pain relief.
Births can involve intervention and difficulties pushing even if you don't have an epidural. I feel that at least with an epidural I might have had a more enjoyable experience.

fourtothedozen · 04/08/2015 07:25

Births can involve intervention and difficulties pushing even if you don't have an epidural

Of course, but epidural increases the chance of intervention.

VeryPunny · 04/08/2015 07:28

Epidural do NOT increase the risk of intervention. It is now thought that epidural are correlated with intervention - women who ask for epidurals are more likely having challenging births and need pain relief because their births are challenging, not need intervention because of the epidural.

Epidurals were the point at which both my births transformed into positive experiences. I could feel when to push etc.

Roseybee10 · 04/08/2015 08:31

From the research I've done the majority still point towards diamorphine and epidural having a link to more likelihood of intervention. Tbh any kind of intervention (pessary, waters being broken, drips, pain relief can slow labour down or affect it in a way that may make intervention more likely for the birth. Even paracetamol has been known to slow things down).

I think epidurals are great for people who want that sort of pain relief or who are having a difficult and prolonged labour as it gives time to rest so that maybe they are able to push when the time comes whereas without the epidural they'd be too exhausted.

I think I'm a weirdo lol. I wanted to feel it all and experience birth that way. I didn't want to be numb. It's just a personal thing though. I don't think it was a 'better way', just a better way for me.

waitaminutenow · 04/08/2015 08:51

Hazlenutt yes. In my local hospital (Carlisle) an epidural is not an option as a form of pain relief. But should you need a planned or emergency c-section then they are provided. But only for those reasons (as far as I can see) I am due no2, my dd was born there 2 years ago and as far as I'm aware it is still the same.

HazleNutt · 04/08/2015 09:38

I think it's shameful that epidurals, especially mobile epidurals are either not available or are simply not given when requested. Is there any other area of medicine where the attitude is "So for pain, yes, in principle we do have this modern anaesthetic available, but we're not giving it, have some whiskey instead and bite down hard on this piece of wood"?

VeryPunny · 04/08/2015 09:43

Roseybee - forgive me but I'll ignore the "research" done by a random on the internet. Epidural rates in France and the US are (far) higher than in the UK but their intervention rates are comparable or lower:

www.birthtraumaassociation.org.uk/publications/epidurals.pdf

waitaminutenow · 04/08/2015 09:48

There are plenty of other ways (and medication) to help manage pain...an epidural is only one of them...and not a necessity tbh. I managed just fine using a tens machine, meptid and gas n air. A lack of epidural doesn't mean its barbaric!!

It's about money at the end of the day. Carlisle infirmary chooses not to pay for an anaesthetist to constantly be available to give epidurals as a form of pain relief.

yetanotherdeskmove · 04/08/2015 09:48

The idea of someone sticking a needle in my spine terrified me far more than the pain. theoretically I know they are very safe, but I just couldn't get past that image.

Minifingers · 04/08/2015 10:43

Like all invasive medical procedures, they have risks and benefits.

I'm profoundly grateful for the existence of this type of pain relief because it can change the experience of labour from one which is utterly traumatic to one which is positive and calm, and would like all women who want one to have access to it on request.

HOWEVER

I myself decided to try and avoid having another one after having one (which worked very well) with my first. My main reason is a respect for the normal functioning of the hormonal physiology of birth and the immediate postnatal period. I felt very different after my epidural birth in comparison to my non-epidural births, despite my first and third labour being similar in length (ie, loooong!). I definitely felt 'flatter' after my epidural birth. I also didn't want to have to labour in the sort of setting necessary to access epidural analgesia. In other words, it's not just epidural that was the problem for me - it's whole care package that comes with it.

"Epidural do NOT increase the risk of intervention. It is now thought that epidural are correlated with intervention - women who ask for epidurals are more likely having challenging births and need pain relief because their births are challenging, not need intervention because of the epidural."

There is some truth in this. But unpicking the situation is difficult if not impossible, as in all studies looking at the impact of epidural analgesia on labour there is huge cross-over between the epidural and non-epidural arms of trials. This makes a bit of a nonsense of the findings IMO. Plus about 95% of the studies only compare mothers who have had opioids (who are often supine for much of their labour and may be more likely to have an abnormal fetal trace, as are the unborn babies of women who have had an epidural) with mothers who have opted for an epidural. They're not comparing women having an unmedicated, active birth with women who have an epidural, who mostly have a supine labour.

Interestingly, the Birthplace Study 2011 flagged up that healthy, low risk first time mothers who opt to labour in environments where epidurals are readily available have about double the rates of emergency c-section and instrumental deliveries when compared to the outcomes for similar low risk women who have chosen a setting for birth where access to an epidural requires transfer by road. The figures for mums having a second or subsequent baby are much starker - giving birth in a setting where epidurals are more readily accessible appears to increase the c-section rate by a factor of x 5 compared to similar healthy multiparous women giving birth in settings where access to epidurals require transfer.

It does leave me asking a question about how much higher rates of epidural use contribute towards much higher rates of c/s and assisted delivery in obstetric settings, and what other factors could contribute towards such a dramatic difference in outcomes.

Minifingers · 04/08/2015 11:02

"Epidural rates in France and the US are (far) higher than in the UK but their intervention rates are comparable or lower:"

French women are massively thinner than the UK, and on average significantly younger at first birth. They also have larger families, so a higher proportion of their births are to multiparous women. That makes a REALLY big difference to intervention rates.

The current US c-s rate is about 34%. The current rate of c-section in the UK is 26.6%. 60% of women in the US have and epidural compared to 30% of UK mothers.

Goldbluemagenta · 04/08/2015 11:14

I had epidurals for both my DC, luckily the ward wasn't too busy on those occasions, so they could administer it. I could still feel a slight sensation of my DD being born the normal way. For my DS it was a different matter, luckily I'd had the epidural because due to a minor complication, I had to go to theatre and they could get on with yanking him out quickly.

I have nothing but fond memories of my births due to lack of pain, despite complications not related to the epidural.

Goldbluemagenta · 04/08/2015 11:17

IMHO I thought at the time if 70% of French women have epidurals and there is pain relief then I'm definitely having it.

I don't regret it for a moment, and I'm delighted I don't associate pain with the birth of my DC. Esp as there were quite harrowing moments which I think I couldn't have coped with coupled with the pain.

Goldbluemagenta · 04/08/2015 11:26

You will need to wear a catheter and you will not be able to walk straight after so it's certainly not glamourous. But it works and is painless.

I did not plan for an epidural btw, I went into hospital with my birthing plan of a water birth.

I arrived at hospital, the water birth room was all arranged once I'd got there, then my DS was lying on a nerve causing me excruciating pain which took a while to work out it wasn't actually contractions, meanwhile I requested an epidural which I got and joy of joys the pain went and after a few complications my DS was born.

BeautifulBatman · 04/08/2015 11:29

I don't really want a big needle anywhere near my spine.... and as much as I don subscribe to the whole feel every movement movement, being totally without sensation during contractions is not what I want either.

VeryPunny · 04/08/2015 12:33

Minifingers - so it's obesity and age that causes complications, yet again NOT epidurals. Yes, they are factors which you may need to account for when choosing to have one but epidurals themselves do not cause complications!

thatsshallot · 04/08/2015 12:40

I had a nightmare 36 hour labour with ds - was fully dilated for 6 hours but he was stuck. I had had an epidural but it only worked partially, no urge to push, tremendous pain but unable to get off bed, even though I was desparate to move around and knew it would help. Ended up having drip with more than max dose of hormone meaning I developed (temp) heart problems and bled out v badly after delivery. DS finally born after ventouse at which point I collapsed. Worst bit was I was still in so much pain, and being on my back on my bed was the worst, DS was wedged in pelvic bone so pressure on back was immense.

Next two times I had only gas and air and could move around freely, labours much quicker, painful yes but all went according to plan, no excessive bleeding and the ability to move around made the most massive difference in terms of feeling in control and being able to move.

Would NEVER have epidural again, was amazed how easy pushing was when I could feel the urge, in fact was rather freaked out by the feral grunt and involuntary bearing down at first!

BUT - I know my experiences are likely unusual and most people rave about them, I have hypermobility and I know that makes me a more likely candidate for incomplete relief.

Branleuse · 04/08/2015 12:41

I had an epidural and pethidine and gas for ds1, and i didnt have any pain relief for the next two, and tbh, the unmedicated homebirths far topped my hospital medicated birth, and i recovered quicker, felt more in control and it was just much better than being on my back in a bed, numb, catheterised, threatened with a ventouse because i couldnt feel to push, and not being able to get up to walk and see my baby when he was taken to scbu.

Minifingers · 04/08/2015 12:57

"fingers - so it's obesity and age that causes complications, yet again NOT epidurals."

Lots of things contribute to more complicated labours, including, sometimes epidurals.

It's not crazy to speculate that a method of pain relief which interferes with movement, physical autonomy and sensation, might sometimes impact on a physiological process which sometimes necessitates vigorous physical effort and movement to complete without help.

AmberLav · 04/08/2015 13:01

I had a spinal block when I went into surgery to be sown up after a third degree tear, and I had no problem with that, as I knew I needed it. That had all the faff of needles, and catheters... Oh, and they insisted on leaving the catheter in all night, so it was in for about 20 hours, which I thought was very unnecessary...

However, I have no desire to ever have an epidural to give birth, as I do not need one...

I had a friend who went straight to the epidural as soon as she arrived at hospital, and she got the one in a million horrendous headache, where the anaesthesiologist pierced the back of the spinal column. She massively regrets having the epidural after 5 days of that, being unable to hold her baby, as she was in so much pain...

Lots of women have gone on to require forceps after an epidural, including another friend of mine who was sliced open by the forceps, and had to have a colostomy bag for 6 months after she delivered...

An epidural really helped my sister, as she's got a misaligned pelvis that doesn't dilate properly, but for me, why on earth would I want an epidural, when my TENS machine coped with the pain perfectly well...

stopeatingbiscuits · 04/08/2015 13:05

I have had two children, both without epidural. I wanted to feel my babies come out. I wanted to experience a natural birth.

I don't really understand the 'why wouldn't you?' mentality, I guess in the same way that others who have had them can't understand why one wouldn't.

Minifingers · 04/08/2015 13:05

The bottom line is - most women in most developed countries are cared for in environments (and according to protocols) which are hostile to normal birth physiology, regardless of whether they have an epidural.

In fact I'd go so far as to say that modern maternity care has made epidurals essential to large numbers of women. Labour is bad enough as it is. Extremely high rates of induction and augmentation, continuous monitoring, supine birth (50% of UK mums labour on their backs) overly busy hospitals, lack of continuous and 1 to 1 care - none of these things make an already difficult experience any easier. If we're going to carry on like this then we need to make epidurals truly available on demand in every maternity unit in the UK. Anything else is inhumane.

Minifingers · 04/08/2015 13:08

"as she arrived at hospital, and she got the one in a million horrendous headache"

1 in a 100, so not quite as rare as all that. Must have ruined the first few days with her baby...

Roseybee10 · 04/08/2015 13:12

Verypunny, forgive me but I'll also choose to ignore the research done by a 'random on the internet' then :-)

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