Breech baby - 34+4 feeling a bit :( about it

[MrsCog]

Hi everyone, I was just wondering if anyone could cheer me up a bit. I'm 34+4 with my 1st baby and all the way through pg have done A LOT of reading/research on labour etc. as I have been very fearful of it. Since about 30 weeks, I've really felt like I'd got my head around giving birth, I've written a short, non demanding, non expectant birth plan which I was happy with, and had started pernineal massage and listening to my hypnobirthing CD which were really helping me feel like 'I can do this and I don't need to be scared'. This combined with clearly understanding the pros and cons of various interventions had me feeling much better.

However, I have been waiting for weeks - or maybe forever for my baby to turn and he still hasn't. I know there's still quite a lot of time, but my focus has just gone as I now feel as though there's no certainty over what's going to happen over the next few weeks. I'm booked for a scan at 36 weeks and then the Consultant has said that they'll try and turn the baby which is fine.

I know I can get my head around having a cs if the baby doesn't turn, but I feel like the next few weeks were a key time for me to be keeping calm about the labour, diligently massaging/hypnoing etc. and now I can't because when I think about not having to go through labour now I just feel so sad :( but at the same time, I'm v anxious for the baby to be ok, and will be fine to have a CS if that's what's needed.

I've looked at the spinning babies website, but I find it a bit confusing - there seems to be so much advice and i don't know which bits of it I should be doing. I also looked for a moxibusionist, (is that what they're called?) but I can't find anyone in my area advertising that they do it, and all the appointments are £50 or more which I can't really afford.

Sorry, this is just a lot of waffle, but needed to let it all out! I'm going back to the lounge floor now to crawl around!

Ah, I sympathise as that was me nearly a year ago and the uncertainty is hard, I know what you mean. I spent weeks trying everything I could to make my baby turn, but in the end nothing worked and looking back on it I wish I had just tried to relax and enjoy the end of my pregnancy. I was almost looking forward to labour in a funny kind of way but terrified of a CS. I tried hanging upside-down off the sofa, all sorts of funny positions while watching telly, handstands in the swimming pool, moxibustion, and eventually an ECV, but my dd was stuck fast. My best advice would be to try to adopt a 'what will be will be' attitude (easy to say now!) oh, and to read books about babies! I got so wrapped up in the birth I almost forgot there was a baby at the end of it - perhaps try to shift your focus onto what you can control, e.g. how you care for your baby in the early days, preparing the baby's room, clothes etc.

Whatever happens you'll have a lovely new little person at the end of it and how they arrive won't really matter - that's how it was for me anyway. A CS isn't what I'd have chosen, but it got my wonderful dd into the world safe and well, and anyway being on a postnatal ward with people suffering after forceps deliveries etc. I realised that if I'd had a 'natural' labour it wouldn't necessarily have gone how I wanted.

Fingers crossed your baby turns, but whatever I wish you all the best.

I spent those weeks expecting to have an ecv or cs due to breech baby. I did bog all about changin the position of said child, thinking the cs would be an easier option. Darn child moved at 38 weeks then ended up with a cs anyway have contingency plans but don't focus on one part. Also some hospitals will let you have a breech birth, an ecv is uncomfortable i am told but can help and start labour too good luck, focus on relaxtion and que sera sera this is the last bit of piece you will have, enjoy your time and your baby will come and you will soon realise the birth is just a tiny part of your ds arrival to your family. Doesn't matter how he gets here but that he does safely.

However he comes in 6 weeks you will have a snuggly warm bundle to sniff. off on a dirty weekend with dh this weekend, perhaps he can be persuaded for no 3?

You know what? I think most people feel rather disappointed about some aspect of the birth of DC1.
I remember doing a birth plan and being totally focussed on the 'process'. I ended up with a totally different experience than I had visualised and a massive sense of disappointment.
Now 33+2 with DD3 ( breech and expecting CS) I have no birth plan. For DD2 I had no birth plan. Just as well. I have done instrumental delivery, induction, emergency section - none of which I wanted! Fab children though and I wouldn't change the experiences.

I know it's really difficult when you don't know what to expect but try not to focus on the process too much. Whatever gets your baby into the world in the safest way is how it will hopefully happen.
Good luck! :)

A friend of mine was told around 30 weeks her baby was breech but at the 37 week scan her little one had turned and is now head down! It can happen. Good luck :)

Thanks everyone, that's really helpful - especially on the focusing on when the baby is actually here. I hadn't really thought of that, but really the birth is only one tiny bit. And yes, I do feel that because of all the things you can try to get them to turn, I constantly feel like I should be 'doing something' rather than just relaxing and enjoying pregnancy. Will try a 'what will be will be' approach from tomorrow rather than hanging off the sofa, reading about moxibustion every hour of the day - if he's meant to turn he will if he's not he won't! :)

Both mine turned breech at 34 weeks and then were back head down by 35/36 although this current one is now back-to-back - but I'm past caring, he can do starjumps for all I care.

They all come out you know, whether in the style of your laminated birth plan or not.

Please try not to get hung up on one particular method of entry in to the world and please absolutely do not allow yourself to feel guilty if it doesn't happen the way you wanted it to. I went from a planned homebirth to an emcs - I regret nothing!

Fwiw, a friend was given (or at least they tried) an ECV at 38/39 weeks and found it incredibly painful and her daughter would not budge. Turned out her daughter couldn't turn due to a massive 4lb fibroid on her uterus. There's sometimes a reason for them doing what they do.

Have had two breech births, one feet first (undiagnosed, on bedroom floor, at home, totally wonderful paramedic), one bottom first in a hospital admission room. No pain relief at all (both very fast). They are now 24 and 17. Not saying that's ideal but the other end of the spectrum. With the second, the breech was diagnosed and the consultant asked me what I wanted. I definitely did not want the recovery period of 6 weeks, surgery etc. "Technology" can't solve everything, sometimes the body just gets on and does it. Hope all goes well, whatever happens.

I had a stubbornly transverse baby at that point. He turned head down (but back to back) around 37 weeks so it can happen.

Try bouncing on a birth ball, gentle inversions, spending time on your hands and knees, popping a bag of frozen peas and the top of your bump and a heat pad and the bottom and handstands in the swimming pool. Among that something worked for me.

It's bloody painful when they do turn though

DS1 was breech. I totally understand about the preparing for childbirth thing, I was told breech at 34wks, head down at 37wks and breech again at 39+3. It was really annoying having to change plans and expectations. Had an ECV but as it was so late on in pregnancy it didn't work and my waters broke 8 hours later, "emergency" CS 3 hours later. Firstly, I would say don't worry. There's a lot more scary and serious things that can happen and an elective CS due to breech really isn't scary or serious. You're still going to have a beautiful baby at the end of it (with a beautifully round head!). By all means try and do some turning positions but I wouldn't fork out for the moxibustion- I did and regret the money I spent when I could have spent it on other things for the baby or takeaways to relieve us of cooking! Most babies that are breech at your stage have turned by term so best wishes and don't worry- enjoy those weeks of chilling out on the sofa!

My ds was breech and turned at 38 weeks after I had spent the day painting the bathroom floor (although I'm not sure how much of it was down to that). I'd spent ages planning the birth in my head (in the pool, no drugs blah blah) but my MW told me I had to get my head around the fact I'd probably have to have a CS. I gave up the birthplan and concentrated on finding out as much as I could about CS then he goes and turns, refused to come out on time and had be yanked out.

Whatever happens, just concentrate on the thought of having your lovely baby here, how they arrive doesn't really matter. Good luck x

Why would you have a CS just for breech? The Hannah trial has been discredited - so the issues are around lack of experience of MW. Personally I'd wrote to the Supervisor of midwives stating my intention to have a breech birth vs breech delivery, quoting NICE or wherever it states breech is a normal presentation, request she gets a trained and experienced MW to be present. And I'd google Jane Evans 'Day at the Breech' and Mary Cronk.

Mary Cronk says CS for a non-progressing breech labour, and hands off kneeling position for progressing labour. Good luck!

My waters went 30 hours into induction process, and only 8 hours after that did someone have a sneaking suspicion that dd was breach. So I was told that it'd be an emcs ASAP. Not enjoyable and I do regret (if that's the right word?) not having a natural birth, but it got her here safely and that's what matters.

I had previously been told that I was fully engaged and that mw could touch her head etc, so it looks like she turned at the very last second!
FaithHopeandKevin I was told that emcs was my only option in that trust as they strongly recommend (I believe registrars words were "do not support or allow") first time mums do not deliver breech babies naturally...

Good luck, OP - babies are a law unto themselves, but hope everything works out for you.

MrsCog, you can still use breath/visualisation/relaxation techniques when you have a CS. Being able to relax, focus and maintain a positive frame of mind is beneficial whatever situation you are in. I've seen a few posts along the lines of 'now I have to have a CS, all that money I spent on yoga was wasted' - that doesn't have to be true. If your way of getting your head round a birth you were anxious about was to read up on the subject, why not do the same for CS?

I have a friend who's baby was breech until about 36 weeks. My baby was also back to back and turned during labour. You just don't know what the little monkeys are going to do! I would agree with everyone who suggests trying to focus on the outcome and not the process. No matter how the baby gets here you can still do things like your hypnobirthing to feel in control. Good luck!

Thanks everyoen for your responses, they've been really helpful, especially focusing on the baby. My main problem is the uncertainty, and what some of you said higher up the thread about not enjoying the last part of pg really rang true - I feel like I've been so embroiled in reading ofp advice, about moxibustion, swimming pooll headstands, trying to watch TV in really uncomfortable positions that I'm just miserable.

I know that breech doesn't necessarily mean CS - but until we know what type of breech (and of course he might have turned by 36 weeks when the scan is anyway) I don't know if I can investigate breech delivery options etc.

I hadn't really thought to keep the relaxation stuff up partly because my hypno CD goes on a lot about your cervix opening up like a flower - which I don't find v relaxing at all right now as my immediate thought is 'omg don't let that happen - the cord might prolapse!'. So I'm going to search itunes for some general relaxation rather than birth relaxation if you see what I mean.

We went on a hospital tour yesterday which I thought might help, but if anything it's made me more anxious, as I really really don't want to stay in hospital! I walked out in floods of tears - poor DH was annoyed as he thought it was nice (it is a nice unit - I'm just v scared of staying in a hospital - I want my own bed!) and was really excited and I was just incosolable. I think if the baby wasn't breech and I lived nearer to a hospital (I don't live v near) I would be having a HB.

DH is being nice, but tells me not to worry, which isn't very helpful, and he's not very tolerant of floods of hormonal pregnancy tears which is a bit :( because a lot of the time I just need a cuddle, but he just sees it as 'worrying' and tells me to stop worrying!

Has ECV been offered as an option?

My DD was only diagnosed breech around 37 weeks so I think I was over 38 weeks when we had the ECV which was successful and I went on to have a lovely home birth.

Please talk to your midwife about your fears and options.

Mrscog staying in hospital with a new baby is so completely different to seeing the hospital. Really, once lo arrives you aren't going to care one jot. I promise you. If you do end up with a elcs then take your own pillow, nice slippers etc and it won't be so bad. I promise.

With dd, I was in hospital prior to the birth, it was horrible and a completely different experience to post emcs. And I made sure I relaxed and got myself together in the hospital post cs, I only stayed 2 nights, the night she was born, the following night and then asked to be released as everything was fine with both her and I. So it wasn't too bad and although I flipped out because dh was late for visiting hours (new mother hormones!!!!!) it wasn't so bad.

Also if it helps, ds was in a different hospital and I really didn't want to stay but that was because I had dd at home, fortunately despite the cs previously I managed to have a vbac and yes for me it was a nicer experience - am not going to lie - however I am glad I had it that way round as I just wanted to get home then. But I would have been happy to stay if I had had to if that makes any sense!

First time births are excruciating - its the not knowing how it will all go, you have more time to build up your expectations as there is little to distract you but once they come you really do realise that you have only done a minor part of the whole experience, and although never really forgotten - the memory does become hazy .

Best advice - get in the ready meals in the freezer, stock up on stuff that is easy to cook and nutritious - oh and if you intend to bf - chocolate/biscuits and cake for treats . One of the best things to have on the go in the freezer is a filling soup (lentil of sorts is brilliant and nutritious whilst being low fat most of the time!) and as everyone says - save your money for nice m and s ready meals, you will appreciate them as that baby is going to come out regardless - he can't stay there so its pretty much in the hand of fate how he arrives.

Oh and with regards to a cuddle - men are so programmed not to realise what pg hormones do to you , you really need to point it out to him! And in the mean time, remember he is probably just as worried as you are about things but has really no control - not his body doing the hard work you see

Yes, going for scan at 36 weeks and if not head down will be offered an ECV at 37 weeks which I plan to accept.

I'm just going to try really hard to enjoy and relax for the next 2 weeks as a) apart from this I'm still really well in myself etc. and know how lucky I am to have had a straightforward pg so far and b) I could worry myself a lot and he might turn anyway without any interventions.

It's hard to relax though when you're constantly being told - get your bum up in the air, lie in a breech tilt etc, etc. as I think it makes you believe you are more responsible than you actually can be for your babies position!

The most important thing that you can do is relax so that your uterus is suitably relaxed and your baby can turn around inside.

Do you have a picture of the perfect birthing position for your baby? Find one on the internet and put a few copies of it around the house so that you see them regularly.
When you speak with your baby, ask him/her to move around to the optimum position. Explain to your baby the benefits of turning round.
Use affirmations regularly e.g. 'My baby is turning to the perfect position so that we may have the perfect birth'.
Visualise your baby turning and visualise your uterus being pliable so that baby will turn.
I'm not sure whether you have been on a HypnoBirthing course but if you have adapt a hypnosis script so that it tells you that your uterus is pliable and that your baby will turn.

I am a Certified HypnoBirthing Practitioner and only last week I helped a mum to turn her baby using hypnosis. If you look here: www.hypnobirthing.com/england.htm you may find a local practitioner who can help you.

I'm not sure if anyone answered the moxibustion question - you need an acupuncturist for this.

Best of luck!