Country specific attitudes to birthing choices

[DanceLikeTheWind]

I thought this might make an interesting discussion.

I posted a thread earlier about judgement towards c sections and there were lots of interesting replies.

Do you think this judgement towards birthing choices is country specific?
I've noticed that despite the high c section rates in America, women there are a lot more judgemental about c sections. We are still more accepting here in the UK. I always get the feeling from American women that they'd be happy to have CDMR banned completely. :(
I remember a poll where majority of them stated that they didn't think tokophobia was a reason to have a c section. They felt sexual abuse wasn't a good enough reason to have surgery either.
The reason given was that "VB is so not abuse" and "Can't tokophobics get therapy?"

Has anyone else noticed the same? Do you think attitudes towards c sections vary in different countries?

Bump

I think maybe that the attitudes in America may be different because of the way the maternity care system in America and the largely accepted over-medicalisation of childbirth there.
Maybe the more informed members of society are judgemental over the way the less informed just go along with all the interventions and are therefore being 'blamed' for the section.
And perhaps in the UK, as generally care is more evidence based than in the US then perhaps its more accepted that if a woman ends up with a section then she probably needed it?
Dunno really, just guessing.

Oh, and whats CDMR?

CDMR= Cesarean delivery on maternal request.

Elective, non medical c sections, or c sections done for mental health reasons are judged more in America IMO.

You're right WantsToBeMan:)

That's what I'm talking about. Tokophobia is less understood in the US and non- medical c sections are judged much more.

no idea about cdmr.

but i had a planned c-section in germany, almost an emergency c-section in canada, and should have had a c-section in scotland but wasn't allowed, and dd2 has brain damage as a result. yay the nhs.

anyway, c-section is the least interesting part about childbirth round the world ime. there are many many more interesting topics. pain relief customs vary hugely, and even after birth there are some very odd differences and cultural expectations.

despite the german system being the only one that gave me a cs, they are also the strongest advocates of homeopathy in labour (provided in the hospitals as a matter of course) and of stuffing your newborn with fennel tea to help them get over the trauma of childbirth. and compulsory sitzbaths with chamomile. and the biggest duvets you have ever seen piled on top of babies.

one of my fave threads on mn was the one which discussed the countries where babies are then invisible for months in polite society as they aren't allowed to leave the house. and the sheer horror on people's faces if you take your child outside.

In Italy. 60% of all births in the south are c-sections.

Not judged at all. except by me (and I want to underline I judge the doctors for promoting it not the women who think there is no alternative)

Birth and pregnancy are super highly medicated down here, and treated very much as a 9mth illness. People are genuinely surprised if you have a vaginal birth and everyone assumes you will have a c-section. In my British naivety I used to ask "oh, a c-section, why did you have one?" towhich people look vague and say "the doctor told me to"

It's apparently different in the north,but I'm not sure how much. Ithink down here, it's by and large a practicalconsideration (for the doctor obviously) Much easier to juggle your hours in the hospital and your verylucrative private practice if you know that Patient A is going to be giving birth at 9.30 on Monday morning rather than waiting for Patient A's body to decide.

In France CDMR is a battle, one I fought simultaneously with the 'you will have an epidural and every intervention going because 1st timers can never handle it and are all exhausted'. It's invasive and there's very much a feeling that they'll counsel you right up to the minute you go into labour so you'll think it's too late.

On the other hand EMCS is very common and ELCS clearly the mode of choice for breech. You can 'try' ECV if you want to and I chose my hospital because they always had someone experienced in breech VB (either MW or OB) rostered on, which to me seems a very sensible approach but then again getting experience of that is hard and the only reason all MWs here can handle them is because they sdometimes need to be helicoptered to inaccessible places to attend births. Yet elective HBs are practically illegal.

It's odd - you either get showered with sympathy for missing out on your epidural or told you're mad. None of the competitive birthing culture!

In Australia, midwife led birth is really rare. People with private insurance "go private" and have obstetricians in charge of them for the whole pregnancy and birth, which often involves a high level of intervention. Saying that though, my local midwife led birth centre is oversubscribed - you have to book in almost as soon as you have a positive test - and the facilities there for natural birth/water birth match anything I saw in the UK.
A friend with a fear of childbirth was approved for an ELCS without a problem at the same hospital. She had to give her reasons but no one tried to bully her into trying to do a VBAC.
C-section rate in Queensland is on a par with the UK - around the 30 % mark.
I have found people a bit judgey about me wanting to go without pain relief, but no one is really judgemental about either CS or VB.

This is all very interesting to read. Thanks everyone!

As for the high c section rate in certain countries, I have two points to make:

1. If women are being forced into them without proper informed consent, then it's appalling. it's as bad as forcing a VB on a woman who wants a CS and that too without giving her enough information.

1. If they are aware of the risks and opting for planned c sections or consenting to c sections over interventions like ventouse and forceps, then why is the higher c section rate wrong?

Secondly, why are hospitals criticised for offering c sections for slow moving labour? I for one would hate to be in labour for more than 20 hours. I'd expect an offer for a c section by then!
I understand some women want to try natural at all costs, in which case they should simply refuse. Or speak to their doctors in advance about their preference.

Obviously the US is a huge place but it contains many subcultures - and among my American friends (liberal, educated, non-religious if that matters) there is no real stigma around birth choices, just resigned acceptance that one big intervention might well be preferable to many small interventions. They accept there is next to no maternal choice, unless you count actively choosing a CS.