OBEM USA - more4

[BeeMyBaby]

Did anyone else watch ths last night at 9? If so could someone please explain why the lady (who did incredibly well for a fairly long labour) kept going into the shower?

I'm guessing it was for pain relief, as they didn't seem to have any other natural options available to her. Their attitude towards her was astounding I thought. Awful.

I thought she might be going in for privacy, buying a bit of time or to not have to listen to the awful crap the nurses were coming out with.

Will either of you watch Ep2? Not sure I can face it myself.

The whole programme was quite shocking really!

Vegas - not sure I'll bother with ep2. The programme just left me outraged, pleased for the more enlightened approach we have here, and glad I've just had my final baby!

I have it recorded as my Midwife said they do if totally differently out there so will report later.

I was talking to my American friend about it today. I knew that it was more medical over there but I was rather surprised at how much more medical it seemed to be after watching it.

She said that firstly, things vary a LOT from state to state.

Secondly we have to remember they don't do gas and air so for pain relief there isn't much of a middle ground, it is pretty much nothing or epidural.

Insurance quite often does not cover midwifery care, unless you can pay for it you have to do what your insurance covers which will tend to be a Dr/Ob and then hospital with the labour and delivery nurses (she isn't sure how they differ from a MW). Obviously this will tend to lead to a more medically minded birth.

She did say though that plenty of people she knows have had completely natural births. She has had a baby here and one other there but they both ended up being sections (for very valid reasons) so no personal comparisons about treatment in hospital! She did say that an IV is standard in hospital birth though which must reduce mobility rather a lot.

I have another American frined I've not talked about it with yet as she has moved back but she has had a baby in each country too, I believe her insurance covered midwifery care though and she gave birth in a birthing centre other there. I think that the insurance thing will really affect what sort of births we see on OBEM because those women who do have midwifery care will probably not tend to come into the hospital so where on the UK version we saw all sorts of women those on the USA version will tend to have seen Drs and not MWs through their pregnancy and I'm guessing this will affect their ideas on labour and pain relief.

I was almost raging at how the women were treated. Especially that one woman - they patronised her right from the off and laughed at her for wanting a natural birth.
I don't think I'll watch it again, just thinking back makes me want to cry.

I was really hoping I would see something that made The Business of Being Born seem sensationalist. The pretty much automatic use of synto was appalling.

The staff looking uncomfortable at the sounds of a woman labouring well was a bit telling.

Not sure if I will watch ep2, I think it did improve towards the end. I also didn't understand why the first lady had an epidural when she was about 9.5cm it seemed, I think this would never happen in the UK.

I promised I would keep my views to myself amongst my antenatal group but here I feel able to say that I was totally at the system and attitudes over there. I'm usually a very middle ground 'each to their own' kind of person but the whole programme just left me very sad.
Ok if a woman want a medicalised birth then she is perfectly free to have one without criticism, but equally if a woman wants a natural birth she should be treated with as much understanding and compassion. That poor woman having the natural birth and the lack of support she got from her nurse made me want to cry, thank goodness for her DH and her doula shletering her from it.

Do remember, this is TV - it's sensationalized on purpose. You can't watch this TV show and have any real understanding of what it's like to give birth in the USA.

Trans - of course not, I've combined my knowledge of birth in USA from many different programmes - 'OBEM USA', '16 & pregnant' and 'bringing home baby', so I am therefore an expert . To be fair they do all seem to end with women in stirrups.

haha, very funny :)

But to be fair, I bet you if the Americans watched our version of OBEM they would be equally horrified, for different reasons. Both systems have pros and cons.

Why, for example, do we not get access to the StrepB test on the NHS? Why do we have the highest stillborn birth rate of the developed world?

Personally that freaks me out more than the prospect of delivering my little one in stirrups!

"Both systems have pros and cons."

Yup. But our system here in the UK results in fewer deaths of mums and babies, despite the fact that the spend per mother is much, much less than in the US.

Yes, I believe the maternal mortality rate is much lower in the Uk than in the Us. However, it is even still lower in Canada where childbirth is relatively "medicalized" (more like the US) although they have free universal healthcare (more like the uk)

Also with regard to babies, according to the WHO:

Perinatal mortality rate (from 22 wks gestation to 7 days after birth)
Canada 6 in 1000
US. 7
UK. 8

Stillbirth (death before or during labour)
Canada. 3 in 1000
US. 4
UK. 5

Early neonatal mortality rate (first 7 days)
Canada. 3 in 1000
US. 4
UK. 3

Neonatal mortality rate (first 4 weeks)
Canada. 4 in 1000
US. 5
UK. 4

On that basis, I'm not entirely convinced that our midwife led care system CAUSES better outcomes. In Canada, you get consultant led care, yet their stats look much better and I have to wonder if there's another factor at play here, for example free universal health care?

If you are referring to a different source for your info I'm very open and keen to see it.

I gave birth the first time in the US.. arrived in triage 9cm dilated and was offered an epidural! Told them no thanks...

Wow ...okay, didn't think I'd ever write this but, having watched that, I understand why some people feel that they have to have an unassisted childbirth. I understand it's sensationalised but still ... nobody was putting words in the nurses' mouths. They did that all on their own.

Agree with Froze

or frozen perhaps.

well comments about that both systems have benefits are right. the people you see on the show selected to give birth like this because in us healthcare you have many options. and in regards to the couple wanting a natural birth did not discuss it with the doctor prior the birth, they just showed up with a birth plan and that is were the problems began, the nurse was not informed. If they spoke to the doctor prior they would of determined that the nurse must listen to the baby every 30 minutes and the nurse would of known that she just need to use a doppler. I am not sure if it was depicted in the show like this but they were not listening to the baby and it made the nurse nervous. The problem was in poor planning in my opinion prior to birth.
What they also did not show is an outstanding antenatal care that us provides. Not sure if anyone read posts by southrock few months ago who went to us and waters went at 28 weeks. She was cared for at the hospital until 34 weeks. here is the link www.mumsnet.com/Talk/pregnancy/1112721-Waters-have-broken-at-28-weeks-were-in-America/AllOnOnePage
now if she was in the uk (arguebly) that baby would of came out a day later straight into nicu.
i lived in us for 15 years and recently gave a birth in a nhs hospital. i had a wonderful water birth but i must say my antenatal care was borderline terrible... and some things in my birth should of been observed by a doctor such us 2nd degree tears and retained membranes to relief me of some problems later on. i guess the bottom line is there should be a balance.

on another thought, obem-uk does not depict the reality of birth in the uk either why should we belief what they are showing us in the us version?

I would have thought that the nurse in the programme had a professional duty to listen to the mother and to respect her wishes, no matter whether this had been 'okay'd' by a doctor or not. Nobody in the US or in the UK has an obligation to accept the treatment they're offered by healthcare professionals.

"in regards to the couple wanting a natural birth did not discuss it with the doctor prior the birth"

I'd say the problem was down to the fact that the vast majority of births in the US involve a huge amount of unnecessary routine interventions, which make it difficult for women to have normal labours. And this couple wanted to do things differently - which they had a perfect right to do. Had they come in with a pre-agreed birth plan outlining that they didn't want pain relief or other interventions, but then decided to change their minds, the nurse wouldn't have had a problem with that, would she?

i couldnt understand why all the women seemed to be having inductions? it all seemed really odd to me. I just watched it on catch up tv but possibly it was a mistake because it really upset me and Im due tomorrow....

Yes, what spud said really. Minimum intervention unless needed should be the default type of care but it seemed to be the other way round. Why should anyone have to pre-agree an natural, intervention-light birth in advance? That seems absolutely bonkers to me.

Agree that post-natal care here is dire but I have never heard about it in the US so can't compare. I doubt it could be worse

To answer your original question OP - it's to help with pain relief and can assist in moving your labour on as you are standing and hopefully moving in the shower. I had a shower in my delivery room when labouring and found it a tremendous help.

I actually hadn't watched the show before posting my comments above. As babynelly said, even the UK version doesn't depict the reality of childbirth and so I've been avoiding such programs so as not to scare myself sh*tless.

But I couldn't resist watching this episode on 4oD after reading this thread.

One thing no one mentioned is that the couple who wanted the natural childbirth actually turned up at the hospital to be induced. And they expected to be induced with almost no medical intervention! This I don't understand....

The other observation is that the nurse who came on the 2nd shift said that she herself had 2 natural births herself and wanted to support them. But it seemed to me that they were ignoring everything she suggested and kept going around in circles trying the same things over and over again. At one point the nurse suggested the mother lie on her side, and the father said no, she doesn't like being on her side. The nurse then said she probably didn't like it because it was effective, which I can see how that could have come across as a bit narky... but to be honest, I just don't understand why they weren't willing to give this position a go. It was almost as if they decided the nurse was the enemy, and they only listened to what their doula or nurse-midwife said.

third observation, is that their birth doula was cr*p. She did nothing to help the couple and nurse work & communicate together for the best possible outcome.

So in short, I think that this particular couple were being very unrealistic about their birth plan from the outset.

I think if I had to have one of the three births featured, I would go with the first couple. Yes, there was a lot of medical intervention involved, and probably more than I would personally choose, but omg it went so smoothly and seemed like a rather pleasant way to give birth by comparison.

gothmummy I think that maybe there were so many inductions because when filming for telly, it's easier to get consent to film & be present when you know the time and date of the birth in advance.

Indicientally, after I watched this program, I watched one episode of the British version. Guess what. Two caesareans. If I were American I might be fooled into thinking all British women are too posh to push!