Best Twins consultant at St. Georges

[bubbahubba]

Hi ladies
Does anyone know who the 'best' twins consultant is at St. Georges Hospital in Tooting?
I have been told that I will need to labour in theatre just in case and I'm very unhappy about this. I am going to try and speak to a supervisor of midwives too.
Any suggestions?
Thx

Hi Bubbahubba,
I'm in a similar situation to you. Now 34 weeks pregnant with twins and due to deliver at St. Georges. I am due to meet with the consultant next week following my 35wk scan and will discuss this then, as I have written in my birth plan that I don't want to deliver in theatre. Besides, the delivery rooms are only seconds away from the theatres so it's not like they couldn't get you there quickly if need be. We'll see how it goes. My Doula did some investigating and says that 'Basky' is usually the main twins consultant, (I've come across him previously and he is wonderful), but I've been assigned to Samina Mahsud-Dornan and reckon I will give her a go and see how far I get. I think so much of what is presented as 'policy' is possibly negotiable, but we'll see. I was recommended to speak to a supervisor of midwives too, but haven't done so as yet. Would like to know how you get on. Good luck!
Jules

Thanks jules
I've met with and am under Samina...don't like her. She promises things but won't put them in writing so makes me doubt her BIG TIME!
I am due mid-december but think I might be opting to go to the birthing centre or a homebirth as the hospital isn't giving me any confidence at all...how the hell to they expect me to progress with hundreds of people in the room, let alone labouring in theatre...honestly. they just want to get their knives out and c-section me!
There is also no way i am going to be induced either....i've seen what its done to my friends and their bbies.
I am meeting with independent midwives to see if anyone will take me on. two are happpy to.
sorr to put a dampner on this post.

Oh Lordy - don't hold out much hope for me on Tuesday then. Did you get to speak to a supervisor of midwives at all? Think I might try and do that on Monday then. Did you also ask about the possibility of changing consultants?
Are your twins sharing a placenta or separate (mine are the latter - 2 sacs, 2 placentas, but they are still saying to deliver in theatre)?
Good luck with the independent midwives and hope you can get the results you want.
Jules

Yes, I did and they were great, but i think it's for my own confidence that I need to go with an independent midwife...yet to find one though - they are all fully booked - such a shame i am leaving this till the last minute.
If i cant find one i am going to go for a homebirth and if i have to be transferred to hospital, I will totally be dictating who and what and where in hospital. i'm not having them interfere. I've been waiting for these babies for soooooo long and I can bloody well do it nd need to optimise this natural process!

i've got another appointmet with the supervisor of midwives and head of midwifery on wednesday next week. need to get things in place asap so I can focus on me and my babies!
as far as changing consultants...i'm probably nt going to - don't want them in the room and dictating to me so don' feel they will have any input into my birth unless medically necessary.

I'm not having continual foetal monitoring at all (unless for some reason i opt for an epidural). I really want to labour in a pool, hence going for a home birth as there is no chance of that happening in a hospital.
I've also just hired a wondeful doula and she is totally supporting me which is just what i need.

my twins are non-identical - separate sacs and placentas.

how are you doing? would you not consider a homebirth? what are YOU wanting? (not what doctors / midwives have told you to have)

PS: so glad you found me on this....we can both go through this experience together...you have to keep in touch with me throughout ok? :-)

Sorry, only just seen your replies. New to Mumsnet and just worked out how to watch the thread etc....
I feel very much like you that I don't want to labour in theatre, don't want anyone at delivery except midwives, my partner and my doula, don't want to be offered pain relief (will ask for it if I need it), don't want continual monitoring.....I have written all of this into my birth plan and will see how it is received at my appointment tomorrow. (Am really waiting until then as I have my 35 week scan first, which I guess may determine quite a bit about the delivery - hoping babies are still in a good position for VG birth). Not so fussed personally about the pool, so am willing to forego that although I will ask....(was told previously - during our antenatal classes - that this was not an option for twin births at St. Georges).
Good to know you had a good discussion with the midwife supervisors. I will definitely go this route if I don't get very far tomorrow - or perhaps even if I do. After all, they are the ones that will be involved in the birth, as you say, not the consultant or community midwives.
Glad you've got a doula. Think ours is going to be a great support too. Good luck with finding an independent midwife - yes, I know it can be tricky at this time of year to find someone available - I had trouble initially finding a doula.
I didn't really ever consider a homebirth. Not sure why. Like you,we've waited an awfully long time for these babies and been through a tough journey to get here, so I also want the birthing experience to be the best it can be (for all of us), but I'm also getting on a bit (!) and, whilst I want as little intervention as possible, also like the idea of all the back-up being there for us if we really need it. Just a personal thing and hope that makes sense? Have heard about some wonderful experiences of this 'though so hope you can sort this out if this is what you want.
Happy for us to keep in touch! Is your mid-December 'due' date 38 weeks or 40 - ie. how many weeks are you now?

Best of luck

Jules x

Hey Jules
Thanks for the reply. Mumsnet gets addictive!

I think it depends on how ou feel about everything. yes sure, you don't want any intervention (or as little as possible) but they can slowly but surely push you to do things with scare tactics and when you are at your most vulnerable and this is what I want to sort out before hand...i.e. don't you dare try and scre me just for the sake if making things easier for you!
I agree with labouring in the hospital - i'm all up for it but don't want hundreds of people watching me and interferring. I can bloody do this. I haven't spent 9 months preparing myself and being positive for you to break me down in a few mins....those are the types of people i odn't want.

I am 40 weeks on 24 December.

I'm really praying i go into spontaneous labour before hand. i don't mind having a christmas baby a all - i just don't want to be induced.

Let mek now how your appointment goes and I will do the the same
x

Hi.
How was your appointment and howare you feeling?

I've got mine tomorrow with e supervisor of midwives

Hi,
Wow, we are really pretty much in tandem - my 40 weeks due date is 22nd Dec!

So, yesterday started off well with a scan showing that both babies doing well, both with estimated weights of over 5lbs, which is great.

However, have to say that the consultant appointment was a total nightmare - I didn't like her either. She said some incredible things to me - and, as you say, seemed to be trying to scare the life out of me (by mentioning 'death' on several occasions) into agreeing to her 'protocol' - despite claiming she was 'my friend'! In the end, I think we managed to reach some compromise on a couple of issues and she wrote in my notes that midwives etc should stick to my birth plan where possible (and this could be discussed with the senior midwife on the day), but I left the appointment feeling pretty upset and frustrated.

We had quite a conversation about the induction, as they've booked me in for this on 7th Dec (37+6). I'm going to see how things go until then and make a decision on this nearer the time as, like you, I really don't want to be induced unless my body is ready for it and am hoping babies make an appearance (just) before then, to avoid it. I have a midwife appointment on 1st Dec, so can see where we are then.

Hope your appointment goes well today. Do let me know how you get on.

Jules x

Hi
Oh wow, yes we are very close!!!!

Great that both babies are over 5lbs! well done you. super super!

I'm so sorry to hear that you had the same experience with the consultant. I was really holding out that yours would be different.

When they throw the word 'death' into thing, they know that they can get you to do whatever they want you to do with their scaring tactics and it is bloody bullying! I am definitely going to write a letter of complaint to the RCOG (www.rcog.org.uk) at the end of this as I'm sorry, it's just not bloody acceptable. Of course we need to know the the risks and benefits but to constantly be negative and bully is just not right.

Are you goin to go for the induction on the 7th? I'm doing acupuncture and reflexology to help my body get ready and will definitely just wait for my babies to do their thing unless it is a emergency.
How is your partner feeling about everything?

My husband and I have spoken at length and he knows that he will stand up for me and suppot me nomatter what. You have a dula which is great too.

My meetng with the supervisor was definitely better than that with the consultant but still they are very cautious.
No luck for me in the Ind MW front unfortunately but I am going to stay t home for as long as I can.

are you feeling wll in yourself? when is your next scan?

I have my usual 2 weekly appointments and then will go in once a week or maybe twice a week but Ive told them not to discuss an induction date with me. I'm not having tht same conversation every time I go into the hospital. They can tell me how everything is with the babies and give me information but no bullying. I've actually typed up a piece of paper and stapled it into my notes on the front page to say this. I am going to meet with the supervisor of midwives again to get her print on the paper for extra clout!

My doula is also on my side and i think the 3 of us will work really well together.

if and when I go into hospital (hopefully near the end), i've agreed on a canula but that is it. I will definitely NOT be having continual monitoring and no drip (again, unless i choose). Obviously if it all goes tits up and I have an epidural, then fine, it will be fairly managed so I will have to hand some things over, but if everyting is working on it's on, they are to be totally HANDS OFF.

I also believe that waters can go first with twins, so I will also be waiting for contractions to start on their own and not going straight in to be induced. I think the old NICE guidelines were to wait 90 hours or something so I wil see and have reflexology to help things along if needed. I'm all up for natural "induction" methods.
I will get monitored once a day if my waters go but that is it.

What are your strong views on certain things? i.e. what do you / don't you want?

hi my twins are 16 months now, had home births for other dc's and I really wanted one with the twins, I couldn'nt have afforded an independent midwife though.

I a wonderful meeting with the head of midwifery about my birth plan she also got the twin consultant to agree and sign it.
It was honestly worth its weight in gold, I am sure I wouldn't have had such a positive experience without it.

I was induced at 38 weeks after a scan showed very low fluid in one twins sack,
I had one pessary then went into labour a few hours later which lasted about 2 and half hours.
I had no continuous monitoring although agreed to have a couple of short monitoring sessions, about ten mins each. I didn't want my waters broken.
I agreed to a cannular in my hand but no drip, I remained on my feet till the pushing stage,
I also asked for no holding or movement of the second twin.

Dt1 was born just after his waters and dt2 came out 9mins later in his bag of water
I still would have loved a home birth but it was a good compromise.

Also I had an extra birth partner my friend who's sole job was to keep to my birth plan and take notes and photos throughout, this left my dp free to mop my brow

Hope that's helpful, goodluck

that's amazing largeglassofred!

What hospital did you give birth in? St. Georges?

I've only seen supervisor of midwives but i'm going to make a call to the head of midwifery on monday.
I suppose you had the benefit of having birthed before but that isnt a huge issue for me.

Congratuations. yu have given me new hope!

Ah glad I've given you hope, stick to your guns and get anything agreed in writing.

I gave birth in Gloucester, but I think they all have the same guild lines.

I also think reading lots helps and talking to other twin mums, I went along to a local twins club when I was pregnant which was also really helpful.

Thanks for sharing your positive experience LargeGlassofRed; this gives us all hope that we will have the birth we wish for.

Bubbahubba, glad your appointment with the supervisor of midwives went ok. I think I might give them a call next week just to voice my concerns, but I do feel now that I should be able to get most of what I want on the day (if it's possible of course) - like you, with my doula and partner in my corner.

I'm hoping to be able to avoid the induction too and I've also been having acupuncture and have booked in for the next 2 weeks to start working on induction that way if they haven't made an appearance by then. I'm keen that my body is ready for induction rather than it potentially going on for 3 days or something and then still ending up having a caesarian, which I know can happen. Have you heard of something called the Bishops Score? There's some good information on this here: docs.google.com/viewer?url=www.mybirthbydesign.com/Bishop%2527s%2520Score.pdf (actually lots of useful info on the main website: www.mybirthbydesign.com) I think we will try to use this at least if we do end up thinking about induction...for now I've left it that we'll see how it goes and I will make a decision nearer the time.

I don't have any further scans booked - just a midwife appointment on 1st Dec). Babies are in the same position as they have been since 21 week scan with Baby 1 head down and presenting and Baby 2 in breech - and seems unlikely they will turn now as they don't have a lot of room left! So, they're happy to go for vaginal birth and deliver Baby 2 in breech (so they say).

In essence I want the same as you - minimal monitoring and interference and I think we should be able to go with this. What seemed non-negotiable was delivery in theatre (although they've agreed to keep people present to a minimum) and the cannula.

Hope you have a great weekend. We're trying to fit in some last minute treats (theatre, cinema etc), as I reckon from next week I'm gonna be feeling too tired to do much. Have to say though that to date I seem to have had the perfect pregnancy, with absolutely no complications and i've only put on around 30lbs so it's all baby! (Which kind of blows the dear consultant's comments about my age etc out of the water, I feel, silly moo....!) Just praying it will continue. How are you feeling?

Jules x

Jules, i bet the head of midwifery won't believe what has hit her with both of us trying to make an appointment with her with almost exactly the same due date!!! LOL!!!

I would definitely go in and see the Head of Midwifery, don't just call. They need to see you. Take your doula with too. Mine was very helpful.

Thanks for the bishops score info - really good- anothr thing I'm going to print out and put in my folder.

I asked Samina whether she would be happy for me to have a vaginal birth if twin 2 was breech and she said that she loves breech babies as you can just grab their legs an pull them out! WHAT???? ARe you kidding me. Has she never heard "hands off the breech"???? She is bloody not yanking my child out of me thank you!

www.aims.org.uk/Journal/Vol10No3/handOffbreech.htm

www.aims.org.uk/Journal/Vol17No1/handsOff.htm

www.homebirth.org.uk/marycronk/marytwins.htm GREAT WOMAN

I think that if i meet with Samina again, I'm going to use some of these from Mary Cronk:
www.homebirth.org.uk/marycronkphrases.htm

I do think that when we arrive at the hospital, my husband is going to hand over the birth plan and re-emphasise the things that are really important to me:
no continual monitoring
active labour
only one or two people in the room
hands off
not going to theatre (hence why i want another appointment with samina). I feel that with her wanting me in theatre means that she is not confident in twins births, which really actually scares me because she is the twins "specialist consultant"

I'm relaxing this weekend as I'm really feeling exhausted at the moment and not sleeping too well.

enjoy yours too. what you going to see?

xxxxxxxxx

Jules - how you getting on?
youve been a bit quiet so i'm wondering whether you have had those two little babies of yours?
I do hope you will come back and let me know although i'm sure you have got your hands full!

Sorry bubbahubba. Meant to reply earlier. No, twinnies haven't made an appearance as yet although I'm feeling increasingly stretched and uncomfortable so sure they're not far off!
I haven't been in touch with the Head of Midwives, but apparently my doula has. She was supposed to come around tonight but had to delay until tomorrow due to one of her other ladies going into labour. Can't wait to hear what she has to say though, as it sounded very positive. Will keep you posted.
How are things with you?

Jules x

Oooooh, I was getting a little bit jealous as I thought your little ones had arrived. Never mind, the longer they re in the better ey?!
Do get in touch with the head of midwives yourself..honestly, it will be the best thing for you and your babies as samina is just awful.

do let me know what your doula has to say!!! hw excitig.

i'm ok. just a few aches and pains and awfully awfully tired. The nights are a bit difficult but come 7am when hubby goes off to work, i just die for the next 3 / 4 hours which is bliss and then i still have to have an aftenoon nap on the couch too. trying to make the most of any time i can get to sleep at the moment.

i've got an appointment next Wed - they think for induction but that is definitely not going to happen, no matter what they say regarding amniotic fluid levels / placenta etc. unless they can totally prove things - might see you there ey?

Hi bubbahubba
Sorry for delay in responding. I'm still cooking...how are you doing?
Well, my doula apparently had quite a positive conversation with the HOM, but was waiting for her to get back to her with some information. She suggested I call her too, however, so I did this on Friday morning, but she was about to go into a meeting. She said she still wanted to talk to the consultant (Samina) and then to another consultant - suggestion seemed to be that she was looking at changing me, but I'm not sure that this is what I want at this late stage. Really just want to know that the midwives are essentially on board. Anyway, she said she'd call me back either Friday or Monday, but as yet I've not had a call. So, will just see if anything transpires at my midwife appointment tomorrow. Mine is at 10.30am - maybe see you there? Are you booked in for induction tomorrow then? Isn't that a little early?

Let me know how you get on.

Jules x

howdy jules
no - definitely not booked in for an induction. Just going for check up.
i totally agree re: not changing consultants - just a hassel - as long as ou got all th midwives on your side and you are confident then that's great.

my appointment is at 11.30 - might see you there - i've got long brown hair - normally wear in a pony tail. Red coat and name is Rebecca

Hey Rebecca,
Well my appointment was cancelled today, as Joeann was sick - presume yours possibly was too?
A bit narked actually as I'd rushed to get ready and was just on my way out the door when they called. They said Joeann will call next week to reschedule. I said that might be a bit late as I was currently 37 weeks with twins and scheduled to be induced next Tuesday...... So much for all this 'high risk pregnancy' stuff - seems it's only high risk when it suits them! Not sure whether to follow this up or just leave it. Still no word from HOM and actually feeling a bit beaten down by it all now!
Hope things are brighter with you.
Jules x

hi Jules
Yes, mine was cancelled too. I however didn't get a call until i was at the hospital! SO ANNOYING!

So, what are you going to do? That's a real shame that the HOM hasn't got back to you - quite slack actually. I'm sure you are exhausted and don'treally want to chase. can your partner not do that or you just going to leave it?
are you going in to be induced on tuesday or just going to go in for checks? are you worried about them being born close to christmas if you leave it?
I was a bit worried about that, but I didn't feel that was a justified reason to be induced. I'm a really really really uncomfortable and battling to sleep etc. but i'm going for reflexology and acupuncture and just itting tight for now. I do feel like a moaning old cow to my poor husband. Nothing is right and i ache and am in pain etc. at the end of the day when he gets home but we keep reminding each oter that this is normal and not forever.
Will go in on tuesday for usual chcks etc. but that's it.

hang in there chickie! you can do this. Not long to go now. We are both going to have our babies really soon.

Hey Rebecca,

So, went in for midwife check yesterday afternoon. Had to wait ages, but midwife (one of others - not twin specific) was lovely when we did get to see her and everything fine. Had to make final decision on induction and decided we would go with it today. Not thrilled about the decision (and I was paining over it for some time), but am also now really uncomfortable with lots of abdominal pain and just hoping this means I'm close and that the induction will be quick (probably not!).
Was supposed to go in at 8am today, but when I called kept getting pushed back and have now been told to go in at 2pm - but to the 4th floor first, so that they can 'check my babies', as they are very busy in delivery.... So I see a very long wait ahead for us! Ah well, trying to stay positive and just hoping it will be ok. Hoping I won't regret this decision and trying not to beat myself up about it. Keep your fingers crossed for me!

Hope your checks go well today and that your babies make an appearance soon of their own accord. May see you in delivery or on the ward soon!

Jules x

Jules!!!!

How are you doing????? What did you have??? How did it go????

Sorry I haven't been in touch, but as I'm sure you DEFINITELY know, life is HECTIC!!!!!

Anyway, I had my babies!!!!!!!! 1 boy and 1 girl and I am exhausted but thrilled.

I had a show on the 23rd of December with a few mild period cramps that day. That evening I started getting contractions around 8pm. My doula came over shortly afterwards (what a blessing she was the whole way through).
I called the hospital who said to come in straight away so they could monitor. NO WAY I said. I wanted to get prooperly established first.
Around midnight, my contractions were coming every 2 - 3 mins. We transferred in. There was a mad panic amongst the midwives/doctors as they couldn't elieve i did this all at thome.
My hubby had strict instructions to keep them al away from me and only have 1 MW in the room. He did just that. We had a lovely MW and I laboured on all fours on the fall. F the contractions were painful and full on but I just kept focussing on the end result.

Anyway, at 2.02am on Christmas eve, my little boy Aidan was born onto the mat with just me, my hubby, my doula and the MW present. I couldn't stop crying and laughing at the same time. He was put right on my chest and he was just beautiful.
The midwife wanted another miwif and an registrar in the room which I allowed. They wanted to take me to theatre and I told them tat I was having my baby here and they had better just shut up.
they scanned me to see the baby's lie which was still breech. All fine. I just asked for some time alone to cuddle Aidan and to let him feed which he did after about 10mins. My contractions started pretty immediately. I had to take him off my boob and get onto all fours again. (They wanted me flat on my back and to yank her out! NO WAY). Anyway, Poppy was born at 2.17am - feet first! Amazing.
The midwives and registrar couldn't believe that I did it. I was so proud of myself actually. I sat on the mat for about an hour waiting for the placentas to come, which they did without any injections.

I had a little tear that I chose not to be stitched (again, they couldn't believe it). My babies weighed 6lb 14oz (Aidan) and 6lb 10oz (Poppy).

Both babies stayed in bed with me the entire nght and we discharged ourselves around 11am he next day. The hospital wanted to keep me in but there was no valid reason for this.

Feeding has been hard (every 2 hours) but I've kept them in bed with me all the time and they are thriving. I'm loving every moment of being with them, even when the nights are hard.
Don't get me wrong, there hve been tears and moments of "i can't do this", but my doula has been great in supporting me and keeping me focussed. I don't think I would've go the hhang of brestfeeding if it wasn't for her.

I'm really hoping you will check this and letme know how your birth was. I'v thought about you and your babies every day. Sorry I haven't got on earlier to let you know.

Speak soon