self harm - should I take the "tools" away?

[vivariumvivariumsvivaria]

DD15 has been self harming for about a year - I've known for 4 months.

GP wanted to refer her to CAMHS, she refused, said she'd stopped. And, I think she did for a while.

Caught her at it the other night. She assures me the wounds are small, I don't know for sure as she won't show me them, but, there isn't blood on the inside of her clothes. I made her give me the razor I knew she had in her wallet, she gave it up without any fuss. We agreed she'd have to go back to GP and see a counsellor.

However, I know she has other razors hidden. Do I take those away, or leave them? I can't decide whether making it harder for her to do it is a good thing, or whether letting her keep her "safety blanket" is better.

Advice online is unclear.

Anyone got experience?

If you take her tools away, she's likely to find other, less 'safe' ways to self harm, I would make sure that she has access to first aid supplies and an open invitation to speak to you openly, which it sounds like she does have.

As someone who self harmed from the age of 11, please try not to make her feel crazy or guilty for doing so, or talk about how 'you'll regret those ugly scars later in life', as my mum did. You sound a lot more understanding than she was.

Self harm is a symptom of something bigger, stopping her doing it (If that's even possible without monitoring her 24/7) is just putting a bandaid on a gaping wound. I'm not saying to give her free reign or just ignore that it's happening, but let her agree to seek help in her own time, it's a scary thing at that age. I suggest doing an activity together regularly like baking or walking, I always felt more able to talk to my mum about how I was feeling when there was less pressure than just sitting down and having 'a talk'.

I hope this helps somewhat, I feel for any teen going through that.

Doesn't matter how much you take them away, they will find ways to do it. You need to get her to cahms and engage with them to help. It's a long road ahead.

First ((hug)).
Remember that the self harming is a form of release. For a moment it makes them feel better.

Telling them to stop won't help. They still need the release. CAMHS won't ask her to stop. They'll offer both of you counselling (not together) about how to cope and what to do. I was advised to focus on making sure that my child was safe. I had to emphasize the risks; provide antiseptic wipes, plasters etc and leave them to it. It was very very hard. But: actually laying out the risks in this way to my DC did help. We switched from cutting to snapping (elastic band on the wrist) to sprinting. Even now, at 19, when things get too much my DC pulls on running shoes and sprints out of the house: all hours, all weathers, usually back within 10 minutes when whatever the worry was has released.
Your DD at 15 is all about self-absorption and has no idea of the long term impact on herself or the short term impact on you. All you can do is keep your cool and help them to wean themselves off the dangerous behaviours.
good luck

At 15 if you take away the "safe" tools she is using she is likely to find something else. Like a knife or something sharper (or just more razors)

I would focus on the other ways you can support her, and make it clear that she can talk to you and that you are not going to punish her by babying her and not trusting her with a razor

I used to self harm using a variety of methods haven't in many years. I didn't deal with the underlying causes and this lead to a series of overdoses and worsening self harm (I hid it and wouldn't talk about it)
Getting honest about my behaviour was the first step and I am very fortunate that my DCs have never had to witness me self harm or attempt suicide. But that could only happen when I was first honest, and second learnt to trust myself.
As an adult it was not possible to remove the items and I had nobody to stop me. So I needed to be the person that stopped me. I would not have been able to do that without counselling and therapy, and ultimately medication too at times.

Some people think the answer to self harming is to take away the razors. Likewise people think they need to remove alcohol from the house if someone has a drinking problem. But you can't remove all temptations in life. Ultimately self harmers have to learn that they can have a razor without cutting, just as alcoholics have to learn to avoid drinking alcohol even when it's present.

Hopefully if she can be honest with you and/or a counsellor/therapist she can become accountable to you and to herself. The ideal situation would for her to be able to come to you and say "I need you to look after the razors tonight because I am worried I might cut" and eventually "I thought about cutting, but you don't need to take the razors away because I do not have to act on that thought"
Those are the stages to finally cutting just not being an option anymore.

Invading her privacy by taking these items and "looking" at and/or for cuts will just make her worse. My parents used to check my arms etc. So I just cut where they could not see- like my boobs and hip bones and inside my thighs. I know lots of other women who live with scars in these places for the same reasons.

Sorry bit of a x post

This is great, thank you very much for the advice.

She is a very capable, articulate, bright, funny kid. She says she "doesn't know" why she's doing it. Bit worried about exams, but she's not able to say (or willing to say) what it is that's troubling her.

I'm trying really hard to protect her privacy. I did have a snoop, which is why I know there's razors and bandages hidden in her room. She doesn't know I know, am keeping an eye on how many vanish to try and gauge how she is feeling.

Ok, so, GP and find her counselling and see how it goes.

Great idea about first aid pack. There is one downstairs but I'll make her a proper wee bag for her bedroom. Also about her asking me to keep the razors. I'm trying to keep her busy, but she needs down time too.

I abused food at that age. Still do. I really don't want her to land up struggling with her mood into adulthood, it's just no fun.

Thanks for the insight, I really appreciate it.

Ditto all the others have said. I will add to make sure you have support for you so you can support your DD.

I recommend if she will do it with you, making a coping box. myjourneywithdepression.wordpress.com/2014/02/02/how-to-create-a-self-harm-safety-box/

A safety plan

Potentially a signal, like a couple of cards in different colours where she wants company but doesnt necessarily want to talk - then you do absolutely anything together except talk, you aren't applying pressure which means long term she is more likely to come to you and open up

red - could be Im in danger of SH
orange - im getting close to
green - Im feeling ok

Make a safety plan to try and help, show her you want her to be safe.

Also, provide a first aid kit with the promise of when needed extra supplies or help if needed, calm supportive parent when you might feel anything but calm

Hold on in there, encourage CAMHs appointment and GP as well to check over any wounds etc to make sure of no infections,

Come on here for support for yourself too x

Is she feels something is infected or needs to be checked, offer to facilitate a trip to Drs (maybe a lift if rural, outside of bus times)

for you and a supportive hug

I’m so Sorry op, as another previous self harmer don’t take the tools away my parents took to insisting on inspecting my arms/legs, searching my room etc. It didn’t help infact I took to hurting myself with anything I could get my hands on and when that wasn’t possible I starved myself instead. Instead let her know you’re not judging, get her to the gp and insist on a cahms referral I hated my parents at the time for insisting on a therapist but in hindsite that saved my life and I got through it and have made it to adulthood fully recovered. Will be thinking of your daughter tonight

Im going to assume as a teenager she texts, how about a crisis service for under 25s, its trained volunteers and its free and entirely appropriate for self harm

www.themix.org.uk/get-support/speak-to-our-team/crisis-messenger

This is all so helpful, thank you.

She'd given me a razor out the back of her clock - I checked the same place, and there's another, rusty one.

So, yesterday I trapped her in the car and had a chat about it. She denies doing it, says "don't snoop" and that she's fine. I said "fair enough about the snooping, but, I checked your clock and found that you are lying to me. So, I am worried that you are lying about other stuff too."

She's articulate and we were able to have a good chat without falling out. Agreed that I want her to see someone, but, she doesn't. I suggested the text crisis service, she says she doesn't need it. Stalemate.

Then, this morning, her dad found a tissue in the loo spotted with blood. So, I collared her in her bedroom and asked. She showed me her arm, it's pretty bad. There's only about 8 marks, but ,they have clearly been deep and are now purple and raised scars. One from last week that should have had steri-strip. Nothing new, which was "evidence" that it wasn't her and maybe it was someone having a nose bleed. Maybe it was.

We agreed that this is no way to live, me worrying about her, her lying and us being unable to sort a problem.

"You're not in trouble, this is a symptom of you being unhappy and you need to learn to manage unhappiness without hurting yourself, that's all" I gave her a hug and said to her that she is mine and that means we sort anything out, that nothing is a problem that can't be solved.

She sort of agreed to speak to the counsellor at school after I said that I'd like to go and see her because I'm worried I'm making things worse.

It's so sad. Parenting is wanting to make it better for them, isn't it? I'm sad that I haven't been able to do that.

So, time to outsource and find her support.

Thanks for giving me some. x

When my daughter first started self-harming and was refusing to see a counsellor I went to see one myself instead. It did help me to be less emotional about it and to just provide first aid and eventually (as the counsellor had predicted) my daughter asked to see one herself.

Thanks, Roseau, and yes, I think that's probably where I'm at.

Happily, she agreed to speak to the "pupil support officer" that they have just put in place at school. She has a CAMHS background, and lots of experience - we chatted on the phone and she was reassuring that I'm doing the right sort of thing.

She is going to speak to DD tomorrow, with her consent. The PSO was good enough to offer to share what DD says, but, I said to let her talk freely and in confidence, only to let me now if she thought there was something I needed to know from a serious risk point of view.

We'll see what tomorrow brings, then.

Glad your daughter agreed to help.

Wow such a helpful thread! I like the box ideas and things to do first. My dd (14) cut herself on fri but only told school today because she was worrying that it wasn’t healing (it should have been stitched) so with her permission they rang me.

Currently getting divorced and lots of issues here but self harm is so out of my sphere of experience. I think she really scared herself.

Thanks for all your advice.

There is an app called calm harm which can help with various distractions and coping strategies when someone is in a place where they feel like harming themselves.

It's a minefield, Gremlin. Sorry she missed having treatment - my DD has a couple of those too. They are permanent scars, I expect she'll get a tattoo at some point to cover them up.

She showed me one forearm the other day. I am developing a great poker face. What I want to do is cuddle her and never let her go. I'm heart broken, she's so beautiful and she has really hurt herself and will be left with permanent marks.

I've just had a snoop in her room and found a couple of blood soaked rags stuffed into socks and hidden. And, weirdly, a couple of tools that look like claw clippers - so, I'm worried that she has moved away from hurting her arms and on to somewhere else that I can't spot when she comes out the shower.

She seemed to like the PSO at school. Is rolling her eyes at me but saying she'll keep going.

I feel bad about looking through her bins, but, she's clearly lying. So, she's unhappy. Am worried I've escalated things by just knowing about it.

It was easier when she was a toddler and a kiss from mum actually fixed things.

Thanks, Ginger - that looks really good. x

Was just thinking of her reluctance to engage with camhs.
When ds1 was in a bad way he was v worried about starting to talk about it as he felt it would make it worse.
He was right tbh. It did lead to a while (most of a term) off school and a lot of distress. But in the long term a good therapist really did work wonders for him. It was hard initially but he came through it.

Also self injury scarred skin can be tricky to tattoo.

It's best to look for a tattoo artist who has experience of this kind of work. It isn't impossible by any means.

Super, that's a really good point, and not one I had thought of.

It likely will get worse before it gets better if she's honest about how she's feeling.

Interesting about the tattoo too - not my field of expertise. There are worse things, and it's done now. Makes me a bit sad, but, I'll get over that. Annoyingly, life isn't all about me.

Dp has lots of self injury scars and lots of tattoos. I've seen her told off for her 'bad' skin by one artist (the work was quite blurred) and I've seen another artist work on the same skin with no issue.

Not the main point of the thread but it's the kind of thing it's best not to experience first hand probably.

I don't mind my scars at all.
It's times when I coped with something very difficult in a way I worked out for myself.

I would, of course, feel v different about scars on my children because parenthood is like that.

Ds1 had animal assisted psychotherapy. It was very helpful.
Animals are much less demanding.

That is true, Super - she's coping with thoughts and feelings that are normal as we turn into adults. Nothing wrong with that - I'm sad that she's sad.

Animal assisted psychotherapy sounds like it's worth a google. She's animal mad, interested in a career with them. Ta.

One thing you should know is that self-harm typically starts at about age 14. But in recent years we've been seeing kids as young as 11 or 12. The problem is particularly common among girls. But boys do it, too. So you shouldn't be overly worried about it. It'll come and go.

If you contact Young Minds they have been really useful to me when I wanted advise on a mental health problem with a young person. I believe it is a part of mind but for young people / children

OP, I know this is a really old thread but I am in an almost identical situation with my 14 year old daughter and I wondered how things have turned out for your daughter a few years later?