Faulty used car, dealer refusing refund, WWYD?

[Anon501178]

We have had a pain of a situation over the past couple of months...
Purchased a bigger car in January as 3rd baby is on the way in May.
Unfortunately within days, we identified issues with the car.Dealer (independent car sales) was initially fine about taking it back for inspection/repair, however did not agree after with the issues we had raised being present.
We then got an inspection done at an independent garage which found multiple issues.The dealer agreed to look at it a second time but dismissed the issues once again.
Got a SECOND inspection done including photographic evidence, at another garage last week, which suprise suprise found the same issues present again.
Emailed dealer and forwarded this evidence, stating that it is obvious and incontestable that these faults are present, and were at point of sale, and having given them two chances to fix them without success, so we want to return the car for a full refund or progress with legal action to small claims court.
The company manager emailed back today refusing a return for a refund and dismissing the issues again, basically stating it is a 10 year old car so what do we expect.

We feel stuck between a rock and a hard place now....our baby is due in 8 weeks and we need a safe car with enough space.
Which means we either need to get it fixed to a safe standard (although due to the complexity of the issues DH thinks this would be a very stressful and expensive process costing thousands)
OR we sell it to say 'we buy any car' and get something else on finance.Issue with that is we would be losing several thousand as the price they would pay us so low.

With either option, citizens advice have told us the legal small claims court process could be jeopardised if it is either fixed or sold, but we don't really have a choice but to do one or the other.The claims process could take many months and can't have the car sitting around, and need to either be using it or clawing back at least some money from it to put into something else!

WWYD?

Go to where you bought the car and refuse to leave until they either fix the issues, or refund you.

Did you use a finance company to buy it?

My husband half wanted to do this, but think it would just end in arguments, and the idiot of a MD is never on site anyway.

Unfortunately not, as i understand that if we did we would have had more rights after sale.We didn't use a credit card either.

Any sort of warranty?
Was the car of "merchantable quality"?
Did you get it looked at before buying?

It has an AA warranty apparently but don't think it covers the main issues which are problems with the catalytic convertor being messed about with, and a fuel injector leak.

Didn't get any sort of mechanical inspection done before buying- wish we had now!

Also the V5 has been 'lost' so the car is currently not actually owned by anyone!

If it’s after 30 days but before 6 months then you need the ‘right to final rejection’ from the consumer rights act

https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/advice/car-buying-advice/how-to-reject-a-car-consumer-rights-act-2015/

Thanks for sharing- aware of this being our right, but unfortunately dealer is refusing to honour it and let us reject the car for a refund.
We reported the faults in writing within the 30 day timescale, however did not clarify that we wanted to reject/return the car as we were hoping at that point it could be repaired.

You will always have your statutory rights. Less than 30 days since purchase, right to return (I know this doesn't apply to you). Within 6 months its up to the seller to prove issue wasn't apparent at time of purchase. 6 months and on it's up to the buyer to prove the issue was apparent at purchase.

CRA2015 is your friend here.

What car is it? Mileage when purchased? Mileage now?

Why do you think the catalytic converter has been messed with? Has it been cut and re welded (as in someone has took the insides out)

A fuel leak from an injector is VERY common, usually the O ring has perished...

Regarding the V5, they should have transferred it on line while you were in the office, takes 2 mins. If you want to PM me the reg i can check when the last V5C was issued

Contact Trading Standards at your local authority.

This is sadly how I learned to get an independent inspection done before I bought the car having had a lemon sold to me a long time ago. Now it is worth dropping the £200 for the AA to do an inspection and I tell the garage when I am buying the car that I will be doing this.

Following the honest John and send them another email outlining everything, timeline, when you reported the faults and that it should have been repaired at that point.

I would also contact Trading Standards and threaten them with small claims court in the email as in you are not the type of people to just lie down and take it.

I have had to fight to get a car refunded and they just need to know you will phone them about the email, turn up and complain loudly about their customer service so potential customers also hear how the are dealing with you. It is completely shit that you have to do this especially with a baby due so soon. Your Dh needs to not turn it into an argument but stay calm and state facts. You have to keep contacting them. My Dh was relentless about it.

The garages have both found it comes up with 'Pre-cat detected as absent' code and it seems the cat convertor has been modified and welded badly, has no heat wrap and is leaking exhaust gasses before the DPF.Engine management light isn't coming on so DH and garage think that it has likely been mapped out.

It is a Citreon c4 picasso 2016 model, and I have read that the injector leak off pipes leaking is a common issue- apparently a bodgy repair has been done on them as they have been 'glued'.

60k mileage- It has spent most of it's time on the drive/at the garage or dealer so has barely been used since purchase other than afew trips to those places!

Re; V5, thanks but have already contacted DVLA who have said previous owner was one before garage had it- currently registered to 'the motor trade' apparently and they said we should contact the dealer, but i've read online that we might have to pay £25 to get it! Have the green slip just not the full document.

You need to be very careful if you dont have a v5. My neice bought a car where the v5 had been "lost" turns out it was because the car had outstanding finance on it!

If you have the green slip you just send it off to DVLA and they send you a log book for freem

Injector leak-off pipes aren’t normally a big deal to sort so that wouldn’t concern me but the bodged cat etc could be costly and tricky. Obviously the law is on your side but getting a judgement and enforcing it can be two separate ball games.

It’s quite common for dodgy dealers to refuse to pay and then dissolve the company once there are a few CCJs against them.

With regards ownership, you are the owners as per the invoice. The V5C has nothing whatsoever to do with ownership.

This is optimistic advice but when the dealer refuses your only option is to enforce the law by taking them to court.

OP I have just done this. I won but the small claims court date took 18 months to come through. It was awful and I have massive sympathy for you.

Go to the car ombudsman website and follow their procedure for complaints

9 month waiting list and they don’t touch cases in any legal process

The problem with a lot of these dodgy dealers is that the company won’t exist in 18 months time.

I mean that’s not the problem as much as having neither car nor money for 18 months 😆 the courts aren’t a quick or easy fix in any circumstances

It’s just as big a problem. You get to 18 months and then it’s all been a complete waste of time as you can’t enforce it.

A dealer does not have the right to "refuse" your rejection. You just do it.

I am not sure on the legalities so somebody else might be able to confirm if you are still within time to reject.

If it drives and has no major warning lights then punting it off into WBAC is probably your easiest option.

We actually had the same thing almost exactly when I was due with my second last year.

We told the dealership that we had contacted the Ombudsman and had been advised the car dealer had to give us a refund. They told us they needed to check something and within 5 minutes called us back to confirm we could return the car for a full refund.

We had in fact NOT spoken to the Ombudsman but I am aware (through my job) that if the Ombudsman get involved they actually charge regardless of who’s at fault so often a company will cut their losses and refund in the hopes of avoiding a refund and an Ombudsman charge.

I’d recommend that and if it fails you can actually contact the Ombudsman ✨

Best of luck.

Yeah, awful advice.. LIE to them, that will help.

op, stick with the facts and the truth and you will get the result deserved.

Because that has worked REALLY well so far.