PCN Failed Appeal - Am I In The Right?

[South2North18]

Just wanted your opinion in case my confidence that I am right here is misplaced. I have lost my appeal, will not be paying a reduced charge to get this out the way and fully intend to see this through (Unless you all tell me I am massively mistaken). The PCN is from a London Council. Hope you can see the images i attached.

I parked in a Disabled bay with a valid blue badge on display, bang over the yellow disabled bay sign. The PCN is for part of my vehicle being over/outside the white lines. I have lost the appeal because they state the bay markings are clearly marked.

There are conflicting and confusing markings and apparently the bays are clearly marked. There is a white bay marking in amongst the usual yellow disabled bay markings, with signs up stating this is a disabled bay. I ignored the white marking and simply parked in the middle of the disabled bay, as usual. The white marking is redundant in my eyes, if i followed the white marking, then this bay would not be a disabled bay . The car next to me did the same. All bay markings are faded and not in the best condition.

Kind of annoyed i lost the appeal as it seems clear cut from my point of view. A part of me is thinking it is not worth the hassle and just pay the discounted rate and get this over with. What do you think?

IANAL but it might be worth moving this post to Legal Matters. If you report your own post and ask it to be moved, an admin will do it.

Both sets of coloured lines are faint and I wonder if either of them would meet legal requirements; I understand why you would want to take this further as I would too.

Best of luck.

The white line is clearer than the yellow disability symbol. The yellow hatching on the right can be used for those who need a wider door space. It seems to be the latest thing where disability bays only have the hatching on one side now unfortunately, eg Aldi.

As a blue badge holder myself I would have parked inside the white line. You need to pay the fine, sorry.

As a driver of a very large wheelchair accessible vehicle I would have either parked over the white line making this a normal sized disabled space or assumed the space was now a normal space (maybe due to how tight it is with that barrier) and parked elsewhere. I agree this is very confusing and I’m surprised you lost the appeal!

I'd appeal that further. That's completely unclear marking and if the white line is meant to denote the edge of the space, then the space does not meet the current UK prescribed width for a disabled parking bay (2016/BaySizes-Jul2016.pdf) www.britishparking.co.uk/write/Documents/Library%202016/Bay_Sizes_-_Jul_2016.pdf)

Definitely unclear, take it to the ombudsman.

The lines seem to conflict the signage. Can you zoom in on the wall signs and is there a pic of your car parked?

Keep going, OP! This is so unclear. The yellow disabled sign is on top of the white line. I'd think it negated it as how on earth would a person with disabilities get out of the car if the space was only the size of the white line?

Get your MP involved.

I cannot work out where you were supposed to park!

This is absolutely ridiculous. I've no idea if appealing will work, but I know I wouldn't want to pay either!

I would have thought the middle was
correct because the blue badge sign matched up with it being the
middle of the disabled bay.

there aren’t clear markings so I would also fight it because if they are saying you parked over white lines then
their disabled marking of the bay (the yellow painting) is incorrectly placed as well as the sign on the wall being misleading.

Totally unclear - keep going if you have the energy! Doesn't make sense to allocate a disabled space right against a pillar - looks like a parking company trying to get away with allocating the correct number of disabled parking bays without actually providing proper ones! Not sure if there is a disabled group who maybe able to advise.
The yellow disabled sign is over the white line - wheelchair signs are usually in the middle of a space, so that which would indicate to me that you follow parked correctly. Also, I note that the disabled parking only sign on the wall is not central in the 'white' line allocated space but to the left. Again, indication that parking centrally in the overall space is correct. (I hope this makes sense!)
(Am disabled myself and this would really p me off)
Just had a quick Google and found the link below - hope it's helpful but think the parking people are in the wrong/breaking the law!
c-r.co.uk/rules-and-regulations-for-disabled-parking-bay-line-marking-what-you-need-to-know/

very unclear
I would say the white line were previous markings for single bay as disabled bays normally wider
I would argue that the yellow wheelchair was in the middle of the parking bay never seen one offset

This is one occasion where doing a sad face in your local rag might get some traction, if you could bear it.

It’s either a disabled parking space with the symbol in the centre, over an old white line (but the symbol has worn off), or it’s a standard space.

If it’s the latter, then the presence of the symbol is misleading, and so you shouldn’t be fined. And the council should sort out the signage.

I think you need to take this to one of the newspaper consumer champions. The Guardian might be good at arguing it’s both illogical and discriminatory.

The yellow paint is over the white line so it would be reasonable to assume that is the newer painting and that the old white line is redundant. It is very unclear.

Thank you everyone for your responses and suggestions. I will be pursuing this further through my MP, hoping for a more positive outcome than the appeal.

The points you had all mentioned regarding confusing signage, overlapping markings, multiple indicators of a disabled bay, white lines appear redundant and following white lines would mean this bay is unusable as a disabled bay were all raised in my appeal BUT they did not respond to these in the decline of appeal. They only stated I had parked outside the clearly marked bays, this seemed like a joke.

Thanks so much once again. Will try my best to let you all know the outcome once this all concludes (hopefully in my favour)

I won the representation! The PCN was cancelled. Thank you everyone for your input and help.

Clearly marked - my arse! I’m glad you won against this nonsense.

🥳 I can’t believe you lost the appeal in the first place! It’s completely impossible to tell where the space is.