Daughters friend

[Charlie1989qq]

my daughter who is 5 is having issues with a certain child in her class. I’m aware at this age they are all learning how to deal with their emotions but it’s really bad… it’s not just in school it’s when I pick her up and drop her off the other child who is autistic is so aggressive/violent and constantly attacks my daughter.

we just walks past and said child punches her, shoves her over and her mother doesn’t seem to really tell her off because she’s autistic it’s just “oh no that’s not nice don’t do that”. I’m at my wits end.

the little girl I'm speaking about does have autism but is very clever and switched on and at this point I’m wondering if it’s even autism or just extremely gentle parenting? Things are so difficult especially when I have my youngest as my eyes have to be everywhere at drop off/pick up. What do I do? The school are aware of the little girl with issues and are aware she’s not very nice to my little girl. There’s no point even speaking to her mother because she won’t do anything either. I feel like swapping her schools if im being honest as they are in the same class and I don’t see anything changing.

what would you do or how have you handled this if you’ve been though this yourself?

Speak to the school about safeguarding policies under such circumstances and what are they going to do.
Good luck, autistic or not, that's unacceptable

Yep speak to the school and ask what are they going to do to protect your DD from these daily physical attacks from other pupils. What is their safeguarding policy and what is their bullying policy and are they following them.

You might have years of this ahead if the school can't deal with it. Can she move to another class?

@Beamur this is my worry. She’s only in reception and the classes move up years together and year one is in September.

I’ve actually mentioned changing her classes to her teacher but her teacher denies that they are violent in class but I don’t know if I believe them from what I’ve seen in the yard/on the way out of school but it could just be the child is acting like this only in front of her mother because she knows she will get away with it.

I feel guilty swapping her classes due to one kid being a dick because she’s already made other friends. This situation sucks.

Things can change. The hitting child is also adapting to this environment and having kept her feelings in all day (hence no hitting in class) they may be coming out now.
Perhaps you could change the way you collect her to make sure you keep some distance from the other child? Keep your DD close and don't hang around as they come out but briskly move out of the school grounds.
I would take comfort in knowing this isn't happening in class.

If the child is autistic it's not really getting away with it - it's more likely that she finally feels safe around her Mum and is letting out her frustrations from the day.

Just so you can understand it, the autistic child is overstimulated by the school environment and lashing out is a predictable result as a feature of the disability. It's especially common at this age for developmental reasons in autistic children. The autistic child isn't choosing to be violent. There is a loss of control over the actions (dysregulation).

The school should be managing the situation. My autistic son was the one lashing out in my experience of this at the same age. In the end, we had to agree adjustments to drop off and pick up as the hustle and bustle was just too much for him. It can be as simple as dropping off and collecting 10 minutes early to avoid the crush. And going thru the office rather than the playground depending on the school. It's on the school to manage, but you'll get more traction for your child's benefit if you go at it with suggestions like this rather than demands for punishment. It's a complex position to be in, so for the school to actively manage.

From the other mum's perspective, she'll know that traditional discipline will just aggravate the situation. A dysregulated autistic child will not respond to a telling off as you would imagine. It just compounds the dysregulation into a full meltdown (more lashing out). The gentle talk is probably an effort to soothe, as the objective will be to prevent a meltdown and to get out of the playground asap with as few incidents as possible. It's really horrible, because you know you're being judged as a parent. You can only solve it by managing the environment, which means the school making adjustments to safeguard everybody.

@mybeesarealive

it’s so hard not to see the child as just a child acting up, I try to remind myself she’s only a little girl and has issues but when you see your kid getting punched in the back of the head multiple times everyday it’s just started to become built up anger and resentment. The problem here is I’m the one making changes leaving half an hour earlier to avoid them and leaving straight away when I’ve got my daughter whilst trying to push a pram in busy yard yet the child who’s causing the issues gets to just carry on as normal.

I wouldn’t mind as much if her mother actually tried to break them up but when her daughter comes over and hits she just stands there and watches, doesn’t try to pull her away or anything it’s very frustrating. Did your child improve with age?

Also the teacher admitted in the class they are fine it’s at playtime where the hitting starts again because there’s so many kids and only a couple of staff out in the yard watching.

Yes it has improved with age. But it was very difficult and involved a school placement breakdown, an attempt by the HT at permanent exclusion, and a managed moved to another school where they were more willing to meet his needs. I do get it and am not invalidating your legitimate feelings about the problem. I think you should discuss your frustrations with the school, and ask them why they are not managing this child's drop off and pick up more effectively. You might need to say to them that they have to grasp the nettle and address it with the other parents with a proposal for collection that doesn't overstress the autistic child. But sometimes schools are crap at dealing with this stuff because it meanings brokering solutions that use resources. So you have to keep pushing.

When the other child comes over have you stood in front of your DD to protect her, as on physically come between them.

As this is happening outside of school time I would try that approach first.

My next step would be to speak to the Mum directly. I can't see what else to do other than a "stop your child hitting and hurting mine by intervening" ultimately it isn't ok that she stands back without trying to intervene. If she's not able to then she does need to look at making adjustments to her pick up and drop off times until things change.

Obviously this is after speaking to the school and asking them to manage the situation!

The school needs to support the child's needs better. The fact that she needs better support, particularly at break and lunchtimes is a problem fit the school to sort.

Don't involve the other child's parent. Raise your concerns with the school. As how they are going to safeguard your child.

Please don't be the parent who denies a child's diagnosis, as you did in your OP. If she's autistic, she's autistic.

Some autistic children need to be patented in ways which may not make sense to you.

@RandomMess yes I get in the middle of them and the little girl is grabbing at my daughter and swinging punches around me. It’s so embarrassing too as the yard is busy and everyone’s watching me struggle 😫I’m definitely going to ask the school for a meeting.

I feel so incredibly stressed at drop off and pick ups. I’m having to rush to get away and sometimes we make it without them being near one another and other days there’s no avoiding it sadly especially when I have to wait to ask the teacher a question.

This isn't a you problem, it's a school and parent problem. Whilst I'm sympathetic to the child's autism, the parent should be stepping in instead of doing gentle parenting aka fuck all. The parent should be collecting earlier, going through the office etc.

Still not acceptable though is it.

Wow I would not be passive in this situation. Your DD is NOT to be this kid's punching bag, no matter what her disability is. That is indisputable. Get onto the school about it and in the meantime you will have to physically protect your DD and be direct with the other mum if need be.

@Littlefish yes sadly schools are very underfunded and under staffed so it’s a difficult one. Little girl definitely needs someone supervising more.

its sad, I don’t want to be “one of those parents” but it’s really hard not to be after months of observing her mothers actions towards the behaviour or lack of should I say, it’s really difficult for me to be compassionate at times I think when you see your child crying and hurt it definitely triggers something in me. I will say though she is extremely extremely soft and I don’t care what anyone says but even autistic children need some boundaries and consequences even if it is different to how most people do it.

at first I was very very understanding but it’s starting to disappear. I’ll try and be better I just need to be mature about it and not get too pissy, easier said than done I guess, even children without autism can press buttons.

@Charlie1989qq you are clearly, and rightly, absolutely focussed on your dd. What I took issue with was you querying the other child's diagnosis.

For some autistic children, 'normal' parenting simply doesn't work. What you take for gentle or passive parenting may have been suggested by professionals, or worked out by te parent as a way of avoiding even bigger problems.

That said, the situation if your child being attacked absolutely cannot be allowed to continue, but it is down to the school to step in and come up with a solution.

As I said earlier, a very firm conversation with them about safeguarding your child is needed. I would suggest taking a list of dates, times and incidents with you so they can see the frequency.

As a pp suggested, the other child being picked up earlier/later or via a different entrance is one possibility.

Better supervision at unstructured times such as lunch time or break times is also appropriate.

The other child is clearly overwhelmed and not coping with busy or unstructured times at school.

Lunch and break times are times with the lowest levels of supervision. Children go from ratios of 1:15/1:30 to potentially 1:50.

Just catching up on other posts. So the professionals would say that this child is exhibiting distressed behaviours. Traditional discipline will be counter productive.The school needs to lower the child's baseline anxiety levels. Hard to know if parents are aware of this though. It's a steep learning curve. The child probably needs a one to one TA funded by an ehcp for a few years and an adjusted timetable to take pressure of times of transition (which are difficult for autistic children). This might enable better inclusion and mitigate the risks of lashing out. Something has to change though as it's no good for anyone to let it continue on the hope of spontaneous improvement. It won't get better on its own.