Dodgy advice from pediatrician e bf newborn?

[fififlores]

A friend of mine just had a baby in a hospital here in Spain. She is struggling with bf, though it's really early days (day 3 today). The ped has told her husband that colostrum alone is not nourishing enough for the baby, and that if they don't give the baby a bottle, their dd will lose weight. So far, so typically shite Spanish medical neo-natal advice (both my DCs were born here&I ignored most health profs). But then, the ped told him that at each feed, the mother only produces 15 cm3 of colostrum, but the baby needs 40cm3. Now that sounds like absolute bs to me, exactly the kind of ill-advised comment designed to panic/terrify new parents.

Can anyone tell me if they've ever heard anything like this before, and whether it has any basis in fact whatsoever? Thanks

he is talking bollocks.

a newborn stomach is tiny. it wil gradually get bigger when mums milk comes in.

colustrum is fine.

i wouldnt give any credence to that at all. how come so many babies survive on breast milk alone if thats true!!

id ignore it. and do what feels right.

bonkers. yes bf babies often do lose a little bit of weight in the first few days, but that is normal. just tell her to ignore the advice unless she feels that baby suffers. it is also normal that newborns feed nearly constantly the first few days.

well yes, the baby will lose some weight. nearly all babies lose some weight in the first week, and then pile it back on again

babies survived for centuries before the invention of formula

But newborns only have tiny stomachs! A quick Google and this page with info about colostrum specifically answers that question.

And how does the doctor think babies survived before bottles were invented...?

That's complete rubbish - the amount of colostrum produced is tiny, about a teaspoonful - but this is FINE. 40 cubic cm?? That's like 400ml - now a NINE OZ bottle is only 266ml! Even formula fed newborns are started off with about 1oz at a time. And colostrum is really, really nourishing.

Hopefully her milk will come in soon - if she is bullied into giving a bottle, just stay reassuring and tell her all is not lost, it's definitely possible to recover from (though should be avoided if at all possible)

Colustrum is very concentrated and 5 - 10mls (1 or 2 teaspoons) is enough per feed, as far as I have been told (source: bf counsellor at hospital)

40 cubic cm is the same as 40 ml

Or perhaps someone has misunderstood the measurements somewhere. 15cc is the same as 15ml and sounds about right for colostrum. 40cc/40ml is also about right for what you'd start a newborn off with formula - so you could assume that when the mature milk comes in the baby would be getting around this amount per feed. But yes, colostrum is perfectly adequate even in the smaller quantities, because the nutrients etc are much more concentrated.

Oh sorry I was completely confused there, for some reason I thought cc was something totally different.

Fifi this may help - it's a little graphic about the size of a newborn's stomach in the first few days of life. Hope your friend is doing OK.

The amount of colostrum is small but as you feed little and after its fine. Probably more often than a bottle fed baby. I probably fed DS2 whenever he was awake in the first few days. Yes the baby might loose a little bit of weight but thats normal.

Healthy newborns do not need bottles.

Congrats to your friend and her baby. Can she just feed and feed and feed and see how it goes?
And you as her friend should just bring her cake and drinks... (you sound like v nice friend!)

thanks guys, that's exactly what I thought re colostrium - that amount of 1-2 tsp is brilliant, as that will be much easier, and more reasonable, for her to relate to.

last night the baby screamed for 45 mins and they buckled and gave her some formula - she took a bit and then had a bit of boob too afterwards. hard to tell worried, knackered, inexperienced parents not to use a bit of formula when baby is yelling her head off - obv not wind, cos then took form, so was hungry - my friend was trying and trying to get the baby to take her milk - she was latching on fine, taking a few sucks, then falling asleep - but that is normal right? amazing how fast you forget these things...;)

That's what I experienced with dd, in a hot hospital, I remember stripping her to her nappy to cool her down and keep her awake long enough to feed.

That was in December in the UK, I've never understood why they keep hospitals so hot.

if baby is falling asleep a lot on boob, and not taking much milk and they then start topping up with formula she could well find herself on a slippery slope!
i would knock the formula on the head immediately and just keep offering boob as much as possible

Thanks SDG, what a great chart - I will print it out to take to her.

What concerns me most is that her DH believes and trusts their ped, and will try to convince my friend that she is right. People here think drs are God, ie are never wrong, and when I told him I disagreed re colostrum today, he got in a right twit.

My DH (also Spanish) was the same - baby crying=baby hungry=give bottle, and I had a huge battle to convince him otherwise. In the end I was out on my own. I know full well that my friend does not have the balls to do this. So that's why I'm collecting evidence!!!!!

My understanding is that a newborns stomach is around the size of a marble - usually needs (and gets) around 7ml of colostrum per feed in the first few days.

And here's where I read it... newborn stomach capacity

Your friend is lucky to have someone as helpful and knowledgeable as you on board - hopefully she will acknowledge your advice and ignore the calls for formula.

Ah, and now that I read the thread again properly I see that darkglasses has already posted the same link

Can you order a really good breastfeeding book with easy to read/understand info in (not implying she is stupid BTW, just meaning with sleep deprivation, new baby etc) - does she speak English? I don't know any to recommend in Spanish.

She needs to know/remember that if she gives a bottle and the baby is instantly satisfied, that doesn't mean she doesn't have any milk or that her milk isn't good enough - it's just that formula is heavier on the baby's tummy.

BB, I have given her my Claire BS book, plus the DVD (she is English, but husb Sp, and friend recommended book in Sp, for him to read). but for the moment, the most imp is the stuff about size of baby's tummy/amount of colostrum, to inform&reassure them both. so thanks MK for more info re that, and again for that brilliant diagram. Think she's going home today, away from that bloody pediatrician, so will try and visit her in next few days. Reported back to other bf friend here, who will also be supportive and informative, like me!

What happens if the baby cries and they just put the baby to the breast, fififlores?
A baby crying for 45 mins is not good.

that's what they were doing, tiktok, I think the baby got frustrated/tired.

What is the Claire BS book? It's not Clare Byam Cook, is it? Some really dodgy advice in there. The Food Of Love by Kate Evans is a good one and is very readable even when sleep deprived.

Good news that she is going home today