How to fix shallow latch - any ideas? TIKTOK? <hopeful>

[PacificDogwood]

DS4 is 9 weeks old and EBF.

Had first baby check yesterday and although he is gaining week on week (5-6oz on average) he has fallen from the 9th centile at birth (term) to just below the 2nd.

I am spending all hours that God sends feeding him - he will literally spend 1-2 hours on the breast and often gets 2-4 sides IYKWIM. After a spell of sleeping 6-8 hours at night he is now back to 2 hourly feeds day and night.
I am taking fenugreek and Domperidone (don't ask, I had previous BFing problems and have major hangups about my supply).
I don't think that the issue is supply though as there is always milk there. I think his latch is shallow and he 'nibbles' for hours and also needs me to go to sleep and, crucially, stay asleep.

If I take him off and relatch he will just pull back until he again only has a little of breast in his mouth. If I 'make him' take more breast he'll gag and spit it out.

He has been referred to paeds to be checked out.

So, how on earth do I improve his latch or the efficiency of his feeding??

TIA.

Oh, and I find I have no time for expressing to give him EBM as he is on all the time anyway (there is also the small matter of 3 other children to consider...).

It is time to cut my losses and give FF, isn't it ??

Cannot tell you how disappointed I am as I really thought we'd have a shot at this this time.

Bah.

pacific, I don't have time for an in depth reply just now, but will come back later when I have more than a fleeting second!

Has he been checked for tongue tie?

Interested in a reply because I am in the same situation here with constant feeding on and off throughout the day and night and I don't think her latch is great. Realise this is worse just now because of 6 week growth spurt but she always seems to feed in a cluster manner. Sterlised a bottle last night but managed to avoid using it...just.

Joining thread, as dd is a bit like this wrt her latch too.

So, lots of prople with similar problem but nobody with Magic Bullet solution .

jem, he has not been checked for tongue-tie but does not look to me like he has tt. Who'd check for it? HV? GP?

PD - hard even imposs to help via a talkboard....'cept to say you need to be seen by someone who knows what to look for.

Everything you describe could be normal, you see - yes, even the mega-feeds (presume he is not sucking continuously for 2 hrs, but objects to being 'asked' to finish even when he's not actually sucking a lot), yes, even the 2 hrly, yes, even the drop from 9th to 2nd.

OTOH, maybe his attachment can be improved.

Someone needs to see you - do you live where you can see a bf specialist or experienced bfc?

Hope you get good help and support soon.

Thanks, tiktok .

Yes, I will contact the local BF support based at the hospital where I delivered next week and ask to have feed/s observed.
You are right, he objects to being taken off rather than sucking constantly for 2 hours but it is wearing as he will also only nap if fed to sleep whilst lying down and I can then not move away from him without him noticing and waking.

Ta again.

Don't have a miracle cure I'm afraid but my dd3 was exactly like this, she still doesn't latch on 'properly' (she's 16weeks now) but has become more efficient and takes less time. She is gaining roughly 3oz a week and has gone from 50th to just above the 0.2 but she's really alert, wees and poos lots and is generally a little love so I'm not worried, in fact I'm quite pleased.
dd3 also loves falling asleep on the boob but won't come off by herself just 'butterfly kisses' I found the way round this was to buy a sling (I have the Close one which is fantastic) this means she can get a good sleep in day whilst I sort out the other 2, can feed on way to school, in Tesco the lot and no one has a clue. The added advantage of that is because she doesn't unlatch herself every 20 mins or so I will get a letdown so if she sleeps for a couple of hours she doesn't wake up starving coz she's been getting topped up in her sleep (does help if you have like me 1 boob that performs better than the other coz obviously you can't swap them over once they are asleep but I just feed off the other when she wakes up).
Disadvantage is that she likes to basically live in the sling now but anything for a quiet life and she's my last so I don't really mind, but this may not be for you. When she was smaller I tried and tried with bf expert to improve her latch and she just got really annoyed, no matter what I did she always went back to her original position, just decided in the end to go with it and she seems more than content even if she is a little dot (which is a good thing with all the carrying round!)
Hope this helps x

Yes, as tiktok said, can be totally normal (my daughter was the same in terms of feeding constantly) but the latch issues may be tongue tie. Best to go to someone properly trained in breastfeeding (e.g. lactation consultant) to have a look at that.

I actually suspected tongue tie with my little 'un in the early days because she fed constantly, had a dodgy latch etc - all the things that matched with tongue tie, but no, it turned out she is just a greedy bum

Hiccups, oh yes, without a sling I would not survive at all and the other DCs would be even more neglegted than they are...
I cannot BF whilst having him in the sling as my boobs are too saggy big .

jem, I'll get tongue tie checked next week when I will hopefully get to see somebody.

If he was either gaining weight fast OR happy OR an efficient feeder I would not worry at all. He looks perfect in the rare moments when he is actually calm and smiling.

This too shall pass, I know, but it is hard, isn't it?

Joining thread. Beside self with same problem. She just never sleeps and seems hungry all time, feeds for hours, then not enough time to sleep before next feed if she is supposed to be every 3 hours during day, argh argh argh, and def has shallow latch/ nipple sucks.

Poor little duck.

Off to get latch help on Monday, will come back and let you know if I hear anything useful.