It was NOT MY FAULT. Mothers of slow gaining babies, read this...

[verylittlecarrot]

Some of you may recall my challenges a couple of years ago with my very slow gaining dd. I did everything I could possibly think of - we had a perfect latch, very frequent feeds, co-sleeping, sling wearing, expressing, domperidone, 'more milk plus' and other galactogogues, breast compressions, switch nursing, skin to skin, breast crawl, co-bathing...and all we achieved was a measly one or two ounces a week, and I had regular blocked ducts. DD dropped off the bottom of the centiles. We saw paediatricians and infant feeding counsellors. We bf exclusively to 6 months despite the worry of her weight gain, and then continued until she was 2 years and a few months. She weaned when I was pregnant again.

Despite telling myself that her growth was 'normal for her' and that she just took only what she wanted from me, I have always doubted myself, and worried that my breasts were 'inadequate' - that I was one of the small percentage of women who have truly low supply.

Well.

My beautiful baby boy was born almost 3 weeks ago. He lost a fair chunk of his birthweight after a sticky start. (I had a severe PPH and needed transfusions) But in the last 17 days he has gained 23 ounces. He weighs more at 3 weeks old than dd did at 6 months old . He is gaining at 3 times the rate she did. He doesn't feed as frequently and he is nowhere near as demanding. It boggles the mind.

Same breasts. Same milk. Different baby.

I can now forgive myself and can actually believe what I always wanted to. DD gained exactly the way she was programmed to. Nothing I did could have changed that. It was NOT MY FAULT.

I know there are some of you out there also harbouring feelings of guilt and worry about your slow gaining babies. Take it from me - sometimes it really IS just the way they want to be. Forgive yourselves, please. It is NOT YOUR FAULT!

Thanks for posting this VLC, you've boosted my confidence no end.
My DS is nearly 5 months and still has to get back on the damn graph in the red book.
Every time I go to the hospital, they say he's healthy, yet they still keep wanting too see me....that's along with weigh in with the HV and infant feeding specialist.
I ask myself when will we get off this weigh gain merry go round.
Anyway, I've done the tears, the guilt, the worry and finally I'm convinced that he's healthy, his weight is going up and he is just going to be small.

hello, yes i thikn the cows milk protein is one of the tests the last lot of blood was for...

I really do think she is fine though and I have a very supportive partner who has helped enormously when I have been feeling upset about it, he thinks I am doing the right thing by her by feeding her myself and also thinks it is just how she is meant to be.

Well done vlc, i remember you from the acorns thread, my ds2 was born at similar time and also had wt concerns. he is now a strapping 2.2yo (still bf).

Deleting: formula as such would not have made the difference, bottlefeeding would. It was my idea that all feeding problems could be solved by demand feeding that was at fault. Dd's genetic disorder simply meant that she was too weak to suck efficiently so got weaker and weaker and demanded fewer and fewer feeds. When I finally (after emergency hospital admission) cottoned onto the fact that she wasn't getting enough, I expressed
and syringe fed ebm- but frankly, the exhaustion and toll on my body was simply too much; I think formula would have been kinder on both of us.

Three years later, with baby brother (who was eventually diagnosed with same disorder) I was far more relaxed and introduced occasional bottle top-ups, even formula top-ups; as a result he never went hungry and never lost the energy to ask for food. In my case, it didn't have a negative effect on my breastmilk supply, I've always lactated like an old cow (spurted the ceiling, filled the freezer, supplied the milk bank), it's just that my children aren't very good at sucking.

For me what would have helped would have been someone with a magic crystal ball to tell me that "look here, your children are always going to be different; standard approaches are simply never going to work for you- get over it!"

Congrats on your ds VLC, I was also on the acorns thread, with my little "off the chart" dd..she is now 2.2 and on the 75th percentile! (that was at her 2yr check, first time she'd been weighed in a year as I was SICK of it after all the trouble we had in her first few months). Healthy as a horse, still bf morning and night.

This is such a lovely thread, VLC. My DS is 24 weeks and weighed in at 12.2 last week; he's between the 0.4 and 2 centiles, but following his line more or less. He's been such a slowcoach about gaining after being born three weeks before his due date - he missed out on all the fattening up they're supposed to do at the end! He's been pure muscle and bone all along, and even though I've been EBFing morning noon and night since he was about seven weeks (after some totally pointless topping up with formula that made no difference), just keeps chugging along with his regular, slow weight gain. He's getting a bit bigger but I'm still getting the face from people when they ask how old he is. He's also bright, beautiful and developing nicely. So after many trips to this thread, many tears and much stress at weigh-ins, I've decided to be proud of him, and me, and look forward to another six months at least of feeding him and watching him grow at his own pace.

I'm so pleased for you, and congratulations!

Thanks very that VLC if nextime the HV/MW tries to suggest formula top up because of slow weight gain. Yes all babies are different some gain weight fast some are not. There was a photos of a poster on here, she had 2 DS both bf, one was quite a large baby one looked totally different, was smaller and thinner. Same breasts different baby.

buglet I think you should be very proud of yourself! the 25th percentile is nothing!!! I wouldnt worry seriously. Whats wrong with being the same weight as 25% of the babies in the nation

dd is on 9th for Red book chart and 15th on WHO chart...Id rather go by who chart been as its variables are of the world and not that of the UK where obesity seems to be skyrocketting.

My dd is mixed race, so I dont think national stats are going to really give the whole picture of what her body type is/heritage if you get me????

Im much happier knowing dd is whithin 15% od the worlds population for her weight.

Mooma glad to know that you are doing well, dont worry your ds sounds absoulutely fine as we said on here to you when you were worried about the HV and SS. I gave into that pressure and put dd on formula but she did not gain much weight and did not fatten up, she was long and lean like my dh, no chubby legs with cute folds no, just muscle and bone. If i knew then what i know now i would not have put dd on formula. I had the same pressure as you from MV so i gave in.

vlc, lovely to hear your update.
so glad you stuck to your guns, i do remember your threads from a couple of years ago, as i was having similar problems.
hv telling me to top up my dd and leave her to cry etc.
did the same and stuck with ex bf.
very glad i did

Thanks VLC reading this I realise how much I had been harbouring residual guilt.

DS Similar profile to many here - birthwieght 50th centile, by 5 months had dropped to 9th. He's nearly four now and still slim and small, but always healthy - no antibiotics, no hospital, no days out of nursery this winter at all.

Two things helped me at the time. First, I had really good health professionals who looked at him rather than his charts and reassured me that it was ok (my father was dying at this time and I was so worried that the stress was affecting my supply)

Secondly MIL had kept DH's chart (for 42 years bless her) and I saw plenty of weeks where he'd gained nothing or even lost and I asked her, and she said - that's just he way he was (he was FF)

really good to hear about others in the same boat

Congrats VLC and good for you.

I get really annoyed by the medical profession's seeming obsession about the "correct" weight gain expected of infants. Yes, some children are just small and that's all there is to it. My niece dropped right down the percentiles as a baby and my sister was told she was too small, but her DD was happy and healthy and is basically petite - still is at the age of eight, but it means she's a great little gymnast!

Chelles, you're right about ethnicity making a difference - my cousin adopted two Chinese baby girls and they are dinky - but that's entirely typical and they're absolutely fine health and development-wise.

crikeybadger - we have the same problem, ds is off the chart still at 8 months. We creep very slowly towards the bottom line and then we have a setback, like a cold or his hernia op and he goes off his food.

Corey - sounds like you've had a terrible time, I know how exhausting all that expressing can be, along with the worry, but as you say we just keep going because we think that bfing is best, but at what cost? Luckily for me, after a few weeks of the expressing, syringe feeding and ebm top ups, he did get enough energy to feed from me, but if it had gone on for much longer, I'm sure I could have carried on. You must be superhuman.

caz10 - that's encouraging that your ds has caught up (and more).

It's bonkers that these hvs go the ffing route at the slightest problem though, bm is supposed to be more calorific if you can get it into them of course.

Just wish I knew whether ds is supposed to be small or whether he needs a boost and then I could relax a bit. Just don't want to stunt his growth by not giving him the help he needs. Dietician has said that if he doesn't pick up soon, we should consider giving him a supplement that apparently doubles the calories in his food. Has anyone heard of it?

deleting You might find these quotes from a infant dietician website helpful...Everyone who is worried may also be able to get some comfort that low baby weights in breastfed babies is not a worrying sign. "Breast fed infants weight for height may be 60% below the average (50th percentile) found on commonly used infant growth charts. Their fat stores may be 60% below the average. Breast fed infants tend to be leaner than formula fed infants from 9 to 15 months of age. This is believed to be due to a lower calorie and protein intake by breast fed infants."

And the reason for the lower calourie intake is that breastfed babies tend to stay closer to the mother, (in a sling) therefore they dont move lots...so the calouries they do make will be kept within thier muscles, breastfed babies never used to jump about on mum or dads lap, they never used to have thier legs 'kicked' for them or arms waved...they were literally just kept close to the mother. There were loads of reasons why this happens large families, mother alone with babies and children etc...

My SIL had her first ds here in UK, he was bottle fed breastmilk and he grew to be tall and lean, no fat. She now lives in Africa where she had her 2nd ds...he was breastfed and attached to her in a sling cause in Zim thats how the mothers do it...hes a fat, (sorry shouldnt really say that) chubby little thing. Hes not like his brother who got the chance to run about the house over here, and use up all his energy.

"Breast fed infants calorie intake is usually below the recommended amounts even in optimal environments and even with the addition of solid foods"
"A mother's BMI (estimate of percent body fat) appears to determine the mother's breast milk fat content, but infants seem to compensate for varying amounts of breast milk fat by altering the amount they drink. The amount of calories a breast fed infant consumes is not related to the age that solid foods are introduced as long as the infant continues to breast feed. So your baby's weight may be a factor of breastfeeding especially since your doctor has not found any genetic or hormonal (endocrine) abnormality."

Sorry to hijack, but thank you pigletmania - things are going much better. I don't think I would be as happy or as secure if I hadn't discovered Mumsnet, as (documented extensively elsewhere) the bloody health visitors have been a nightmare.

I also think it's hard not to see the charts as marks out of a hundred rather than purely descriptive of the stats. Small isn't necessarily bad, I suppose. And babies will always find some way to surprise or worry you, big, small, fat or foolish!

Still hope to have a similar experience to you, VLC with the next one, but if not, I'll deal much better, I'm sure.

thanks for that chellesgirl. interesting stuff. Will have a look at the website. It's amazing how we're still using the old charts, although i think our hv said some new ones, based on bf babies were coming out.

yeah you can see breastfeeding charts at here

looking at those charts it's obvious to see where it all went wrong with us (apart from being born at 4lbs that is). the 0-4 months when he was putting on tiny amounts (a few grams or sometimes nothing) because he was so sleepy and had problems latching on, fell asleep almost immediately and we couldn't use a bottle or syringe very successfully because he was spark out and would choke. From then on he has put on the recommended amount from 4-6 months on average and seems to be okay 6-12 months, but he's just never made up for the early months, so I'm not sure he's meant to be this small, he just had a bad start. We will have to see how it turns out. DS1 was 8lbs 6 oz and then went up to 95th centile, then down to 50th and now at 6 years is tall, but VERY skinny and he eats like a horse. DD was 7lbs 6oz or something, went up slightly, back down again and is very picky about food, eats far far less than ds1, but is nowhere near as skinny.

Just to say thanks to all the lovely mums posting here. We do worry so much don't we? I don't feel so alone now on worrying about DS weight... he looks so gorgeous, not really hefty like some babies you see (even though I think chubby babies are adorable).

I guess he eats as he needs and I should be proud of him for doing that. I've decided not to worry about the weight chart anymore and hope that DS will never have a weight problem in later life from starting out as a controlled eater rather that eating too much.

VLC, congratulations on the birth of DS! I realise you were joking, but I wonder whether it would help to contact some of the specialists you saw with DD - they will, by definition, only see babies who have "problems" which they will try to "fix", after all.

Really glad all is going so well for you

VLC - was thinking about you tonight and came across this thread (which I realsie is old).

Congratulations on your DS. Isn't it strange how babies can be so completely different. Is your DD still petite?

VLC - Thanks for this thread, as we are in the middle of all of this. Our DD is now 21 weeks and is hovering around the 2nd centile having dropped below the curve at 7 weeks.
In order to improve her weight gain we've mix fed, express fed and now that she's refusing to take a bottle are back to exclusive breastfeeding - with two hourly night wakings for a 'nibble' - but we'll do anything to help.

The difference for us is that the hcp are happy that she is following her line and have not sent us from pillar to post to find out if there is a specific problem.

I am petite and so I think hcps are satisfied that she's a shortarse like her mum (they don't seem to consider that OH is a 6footer.)
But each weigh-in is stressful and it's reassuring to hear stories of others with little 'uns and it's the way they're made and nothing to do with how they're being fed.

vlc, congratulations.