grrrr... bl**dy size & weight charts

[berolina]

ds is rather unsettled and screaming/crying a lot atm. he is still feeding loads and loads, with his usual longer couple of stretches (up to 5 hrs) at night/in the morning, and often hourly late afternoon/early eve. he does seem pretty hungry right now - and he seems to be a poor sleeper - in the day he hardly naps. . anyway, we suspected some type of trapped wind/colic, so have popped to the paediatrician (not our usual one as we are staying with sil and family for a couple of weeks). anyway, he weighed him, averaged the gain over the last three weeks since his check-up and declared it wasn't enough. on the size to weight chart he's still nearly on 50th centile and has actually moved up a bit, but he's dropped just below the third on size to age (now measures 53cm). we have been given lefax and told to go back in a week and if the gain hasn't improved he wants me to supplement with formula. of course i'm adamantly against it because of all the hard work i did to establish exclusive bf. also something he said puzzled me - i asked him if the charts were based on bf or bottlefed babies and he didn't answer the question but just said bf babies tend to be bigger! than bottlefed! thought it was the other way round?! anyway, i'm 5'1 and weighed 49kg pre-pg and dh is 5'2 and was very small as a child, how can he expect us to have an averagely big baby!
he is 7w 5d, born at 38+0, weighed 3850g today with nappy, 2820 at birth, lost over 10%, released from hosp with 2650, weighed 3480g just under 3 weeks ago without nappy, 3770 on scales borrowed from chemist on fri without nappy. he is weeing fine, pooing loads with mustard yellow poo, has good skin etc - just rather a lot of crying atm. he is feeding now - just now was really gulping it down desperately and then it looked like he burped/spit a bit up mid feed.
this is part rant, part plea for reassurance - how i hate these damn charts!

If he's weeing, pooing, happy and looks healthy then I'd ignore them. 3 out of every 100 babies are going to be 3rd percentile or below, and based on what you said about you and your DH it sound like your DS is very likely to be one of them based on genetic grounds alone.

thanks everyone!!!
I know a lot of people have this scenario - but it is hard when you're made to worry...
on the bf boys chart tinker posted he's just over the lowest line. so he is small. but it's true, someone has to be, and given our sizes (as you say leah) ds is a very likely candidate!
Tinker, we try to burp him after every feed and usually in between! he's hard to burp - will 'hold it in' forever.
the only thing I'm really concerned about is his crying and grizzliness - and bad sleeping. he always gets the breast when he cries and usually goes for it, and whenever I give breast a squeeze milk comes out, so there really should be enough there - and if there isn't then I really don't know where all that poo comes from!

Berolina,research indicates that slower weight gain is actually healthier long term in any case. (Obesity and Type 2 Diabetes are linked to rapid weight gain in bottle fed babies.)
Once again, the crying and grizzling has nothing to do with b/feeding.
Nothing Nothing Nothing

OK?????

Berolina, he could be crying and grizzling for anything - feeling hot, for a start.

The paed does not know what he is talking about. Your baby is well within normal limits on all counts. No one in the UK measures length anyway...they haven't done for years and years because it doesn't tell you anything.

Your baby is normal, he is growing normally, he is sleeping normally, and he is feeding normally.

Please don't go back to that doctor

thank you - that is reassuring.
had a look at weight gain again, some weeks he's put on 100g or just under, some weeks more.
I am going to see a LLL counsellor tomorrow just to have my technique checked.

berolina, I hate hate hate those charts.

my dd2 who is 6 months now isn't even on the charts
long story short - we see a paediatrician every month who monitors her weight gain, height, length, and head circumference - she is absolutely fine. Have been exclusively b/fing and now she's on solids ( and still b/fing) I too was told to supplement with formula and I did for a while - but one bottle once a day isn't going to make much difference and I stopped after a few weeks.
grrrr hate those charts
hope your babe is settled tonight

-update-

We went to the bf counsellor and she had a look at the latch and said he wasn't really opening his mouth wide enough and showed us how to achieve that. Otherwise she thought everything seemed fine (he seemed nice and alert - after dropping off while bf! - etc.) and there was no immediate reason to suspect low supply. She was not overly concerned with the weight gain and (of course) not keen on the idea of formula. Anyway, we've got home and had another feed - I almost feel like I'm 'learning' bf again but ds seems to have had his fill and is now sitting quietly with his dad. The other thing she suggested is carrying him round a lot in a sling or similar to give him some peace and stability, which should help his sleep patterns (which in turn should help his weight!).

They told me they've gone off measuring length because it's just not reliable - with a good tug, a baby is a cm longer, IYSWIM.

Quite right, NQC.....no one has measured babies' length in the UK for years for exactly this reason. No need to do it at all, unless there is some reason to suspect abnormally slow growth or some sort of congenital low stature/disability. In both those cases we would be talking about babies who were by now visibly affected.

agree ncq - have found "length" can "increase" by a couple of cms over a few days.

difficult night - ds wanting breast every hour for 20 mins and above, starting in evening, until about 3am when we mustve dropped off, started up at about 7 again.
could he be having his growth spurt now?
don't know what else it could be - maybe the cat hairs, garden and people here (staying with sil's big family) are too much (this is the first night he's really done this), or he's got an infection? is weeing/pooing fine - we are test weighing a day's nappies on recommendation of bf counsellor and he'll be well over 500g/24 hrs.
or is it - NORMAL

teh chards were written for formula feed babies - Does he look in proportion - dd was teh same adn she is fine now

nappy contents (just contents not nappies) - 525g plus the pee he did while naked, and the 24h are not quite up yet.

gothic, he looks fine (I think) - is pretty thin but doesn't look really skinny like he did at birth - has some weight on legs and tummy now.

Normal berolina.
Remember,he's still practically brand new!
It's hard work,we all know but you are doing great. You look after him and make sure everyone else looks after you!

XXXX

berolina....all that's normal. I was awake on and off all night with the heat last night (though not demanding feeds from my poor old mum )

Can't believe the bfc suggested weighing nappies.

Quite, quite mad, sorry.

tiktok - at the image that conjures up...
really (weighing nappies = mad)? otherwise she was fantastic! - observed feeds sitting up and lying down, showed me how to improve latch, etc. She was from the LLL. Maybe she realised I like to 'see' things concretely in figures and suggested it to make me feel better???
he had a good doze this afternoon and then we took him to a cranial osteopath who seemed very sensible, said there is quite a lot of tension there and he should improve, if not to come back once more.

berolina
He is fine I am sure of it! Keep going - you have come so far!

this morning we weighed ds on scales borrowed from chemist (we've been doing this weekly, just for ourselves) and he weighs just over 4kg! 250g gain in a week! admittedly he'd had a feed a relatively short time before, but he feeds so much that's almost always the case when we weigh him - and even if we take 100g off for that it's still 150g gain!
Yah boo to the doc! !!!!

Ignore the charts. I am in Spain and have been told that dd was slightly over weight and a giant because she was of the height chart. When we lived in England she was overaverage for height and under average for weight. These charts are a nonsense. You know your child, you can see if they are eating and drinking enough. Dont stress, you are doing a good job

The charts are not based on bottle fed babies (at least the ones in the UK are not....not sure about Germany where berolina lives). It is a myth the charts are based on bottle feds....they are based on data sets from a mix of babies, and this mix includes all sorts of babies.....if you do a search on my name and charts on the MN archives you'll find where I have explained this before.

The problem with the charts is not what they show - which is probably a pretty accurate picture of the growth of a population of babies - but because they are misinterpreted and misused in a clinical setting with individual babies.

There is nothing especially wrong with the charts, though they do get increasingly inaccurate as a picture of the growth of a population of breastfed babies after the first few months, when typically, breastfed babies tend to be leaner than formula fed babies. The problem lies in the way they are used, by HPs who do not understand them give undie emphasis to them, and avoid looking at other aspects of growth and health.

Berolina, if it keeps you happy weighing your baby, then that's fine. But if it starts making you feel anxious, then stop

undie=undue