Help needed re. do i need to top up with formula??

[Rachface]

Ive never posted on here before but someone on another forum I use sent me in your direction and said you ladies give lots of good advice re. feeding and there is usually a breastfeeding counsellor on here. The background is that ds2 who is nearly 5 months has been doing what ds1 did and feed for few mins one side then get upset and refuse to feed anymore off that side (crying, arching back and generally unhappy while laying down). She will then happily sit up and be moved to the other side to feed for a while then do the same again at which point it is the end of the feed as she wont be put back on. She started around about 10 weeks and has been up and down but i decided to speak to hv about it properly this week as she seems to be getting gradually worse/hungrier. She suspected that it is something to do with my letdown which is also what i thought was probably the case as the only way it stopped with DS1 was when i started giving her bottles with a size 3 teat at about 3/4 months i think (she was a bigger baby who grew much faster so got hungrier quicker).

HV suggested i top up with formula as she is putting on weight but not very fast and has dropped from 50th percentile to 25th then to 9th and is now up a bit between 9th and 25th. She also suggested i tried some starchy solids with her like baby rice/sweet potato (this surprised me as she was only 20 weeks and i didnt think she was anywhere near ready so thought hv's would have encouraged waiting). She is going between 2 and 3 hours between feeds but less than she was so i started topping her up with formula yesterday (in day only and not first and last feed or in the night). But what i wanted to know is if she feeds off me as usual but is happy (once she is taken off the breast, obviously not happy on the breast!) and goes 2-3 hours between feeds is she having enough food? She just fed off me and was happy once id taken her away from the breast but then she took 6 oz of formula so i cant help wondering if she was being left THAT hungry why wasnt she screaming for food after an hour or two without forumla top ups? or is she being over fed by having bf and 6 oz of formula?!?!? does that make sense?

she took about 12 oz of formula yesterday on top of bf and still woke twice in night for feed and took a decent feed (ie. didnt suck for few mins then fall asleep).

just dont want to force feed my little girl if she doesnt need it..............sorry bit of an essay

Bit of extra info - i decided to top up with formula rather than express (tried a few weeks ago) as i need to have my gallbladder out soon and i dont think its realistic to think i can express enough for her over what could be a week, so think i need her to be able to feed from me or have aptamil. I want to keep breastfeeding but need her to be flexible.

Anyone have a similar experience?
Thanks

I had a similar problem with my dd when was litte (now 9.5mo). She was diagnosed with reflux and was far happier and full on Aptamil. Why don't you try replacing ne or two of the feeds formally with a bottle of formula and see how she is? As my midwife said, it's about what your baby needs and not what you wnt. If she prefers formula then so be it! Irrespective of what the breastfeeding squad think!!

Babies will drink formula even if they have just had a good breast feed. It means nothing and your hv should know this but tbh sounds like she's a bit clueless. I am no expert (you need tiktok for that) but I very much doubt that you would need solids and certainly not formula after bf for 5 months.
Dont judge it by how long she stays on the breast - they get more efficient at getting more milk in a shorter time period as they get older.
It does sound like she may be being over fed with a formula after a breastfeed.
Personally I would leave off the formula and solids.

Masalama - gee, so nice to refer to people who give advice about breastfeeding as a "squad". COuld you explain how a 5 month old would need formula over breastmilk and how if the op doesnt do this then it's about her needs rather than the babies because that just doesnt make sense.

Bumping for you

a few thoughts...

it is normal for bf babies' weight gain to slow after 4 months. this is NOT a cause for concern. you should look at the whole picture - how is your dd's health, is she having plenty of wet nappies?

you do not need to top up with formula - you could try feeding more often. she may surprise you and take more. or not want any - both scenarios are ok. what i am saying is that YOU have the means to make more milk should you need to, without having to resort to ff (unless you want to).

i echo what rainbow has said about babies getting more efficient - my ds used to take 40 min or so to feed - now it is maybe 10.

there is nothing wrong with mix feeding, if that's what you want to do. it doesn't sound like it is necessary here though. if you are really concerned about her then see her gp. they aren't necessarily better informed about bf, but in my experience they are better placed to look at the health of the child in front of them rather than fixating on charts and centiles like some hv do.

hth

thanks ladies. if it wasnt for needing surgery then i probably wouldnt bother trying a bottle as im happy breastfeeding but i do need to get her to take a bottle of fgormula one way or another. Maybe if i just replace one feed a day rather than topping up i would achieve this. Guess im worried if i dont bf her first she might prefer bottle and want only bottle at other feeds. Maybe ill stop giving formula for few days and feed as and when necessary see how she does and then try replacing one feed a day....hmm difficult to know what to do for the best

i was surprised at hv saying that to be honest, but giving ds1 formula was the best thing i did and stopped her being left constantly hungry and frustrated so assumed ds2 was going the same way............

with your surgery, is it outpatient or will you be in hospital for a few days?
are you looking to ff just while in hospital or to mix feed from this point onwards?

your supply will be able to cope with missing some feeds at this point, you will probably need to express to stay comfortable though. do you have a pump/do you know how to hand express?

i had to stop bf for 24 hours with my dd when she was about 7 months old, because i had to have contrast dye injected into my veins for a scan of my kidneys. dd had to take all feeds by bottle for that time, and she was ok. we went back to bf the next day with no probs.

its an overnight stay if keyhole gallbladder but difficult recovery over a couple of weeks im told so wont be able to pick the kids up for a few days maybe a week. Hoepfully after a couple of days ill be able to bf with help. Surgeon told me i had to be able to not breasfted for 2-3 days before i could have op. Think i will aim to mix feed after op so she continues to accept bottle so i can get some help. She is still feeding a couple of times a night so im shattered as i havent been able to have any help for 5 months. I guess id like to maintain feeding in morning and bedtime and maybe a bottle or 2 in the day (although i am struggling with giving her a bottle without me bf'ing first, that feels like the end of an era rather than topping up|)

i have got an electric pump which i was using to try to get her to take occasional bottle but with a 2 year old who doesnt nap at all anymore its difficult to get time to sit for half an hour with a breast pump once a day let alone create a supply for a prolonged period so i think ill take the easier way out as she is 5 months old now and give formula while im out of action

the op is an issue but her fussiness on feeding was the one that made me speak to the hv, and why she recommended topping up

Can you feed lying down? That should help after your op. Do you know how the recovery compares to a c-section recovery, as that should give you an idea of how disruptive it is likely to be (considering after a c-section women are still expected to be able to look after their newborns! )

I'm not sure about the arching back but my baby had a similar weight pattern to yours, and my HV was happy for me to just carry on breastfeeding.
I breastfed him exclusively until he was 6 months and then carried on with breastmilk and solids, and he has been fine. His weight slowly went up and he stabilised at somewhere around the 25 percentile.
I think with weight as long as your baby looks happy and healthy then don't worry!