Anyone currently reading Politics Of Breastfeeding?

[hunkermunker]

I'd like to talk about bits of it with people who are reading it/have read it/are interested in reading it/aren't currently interested in reading it, but will be once they've read the thread. And likely some other people too, but I haven't thought of their categories yet.

Agree with so many of the comments.

I am pg but I will not be surprised that once I have the baby if I find I get subtle pressure from friends to stop BF around 6 months.

My DH bought me this book as a surprise after I saw this post, and mentioned it, such a fascinating book and a great gift.

It really made me think just how uncomfortable culturally it can be for women to bf in the UK.

It also reinforced the consumerism of babies, all the product placements that you get bombarded with.

It made me realise that the protective power of breastfeeding is not promoted well enough.

I have just seen the Channel 4 tonight news on Somalia I have just seen images of what seemed to be a mother seemingly unable to bf, although the report pictures broke up on screen because of the thunder storms in london. Anyhow it got me thinking about the statement that during the west dafur famine in 84 and 85 infant mortality rates did not increase due to BF whereas other mortality rates -child and adult deaths did increase substantially.

I agree Weasle, it is so sad that there are so many malnourished people on this planet.

What a lovely DH you have, Pinkfizzle!

I found the stuff about wet nursing fascinating - how it was once a respectable thing to do, how babies who'd been wet-nursed stayed in touch with their wet nurse for their whole lives - and the women who'd had their babies "swapped" at birth and how they bonded with the child they breastfed (but the mothers who hadn't breastfed seemingly just wanted their baby back - I'm paraphrasing, possibly clumsily!).

What I find so hard to understand is women who credit someone else with their efforts - so they talk about having a perfect "Gina baby", for instance - but scratch the surface and you'll find someone who's read a parenting book, taken the bits that work for them and ditched the rest as unworkable or plain bonkers - and won't then say "We do what works for us".

It's like we're so scrutinised and judged because everyone's got an opinion on parenting, generally informed by an ignorant article in the Daily Mail about how dreadful women are in general and especially when they've had a baby - so we have to hand over responsibility for the decisions we make to someone else.

Or something.

Incredible book. I am racing through it and will have to reread it again slowly. It's one of those I just want to make everyone read!

I'm finding the contraceptive factors of bf and its implications amazing. We hear so much about the contraceptive pill being the thing that separated sex from procreation and supposedly liberated us from the limitless drudgery of baby after baby. But it would appear from this book that pre industrialisation, women were not having zillions of children, because of bf. (Apart from the noblewomen who had to produce heirs)

So women were in control of their bodies and biological destinies, and, had this knowledge not been lost, eroded, and devalued, we wouldn't have 'needed' some doctors and drug companies to free us after all... it's so interesting!

I am delighted to have found this thread!

I am about half way through this amazing book.

Has anyone else found themselves desperate to share with others what they've read, only to be met with total disinterest?

My copy has just arrived so I'm only just getting started but have already been at the formula company designed hospital!

Will be back to discuss when I've read a bit more, this thread has already made me want to get back to the book (in a good way because people have brought up interesting points not in an offensive, I'm out of here way!)

I have never even heard of it but have just ordered it on Amazon .

I am thinking about going on an ABM mother supporter course in the near future and this sounds really fascinating.

Am off to bed now, and have not read the whole thread. Thanks for starting it, Hunker. Have marked it to read tomorrow.

Hunker, following on from your comments, have you come across the book Dream Babies on the history of parenting manuals? I bought it a few months ago and have only read about 20 pages but plan to get back to it next time I feel in the mood for a non fiction read but it's fascinating stuff. It also includes a lot of stuff on changes in attitudes to bf.

My DH is getting an eduation whilst I read bits out to him whilst he drives. DH finds it as interesting as I do and we have had some good conversations.

On the other hand, my mother has been asking me about the book in a very negative way (I carry it with me, the only way I get chance to read it, in snatched moments)

My DM is determined to tell me how wrong it is FFS. Apparantly I can "not trsut everything that is written down" I have explained this is a world renowed author backed with good research not a badly written article in the Sun paper but that hold no water.

She told me that all third world people need is clean water and it is good that formula companies donate free powder in time of need. I explain that food for the mother is all that is needed and that breastfeeding would save more lives than ANY other measure including clean water, apparantly I am wrong. My DM is convinced that formula companies act for the good of babies and the pictures of starving older babies on the news show her that their mothers don't have enough milk. Sigh It is upsetting that she is allowed to tell me I am wrong with no backing evidence, yet when I tell her the facts she just states they are wrong !!! Argh. We will ave to agree to disagree ( and I might make a cover for my book ..LOL

elkiedee, Dream Babies is a great read, very interesting. I like the swaddled babies which you can hand on a nail near the fireplace !!! And all the stuff on early introduction to the potty (like I do)

I saw Dream Babies in my local bookshop yesterday, funnily enough. Feel another purchase coming on! And I'm joining Baby Milk Action as a result of reading this book.

I've not been met with disinterest, no- my DH too is receiving selected excerpts! My mum was aghast at the formula-designed hospital as well, appalling. My family are all very pro-bf and my siblings and I were bf (my mother wasn't, though) and DH and his siblings were all bf, as was his mum (quite unusual for the time/geography of where she's from). It makes such a huge difference if it is normal within your family network.

They all expect me to stop soon, though (DS is 7mo)! What is 'normal' only goes so far still...

Hunker Munker I really do appreciate how supportive my DH is. Like Babieseverywhere and MrsMotMot I have been reading my DH excerpts.

Also it is good to have a book with so much references to back it up. So much parenting advice and manuals seem to be opinion dressed up as a reality and it really can come across as bonkers.

Fascinating book, fascinating post, will post again soon.

I have now just finished the book and it is very powerful. I am feeling very emotional about it! Anger, sadness and despair mainly!

How are we going to change anything? There are a few examples of good practice by countries in the book, but as she says, these are not valued by the 'global market' and i am aghast at some the actions against these things by the world bank and big business. i now understand the anti-globalisation campaigners' points of view.

I worry that the people who read this book are already 'the converted', mainly women who are bfc or interested in this issue. I hope there are some efforts to get the attention of mainstream media (i am not in UK currently).

babieseverywhere my mum is very unsuppportive too, and my mil. Latest is that i am selfish for bf as that prevents my mum 'sharing him' by putting ds2 to sleep for the 1 week/year that she visited us. And it has prevented my (very well bonded thank you) dh from bonding. All because bf is totally unnecessary, i was ff and am ok etc etc. . She would never read this book which i think would help her understand where i am coming from.

I am now even more determined to do some more bf training to help in my local area. i am very sad that as an educated person in one of the richest countries i didn't get the help i needed to bf my ds1.

Anyone got any other ideas what i can do after reading this book? Join baby milk action? i already boycott nestle and buy as little stuff as possible.

I too have a very supportive husband who is well versed in the importance of breastfeeding. I wonder if that is the key for many women. And if it would be more helpful to better engage expectant fathers on the issue. Information (where and when available) tends to be focussed at the expectant mother which may or may not be relayed to others. Perhaps a campaign to educate fathers first would help.

I'm very jealous of the people who's DH/P is very supportive. My DP thinks that a lot of the BF information is 'propaganda' his word not mine. If that's propaganda wtf is the advertising of not breastmilk products, I refuse to call it formula!

However, I do understand why he's concerned as I have a DS who doesn't understand he's supposed to feed in one go so I can get some sleep, although that's getting better now. He thinks that the odd night feed of not breastmilk product is ok to get me some sleep. Hopefully, now that DS is sleeping a lot more at night we won't have that argument every 2 weeks. The other fly in our ointment is that his mother use to be a school nurse and has a very dim view of hv's, my hv is absolutely supportive of exclusive bf. Unfortunately, once DP gets an idea in his head there is no shifting it. I choose my battles and this is one I'm not giving in on.

I'm going to make him read the book after I've offered it to my hv and the other mums at the baby cafe.

I'm looking forward to the follow on milk argument. When did follow on milk become appropriate for BF women and has anyone else seen the Aptamil advert? I've complained to the ASA about it as it makes the product look as good as BF which it isn't!

dxx

Babieseverywhere - your DM is clearly mad. Ignore her .

I have almost finished reading Dream Babies, just got to the very interesting bit about Gina Ford suing MN a couple of years ago. I'd heartily recommend it.

I'm off to Amazon now to order Politics of Breastfeeding and I'm going to remind DH why we don't buy Nescafe. He's always sneakily putting it in the trolley when we shop and I'm always sneakily removing it. He's very supportive of me BF but only for the health benefits to DD and isn't really up on the political significance of it.

Which one is the Aptamil advert dawntigga? Is it the one about iron with the huge bottle of milk? I despise adverts for formula and think they often tread a very fine line legally in terms of what they can and cannot say about the 'benefits' of their products.

Thanks for this thread hunker, fantastic reading!

Kingrolo that's the SMA advert - another one which annoys me

dxx

Oh I detest that stupid humungous beaker of milk advert. Ugh!

dawntigga I think HCPs and ex-HCPs are sometimes the most resistant to changing their minds regarding bf. My SIL's mum used to be a children's nurse, then a HV and now works in management (i.e has been out of the 'clinical' side of things for many years).

Although she professes to be pro bf, has advised (pregnant) SIL to purchase bottles, teats and a steriliser and to have a tin of formula in the house 'just in case'. It is these sorts of things that subtly undermine bf confidence.

I must add that this book has made me feel ashamed of HCPs and recall things I did, was told to do or watched knowing they were wrong as a student mw. I can think of two abysmal situations in particular...

By MrsMotMot
"Oh I detest that stupid humungous beaker of milk advert. Ugh!"
I know !!! I shout at the TV 'but the iron is breastmilk is more bioavailable and hence the better source of iron than any cow milk related product'

Well my mother also "professes to be pro bf," but that does not actually mean that they are truely supportive, despite their well meaning attitude.

Ordered both "Politics of Breastfeeding" and "Dream Babies".

Looking forward to reading them (and finally being able to show DH why he has to have Tesco "Malt Wheats" instead of "Shreddies" )

my dh is not supportive of bf, and it has been the subject of many an argument. he is slowly coming round i think.

he has now given up asking me when i am going to stop bf (ds 18mo). i am going to see if he will read this book, would love him to, but he will say he is too busy i'm sure.

dawntigga, i think lots of my dh's encouragment to ff was because i had so little sleep for 15 months, and was so tired. i wanted someone supportive to say 'it will pass, you are doing such a good thing bf' etc, when what i got from dh, mum, mil etc was ' well if you are tired then ff'.

and they would all think they are pro-bf babieseverywhere!

I abandoned Dream babies half way through when my politics of bf book arrived, look forward to catching up with it and the GF/MN battle, didn't know that was in there.

I hope you don't find this posting from the publishers of The Politics of Breastfeeding too intrusive... I am really pleased that the new edition is going down so well!
We're a small company with limited resources, so I hope you don't mind me asking that if you like the new edition, please help spreading the word by reviewing it, blogging about it, telling your friends about it, or posting your comments here! Everything helps and is very much appreciated.
And if you review the new edition on Amazon.co.uk or other online retailers, you can even get a free book from Pinter & Martin (click here for details, sorry UK addresses only).
There is also a Facebook page for the book here, if you want to keep up with any news on the book.
Many thanks for your time!
Martin

Whoa, a good book, AND a free book thown in! I will definetely review it, thanks, Martin.

I like the idea of educating expectant fathers as much as the mothers. I think men (careful, gross generalisation coming up) being hardwired to be "fixers" very frequently tend to say "if you're tired, we'll give a bottle" rather than doing the nurturing "you're doing fine, it will pass etc". That certainly has been my experience as well, particularly with DS1 when the HV's advice was along the same lines. Clearly, both of us got better with increasing practice and experience.

yes pacific, it is the men from mars/women from venus thing i think, men want to provide a solution to a problem rather than empathise.

Martin, are there any plans to publish the book outside the UK? I am certainly trying to spread the word, I have bought 3 copies (so far...)!

weasle This new edition is now also out in the US, and Australia, and we're hoping to license a few foreign language editions soon.
In the US it available from Amazon.com for example, and The Book Depository ship it for free to many countries.

And thanks for buying three copies!