Can I successfully mix-feed?

[alux]

Yesterday seemed like the straw that broke the camel's back.

I had an emotionally difficult pg, pre-eclampsia and a traumatic delivery. Baby then had jaundice and I high bp so we were in hospital for 8 days together. During this time I began to bf successfully though baby screamed constantly while under the lights.

We came home a week ago and I promptly came down with the flu.

Yesterday, the HV weighed baby and she has lost 8 oz. (Born 7lb, 4oz on 19/4) She is not yet worried about her weight but I was told to supplement feed with formula as I am not eating properly due to the flu and my milk production must be down. Baby has been very demanding and seemed insatiable so it is possible. Saw my GP the same day who said to do the same.

I am still giving baby the breast as it is comforting for me and her and then she sucks down a load of formula wheb I give her the bottle afterwards. I can't say how strongly I feel about bf, but because it started well, I was only wondering how I would make it work when I go back to work.

Its not that I am anti-formula that I am still crying over this though I know that breast is best and I wanted to do the right thing. It is partly because nothing as been easy for me in this entire experience. Just when I think I am at the last hurdle, something else kicks up. I am now very very weary of being strong again and have been crying all of yesterday and in fits and starts today.

Any ideas?

It does get better.

My DD stayed 2 weeks in hospital at birth and had started on bottles of both EBM and formula.

I received the following advice for cutting down on formula (from LLL and read similar advice in the NCT book). Either:

1. you give less and less amounts of formula at each feed; or
2. you drop a full formula bottle, one at a time

I was told it would take WEEKS to get back to fully breastfeed. I did not let my DD go hungry as I didn't think this was the point but slowly cut out on formula amounts. It took about 3-4 weeks but it has worked. Once we got to the stage where she's only take 10-20 ml of formula per feed (I always made 3 oz, just in case), i realised she could probably do without it altogether so cut back even more. It was trial and error. She's now 9 weeks and fully breastfed. Occasionally she gets bottles of EBM.

Best of luck.

Sorry, probably should have made it clear that she took 10-20m ml formula after being breastfed. So she was getting something.

Alux, some weight loss is normal in a newborn. I would do what has been suggested here already, go to bed and feed every 2 hours. I think if you feel you must supplement with formula, then gradually reduce the amounts that you give. I felt ds3 was OK to drop top-ups when he refused to take any more than 10ml at a time from the bottle. Alux, when I had ds3 I lost 2 pints of blood at least and was severely anaemic. My milk was not at all affected in that the day after he was born I was able to express 45ml from each breast for him at each 3 hr feed, plenty for a 5 lb baby. I feel that if I was this run-down and able to produce that much milk that you would really have to be at death's door before your milk supply would be affected. I should add that I was VERY weepy and one of the MW's said that it was because I was low in iron, so maybe that might be the case with you? In any case, best of luck, do what you feel is right for you and your baby. your HV and GP are there to guide you, not to give orders.

Sorry to read about your difficulties Alux. Has anyone discussed trying a milk enhancer with you such as Domperidone (also known as Motilium)?

what's a milk enhancer? does it increase supply?

yes, have a look here . I've not had it myself, but may have to when my baby arrives next month if I have difficulties (had an op that might affect my supply). Not looking forward to the coversation with my doc about it actually as not many gps or hvs have heard of it. A breastfeeding counsellor will have though and should be able to advise if you ask.

There's also herbal things that are supposed to help too, such as fenugreek - have a look at the La Leche website.

i have been having problem with milk supply. my ds is just over a month old now and i am taking 1tsp of cumin seeds washed down with a glass of milk atleast 2 times a day. its worked for me. try it!
also if you are worried about giving too much formula try only giving it at night and first feed in the morning, that will help u sleep aswell. bf for the rest of the day.that way baby will get both

Thanks for everyone's concerns, shared experiences and ideas. I was sure I posted a reply already. Must not have hit send. Its that kind of a time.

You all gave me the energy to fight on. I phoned up the h/v who ran the bloomsbury class I attended and she came right over. She stood behind me and reinforced all that has been said to continue. She thinks me and baby look fine. that my breasts are producing enough milk. Reviewed baby's latching on and promised to come by tomorrow again to see how we get on.

I am going to bed soon to feed baby and get some much needed rest.

Thanks again all.

alux, so glad to hear that! I hope all continues to go well, and that the hv is as supportive as she was when she came over.
good luck! (not that you sound like you need it now!)

good luck Alux hope it goes well, there is always support here

Fantastic, Alux! Glad to hear you have good support Enjoy those feedy snuggles with your baby xxxxxx

she is downstairs right now enjoying a llloooong big snuggly with daddy.

I think it is the feedy snuggles that hooked me.

Can anyone tell me if it is natural for my poor little breasts to go all empty by early evening? they feel about full now (at 10 pm) but she hasn't fed on them since 4 pm.

I gave her the milk that I leaked and collected in breast shells yesterday and today. That was just under 80 mls. Tomorrow, if the same scenario happens, I will only have 40 mls to cup feed.

Oh, yes, please, please don't think that if your breasts feel soft you don't have milk and that being 'full' is great. It really doesn't work like that. There is always milk in your breasts - it is made to order. If you don't feed you don't have more milk, you have less. Why haven't you fed between 4pm and 10pm? That's a really, really long gap and will reduce your supply. The feeling off fullness will signal to your body to make less milk as your body will think you have been making an excess.
It's easy to lose confidence when your breasts are soft, but really, this does NOT mean you don't have milk. If you want to up your supply feed at least every three hours during the day, more if your baby is looking for it.

Don't worry about cup feeding - just keep putting her on the breast.

I haven't because after I gave her the cup feeds,- sorry, more like at 6 pm, not 4 pm, I went to the store and daddy has snuggled her to sleep on the couch. I wanted to wake her at about 9 but she looked too content so I left her there (sheepish emoticon) Will go get her now. She will be starving.

I've been worried that because my boobs were soft,they were empty so I gave the cup feeds.

so much to figure out.

Alux, I think that so long as baby has plenty of wet nappies, there's no need to worry about supply. I know its hard to believe that soft boobs produce milk but they do!

When my DS2 was small, I tried to ensure I fed every two hours during the day. It's a hassle, but worth it, to keep supply up, and encourage them to feed during the day, rather than at night, as time goes on.

And as everyone says, soft does not mean empty! (If you can't face waking her, you can pump instead?)

I can't tell you the number of times I put ds & dd (rather tentatively) to a soft breast only to have them grin up at me with a mouthful of milk!
Please, please keep breastfeeding, not cup feeding. It is stimulation of the breast from a baby feeding from it that is the single best way to keep and increase your supply. Pumping is good, but not nearly as good as a baby feeding. You do need to feed at least every three hours during the day and ideally at least once a night.
Don't worry if your baby seems insatiable - that often happens. It can be that your baby simply loves sucking and finds it totally pleasurable and relaxing, or it can be because your baby is working on getting your supply up - ie when it is having a growth spurt. My dd is 12 weeks and having a growth spurt - she has fed all day for two days (on soft breasts!) and today I'm leaking all over the place. That's how it works -supply and demand. Confidence is, I think the real issue for you. Your breastfeeding is fine, your baby is fine, but that stupid HV knocked your confidence.

Is your baby a loud swallower? My DS2 is, so I can hear him swallowing and swallowing at an empty breast. As time goes on, your breasts stop getting hard and full, unless you go an unusual time without feeding, but my fat 7-month-old, who takes a few cubes of solids per day, is proof that soft does not mean empty.

At my ante-natal class the other day, the mw was saying that hard engorged breasts are a Western phenomenon because a lot of us for one reason or another have it "programmed" into us that there are set times for feeding. Indigenous African women, for instance, have never experenced engorged breasts as they simply feed on demand, whenever, wherever. Like has been said, the best indicator are wet and soiled nappies, certainly not firmness of breast. Sorry your hv made you so paranoid. Sounds like you're doing just fine. I hope I do as well as you!

alux.....the posts here have given you some good stuff. The HV you have sounds especially rubbish. Your baby's weight is concerning, and it means you need to feed lots and lots to build up your supply.

Good luck!