Help am about to resort to the bottle

[splodge2001]

Help! I'm about to give my 5wk old formula. My DD was born after a 3 hour labour, no intervention gas and air only. She immediately wanted to feed and has been feeding constantly ever since - (today I fed her 13 times from 12pm-6pm). I got cracked nipples and a blocked duct at 5 days and a pinching feeling ever since. At 3 weeks she had dropped from 75th centile to 25th centile.During the second week she was diagnosed with Tongue-Tie and she had it snipped at 4wks. She started putting on weight normally from wk 3 but I havent been able to move from the sofa. She feeds, looks vaguely satisfied for about 2 mins then wants to feed again - all day till about 9.30 then sleeps for around 3 hrs, feeds again and sleeps for a further 2/3 hrs. The whole thing starts again at around 5am. She wont sleep during the day unless she goes out and she wakes up as soon as we get back in. When shes not feeding she likes to stand on my lap and look around - shes extremely alert! I really dont want to give her formula but I can't keep up. The tongue tie op doesnt seem to have made a difference in terms of the frequency of feeds, she also has a high palate -I guess shes unsatisfied, hence feeding so often. The milk flow has never seemed great either, the right one produces much less, you can even see that the veins on the right side are not so prominent. I've seen and spoken to LCs, no help. Before I take the plunge does anyone have any suggestions? Also if I give her a bottle will I ruin the allergy related protective effects of BF?

after 6 weeks my dd got more efficient at bf and it got much easier. she also dropped from 50th centile to 2nd and then followed that line ever since but is fine. it is a lot of effort but worth it

HI please don't despair it won't always be like this,you are doing really well and taking cues from your baby which is brilliant! right now you in what is referred to as a 'calibration' period which means your supply is still getting used to what your baby needs so frequent feeds are ok as it is encouraging your body to make more milk this phase normally continues till about 8 weeks, so keep going! also have you tried contacting the la leche league?

Hi Splodge - don't panic!

How long is she feeding for? My DS (now 6 months) went through a phase of feeding every hour or so at about 5-6 weeks - there is a growth spurt around then I think. Does she fall asleep when feeding? How do you know she has finished? Mine often stops to look around the room, in case anything interesting is happening - if not, he'll go back to feeding again!

I also think to start with that I wasn't giving him long enough on each breast - he would feed then let go, so I put him on the other one. THis meant he didn't get enough hind milk so got hungry again quicker.

Are you getting regular poos - yellow - and wet nappies? Green runny nappies might mean too much foremilk ie not eating enough to get the hind milk. If so, and she wants to feed within 30 mins of finishing a feed, try putting her back on the same breast.

GOod luck!

wow! Am no expert, but am not sure the palate has anything to do with her wanting to feed so frequently. My sister had a cleft palate and my mother was able to breast feed her until she was about 13 months?

She is 5 weeks, and babies that young are milk monsters, and also not sure that your veins are an indication of milk.

So, in a nutshell, she is putting on weight, sleeps only in pram/car seat and is constantly feeding?

Sounds fairly normal to me.

Hiya, please don't give up. These first few weeks are hardcore hard. I cannot remember the number of times I sat sobbing that I HATED breastfeeding in the first couple of months. But now I wouldn't change a thing and loved it at the end.
However at the end of the day you have to do what's right for you and your baby but I would say to keep exclusively feeding for as long as you can. The longer you can wait to introduce foreign proteins (i.e. formula) the better.
Have you tried the NCT breastfeeding line, trained breastfeeding councillors answer the phones. Here's the info: Breastfeeding Line - 0300 330 0771, 8am?10pm, seven days a week.

splodge, you poor thing!
You have done so well to get this far, and no, even if you do end up FFing you will have done her good by BFing these first few weeks.
Could the problem be with poor/slow milk tranfer ie she is not v effective at removing milk from your breast so spend a lot of time at breast but ends up with not so much milk, IYKWIM?
Look at this
and this. Any good?
Also look at kellymom. A bit American, but v v good evidence based advice.

Is there a BFing support group were you are, either NHS or LLL or similar?

You sound like you would like to continue BFing and IMO lots and lots of RL support really helps!

And keep reading and rereading this! . Good luck!!

thanks for all the advice. She comes off herself, sometimes only 10mins at a time I sometimes switch, sometimes not. She closes her eyes often when feeding but i always try and wake her up. does anyone else have experience of this? surely 13 times in 6 hours is madness. My DS whos 7 was never like this. he caused a lot of pain but i got through it and went on to do 10months without a drop of formula passing his lips - i'm not a quitter you see! Im really being pushed to the edge

all mine were total milk monstors at that age, 13 times in 6 housr isn't unusual for alot of very young babies but honestly, in the next few weeks it will decrease alot and she'll be satisfied for longer between feeds.

they grow so much in thos first few weeks they need massive quatities of milk to keepy up.

yes, formula will completely change the bacteria in her gut and the allergy prevention will be negated as well.

you've done so well to get this far, honestly it gets easier from here on in. your baby is still so tiny, in other cultures you'd still be under the care of your female relatives ecpected only to feed and care for your infant.... our culture makes bf-ing very hard as we are expected to get 'back to normal' so quickly but at this age she really just needs to be feeding and sleeping constantly.

have you tried leaving her on the one side for a couple of hours, every time she asks for more just latch her onto the same side? this serves 2 purposes, it drains that side heavily stimulating productin and it also gives her far more of the hind milk which is richer and more filling.

my boobs are uneven as well but it hasn't affected feeding any of my kids, women feed from just one breast or feed twins and the baies still get enough.

try not to think of it as her feeding too much but as her being a clever baby and getting lots of milk. cluster feeds are normal and again will improve your suppply and fill her up more.

One bottle to give yourself a break won't kill either of you so don't beat yourself up. I do remember feeling like a milking machine with DC1 at the start but she suddenly got the hang of it at about wk 8 and we fell into a 3 hr routine.

I really struggled feeding DC2 and came close to stopping at the same stage as you. I hounded the breast feeding clinic at the hospital but they didn't help. By chance, I found Dillian Maas who is a post natal doula and have to say, is amazing! I'm not sure where you live but here's her link

www.dilliansdoulaservice.co.uk

She was incredibly supportive emotionally (half the battle), gave me practical support in feeding and helped us settle into a routine that suited us all. Thanks to Dillian, I breast fed DC2 for a year.

Dillian is a member of Doula UK and could probably put you in touch with doulas in other areas or how to go about finding someone?

Good luck!

When DS was about that age I tried to give him formula because I was so tired from all the nursing, all the time, as often as your DD but he wouldn't take it. I cried .

I went on to bf him for 3.2 years. IIRC it was around 8 weeks that it started getting easier and he didn't want to feed quite so constantly.

spolodge....hope the encouragement on this thread helps you.

I am not sure why you try to wake your baby up when she feeds? Eye closing is normal, falling asleep feeding is normal...frequent feeding is normal, too, but she and you may enjoy it more if you can accept her eye-closing and falling asleep

Yes, even 13 times in 6 hours is normal. It is actually easier to adapt yourself to this, than to expect a newborn to change....that means working out a support system for you and not feeling bad about being on the sofa Babies love being close to you - feeding is part of this.

If you give a bottle you will not 'ruin' bf, and there is no way of predicting allergy effects in an individual baby. Bottles have to be prepared and then given (probably on the sofa ) and may or may not extend the sleeping time - no guarantees!

No one should judge you whatever your decision, but some of your anxiety sounds like lack of confidence in breastfeeding and your milk, and from what you're saying, your bf is going just fine...

Thanks guys. The support has got me through the night without the formula - i made a mess in the kitchen anyway when i made up the bottle! fingers crossed she'll settle soon. It's true that a lot of it is anxiety about her not getting enough milk. going to try my local baby cafe. I guess when you're in the middle of it all you can't see the wood for the trees

You're absolutely right, splodge, when you're right in the middle of it everything can feel overwhelming and as if it will be like this forever. This will pass so soon. I remember this time, especially with ds1, as a mad, intense, dream-like confusion, but also kind of magical if you can surrender and go with the flow.
I know it's easier said than done, but it honestly sounds normal to me, no expert, but bf my 3. Be kind to yourself and don't expect to get anything done other than feeding her for now. Hope it goes well at the cafe.

Well done, splodge!
Babycafe sounds like a great idea - wish we'd had one here when I was in your shoes. V true what you are saying about being to close to everything to look at things objectively.
Good luck

Splodge, very good luck. If you do give formula it won't take away the benefits of the breastmilk, but you sound like quite a determined person. Going to the babycafe, or to any group out of the house with quite young babies, sounds like a good idea, if nothing else I find feeding with some company really valuable - I didn't manage to breastfeed ds1 and was determined to do better this time round, then started having the same problems and some others again - we went through a spell of coerced mix feeding but once I was home I just fed and fed and fed but also went to groups even if I was having to feed constantly there.

elkiedee makes a good point -- one thing I did differently with DD was to get out of the house for a couple of hours every day. Generally this just meant I went to Costa and sat on their sofa feeding DD, but it was surprising how much difference a change of sofa to sit on and walls to stare at makes. And by then I'd perfected the art of reading while she fed, so I tried to reprogram myself to think of it as valuable reading time rather than as wasted time, and got through a lot of books.