7wk old baby screaming at bedtime...help, am really struggling.

[caspercat]

DS is exclusively BF at the mo. Been trying to get him to take bottle of EBM for past wk with no success (DH, MIL & friends tried). Really struggling with bedtime routine as have 2.6yr old DD as well, and DS invariably overtired by time bathtime is over, so feeding him becoming a nightmare. He had good feed at 4pm today, so must be hungry now, but just fussing & screaming everytime i try to feed him. He's done lots of burps but still seems windy. And i can't hand him to DH to try to give me a rest cos he won't take a bottle. So now he's screaming his lungs out in his basket, cos no amount of rocking, jigging or just calmly sitting is doing any good, and i had to put him doen cos i can feel myself getting angry.
Don't know what i want really, just some hand holding maybe????

God, it's so vile this part isn't it?
Have you a sling? Put him in one if so and go for a vigorous walk around the block. The jiggling might help. Also poss.over the knee and jiggle up and down. Or strap him in the car and go for a drive . I had a battery operated bouncy chair from M&P which was brill at times like this. Cranial osteopathy may help too.In worst case scenario, just leave to scream. Dd screamed every night for about 6 hours at a time for weeks. In the ned,I would just put her in her carseat and get on with some ironing or cooking.

Oh ds used to do this. We called it the witching hour but it wasn't really an hour. Was great at getting rid of unwanted visitors...

A trick I found worked (sometimes) was to strip him down to his nappy and massage his tummy, arms and legs very gently. I knew nothing about baby massage btw, I think he just liked the feeling. Sometimes nothing worked though.

He grew out of it - seems like a lifetime ago but maybe about 12 weeks?

I feel your pain.

I've been there caspercat! I have given up bathing BabyG at teatime as he too was overtired, but I can see it wmight be difficult for you as your other child is 2.6 (mine are 9 and 5 so are often bathed/showered later when BabyG is asleep).

Can you bring bathtime forward at all? Maybe bathe them both at 3ish so he isn't so tired? Just remember, if he's screaming in his cot, he isn't going to melt - I would switch off from my 5 year old screaming (when he was a baby) as nothing settled him once he got going.

here caspercat

Good grief, I know how you feel. my little one is 18 months now but I remember well the confusion and chaos I felt when she was 7 wks and her sister 3 YO.

Here, in no particular order, are a few things to bear in mind:

• 6- 7weeks is a key growth spurt time, during which a BF baby is liable to want to chew your nipple off until 11 pm every night. With my first DD I thought this was a sign of my failure to produce enough milk. With the second I had grasped the above and went with it- after a few days it settled down (happended again at 12 weeks tho!)

• some babies go a bomb for the bottle, others really don't. Agin, DD1 took her EBM like a dream, with DD2 it was seven months and I was nearly back at work before I could get a teat into her. Don't sweat it, she will do it eventually.

• sometimes they do just scream for hours for no reason (both of mine did), and it can make you angry. You're doing the right thing putting him in the basket if you are struggling. Do something quick for yourself, have a cup of tea or a wee or whatever you have been unable to do for the last few hours!

• it really will pass. I had two colicky screamers and got to the end of my endurance both times. Now it is only a memory (although posts like yours bring it back very vividly!) try to fast-forward a couple of months in your head to a time when your baby goes down to sleep at 7pm (ok, so he may wake a number of times thereafter but at least you get to eat your supper alone.....)

Seriously, you are doing great. Just keep swimming.

are you still there caspercat? How's it going?

Thanks all. Took 10 mins out to chill. He was still screaming, horrible, windy screaming. Picked him up, he burped, then fed for 20 mins before passing out. Been asleep ever since. Just had a bath & a glass of wine (me, not him ), so i feel a little better....
We've already bought bathtime forward, as DD just stopped lunchtime naps, so tired earlier aswell. Can't bring it forward anymore as she's in nursery, don't get her home till 5.30, then we've got an hour for dinner before bath at 6.30. DS has quick bath with her, then the plan is to feed him before he's been awake too long, but not really working out that way so far. Have tried a sling, he doesn't seem to like it & i just can't figure the thing out! He will sit in the bouncy chair for a while, long enough for us to grab some dinner normally. He's generally an easy baby, & i know things could be a lot worse, but i feel so crap when i can't even feed him properly. BF going really well otherwise, but afraid i am stressing about him not taking a bottle. BF counsellor said if he doesn't take it in next couple of weeks, he's unlikely to ever do it ....
Anyway, tomorrow's another day, as they say....

Glad you're feeling better. It's not true what your BF counsellor said about the bottle. As I said, mine first accepted one at 7 months old (I slipped it in at the dreamfeed when she wasn't really awake). There's lots you can do, experimenting with different teat shapes and materials (mine only ever took a funny shaped NUK teat which fitted on my standard Avent bottles). Also found running it under the warm tap helped. BUT you don't need to stress about that yet if you don't want to....

I keep getting told about those NUK teats, but nowhere near me stocks them....knew we shouldn't have moved to the sticks.
Well, today is here, so let's see what tonight brings. Thanks all again xx

It really brings it all back. DD was hideous a t bedtime and DS was 2.4 at the time and the whole bedtime thing went from being a lovely quiet winding down time with just DS to a vile, screaming juggling act. DH used to be at work until 8 and would irritate me by walking in when DD had finally settled. Ours was an hour and more most nights and in the end I used to feed her, put her in the cot and leave her to scream. DS was oblivious and demanding stories etc while I was tearing my hair out and my whole day was dominated by the fact that I had bedtime to do later. Not sure when it stopped but certainly when she started to suck her thumb it helped. She was just a baby who cried when she was tired and looking back it seems a really short time in all our lives but you so have my sympathies! Mine are 6 and nearly four now, go to bed like stars and are generally all quiet by 6.45 so it does end. My issue now is that DH has no memories of how vile DD was when she was tiny as he worked twelve hour days and it drives me mad when I'm talking to people about her and he will say "I don't remember, are you sure she was that bad?" Grrrr!

Also, don't really agree with BF counsellor, DD was much older than that when she had her first bottle I'm sure.

Breastfeeding counsellor has this very wrong - there is no upper limit at all to willingness to take a bottle. What a daft thing to say

Stressing about this will not help at all.

Hope things get better for you.

Just a thought - is it worth perhaps not doing daily baths? I don't think they need it at that age and it might be one less thing for you to have to deal with/ DS to get upset by?

Another obvious one but will your ds take a dummy - my ds wouldnt but my dd did and (contrary to expectation) we found it really easy to get rid of 13 weeks and thankfully it didnt interfere with bf at all.

Caspercat - your BF counsellor is giving bad advice re the bottle. My DS1 took the bottle at 6 weeks happily (EBM in it), then at 3 months figured out he preferred the boob to the bottle so refused the bottle entirely (which we persisted on trying to give him, fools that we were which caused much misery all round; in hindsight we should have just chilled) - then at 6 months, when I went back to work, started taking the bottle again as he knew the boob wasnt on offer during the day and happily BF morning and night (we just made a weekend of me being out the house and DH just offering him the bottle over and over when he was hungry but not forcing the issue and he took it fine from then on in).

I now have a 8 week old and a 3 year old and sympathise with the arsenic hour (or two) in the evening. If DS2 has a nice long nap in the afternoon between 3 and 5 (in the sling if we're out and about) it makes bedtime hour much better as he is miles less cranky and can last out until DS1 is down before being put down to bed - if he doesnt, he needs to be fed and put down first (while DS1 watches Cbeebies bedtime hour) before 7. Is your DH home at bedtime hour? If so, could you give him DC2 and ask him to take him for a walk round the block in a carrier (may calm him down enough to have a good feed) while you get DC1 down? I hope it all gets easier for you.

I know lots of babies who were exclusively breast fed and never would take a bottle despite the parents trying so imho the BF counsellor has a point.

My dd struggled with a bottle as she was tongue tied and physically could not do it. When the tongue tie was resolved, it seemed that it was just too late to try - but i tried again at 11 months and tried various bottles, the one she eventually could manage was the wide neck tommee tippee it is supposed to flex like a real nipple - its very soft and she coped well with it.

the temperature of the milk was important though, it had to be warm as otherwise she would not accept it....

I did separate bed times at this age. My DS1 was 2.5 when DS2 was born. Both my babies needed really early bedtimes - 5.30pm at one point. Can you try this?

wow, thanks all again. will try to get thru the points as well as i can.
have tried to skip bathtime, but dd loves it, and when ds is screaming, the bath actually calms him down for a bit.
unfortunately, dh has leg in a cast - ruptured achilles - so his help is limited to say the least....and he normally doesn't get home from work till 7.
have tried a dummy, he spits it out..
dinkystinky, am impressed yr lo can stay awake that long happily - ds just about manages an hour at the most.
separate bathtimes is really tricky i think - dd not back from nursery till 5.30, so all quite rushed as it is.
and the bottle thing, will just keep trying i guess. is so demoralising when you see your precious EBM go down the sink every day .
sorry if it seems am dismissing all your suggestions - don't mean to, just being a bit pessimistic about it all i guess. but i know i have to focus on the fact that it'll soon pass.....
till the next thing comes along
thanks again xxx

caspercat - re wasting EBM - might be obvious but what I do (DD is curently refusing bottle) is express, sterilise two bottles, put a small amount in the bottle we're going to try, then the rest can be frozen for use in a mythical future where DD willtake the bottle again Then if they do take it you can always quickly grab the other bottle...

At least that way it doesn't seem like such a waste...!

Well, if anything worse tonight . Seemed like was gonna be better - he woke 20 mins before bath, so had a play(ish), took 1 oz EBM from DH (a small triumph, at least), then had a bath (v quick, just long enough for me to get my PJs on!). I then took him to feed him, & if was a good feed, he would have been in his basket just over an hour after waking. But no, another horrible, screechy windy feed. He's screaming in his basket again.
Why can't i get the bloody wind up?? Have tried Colief (which is a PITA to give when breast feeding), Gripe Water (he just spat it back up) & now on Infacol (which i think is prob worse than useless, but HV says perservere). Have tried every method of getting the wind up (or down!) imaginable, but the poor bugger just looks in agony. Don't think it's colic - DD had that & was inconsolable for hours, and she was only 3 wks old when it started. This at least stops when i pick him up, but i have to put him down at some point - for my sanity & to get DD to bed.
So, do i just accept this is our bedtime routine for now, till he "grows out of it"?. Cos i really can't think of anything else to do.....
Feel a bit stronger about it tonight - just resigned to it, i think....
"it's just a phase, it's just a phase" rpt, rpt, rpt....

I learnt Wind and Colic massage at Baby Massage course which worked wonders with DD when having similar probs as you describe. did it daily, and the wind was so much easier ot get up/down!
you could prob google it, there's a particular move called 'Sun and Moon' for massaging tummies specifiaclly for this prob. you need to press quite firm for it to be effective.
HTH

Thanks for that Emmanj. We're booked on to a massage course, but doesn't start till end of April. Have googled your suggestion & will give it a go. He's still fast asleep since his screaming episode, so at least he's getting the sleep he needs xx