I have an almost 3 week old Daughter and am struggling to manage with the pain of breastfeeding a tongue ties baby and the dependancy on me

[ErikaZ]

Hi,

I had a beautiful girl called Rosie almost 3 weeks ago and have been having issues feeding her ever since.

The first few days were OK as I expected it to hurt to begin with. The second midwife who visited me at home pointed out that Rosie had Tongue Tie. I pinned my hopes on the fact that this was the cause of the pain to my nipples and had the tongue tie removed. Feeding became a little more bearable and I expected this to improve as she got used to the new freedom in her mouth.

Before Rosie had the tongue tie removed I was using nipple shields to relieve the pain so she had got into bad habits which are now proving hard to change.

I have been to see breastfeeding advisors who emphasise the importance of a good attachment and that I often attach with Rosie's mouth too small. I am trying to keep her mouth wide open but even if I attach that way she then adjusts her grip closer to the nipple causing the pain and biting.

Rosie is also very irritable in the evening and throughout the night. It can be impossible to get her to sleep in the evening and a few times she has been awake crying for 6 hours before we have managed to get her down.

I am at my wits end with the pain and worry and don't feel that I can continue to be at her beckon call all the time. I dread the evenings and night times and spend the day worrying about her being grizzly and irritable, and the pain I have to endure to keep he quiet and fed.

I am determined to continue breast feeding but need this to get easier.

Has anyone else dealt with a tongue tie baby and come out of the other side still able to breastfeed?

Not dealt with tongue tie but our DD was similar to this at around 3 weeks. I was convinced she wasn;t getting enough and the latch kept going wrong.

We had a fab midwife who came out twice a day for latch help and it got easier. Also I expressed (this was at advice of feeding coordinator who said it wasn;t normal practise but becuase my issues after birth had affected latch/habits and milk coming in so check with your guys first.) and gave a few ounces in bottle (again check with people before doing this)

DD seemed to become more content and latch became second nature. She breast fed till....well she finished 4 weeks ago thn had what I think will be her final feed yesterday [sigh.....] at 18 months old

It will get easier - ask for as much help as you can: midwife, health visitor, breast feeding councillor, la leche league on the phone, go to breast feeding groups etc as this is very important for you and your family. They will see it as important too.

Also, my Grandma said to me : remember that you are knackered and bringing with feelings and hormones an be nice to yourself.

P.S. Congrats on your lovely baby girl

hi, congratulations on your baby rosie, she sounds just like my dd1, minus the tongue tie (whcih dd2 had though- snipped at 3 weeks, but it took a few more weeks to get the latch right, and that was my second bfed baby so i had experience, in other words yes bfeeding a tongue tie baby does get easier but it doesn't happen overnight).

a few things:

1. the behaviour you describe is unfortunately quite normal, many babies are fussy in the evenings (the classic "colic"), and alternate between clusterfeeding, crying, grizzling etc. they do eventually grow out of it, i know for dd1 it was around 10-12 weeks and i was ready to die by then!

2. to make YOUR life easier- get a sling for the evenings, just pop her in there before she gets grizzly, i know it definitely did the trick with dd2 and i so wish i had had one with dd1. i find that a ring sling works best for that purpose, and i kept dd2 virtually upright (tummy to tummy) and she was very comfy and burped majestically and slept beautifully so i think it really helped with wind issues. you could get your partner to share some of the carrying in the eveeings.

3. have you tried bfeeding lying down? somehow i think it really helps with getting the positioning right, and also it gives you a chance to rest. I have heard many women say that they only really cracked bfeeding once they allowed themselves to spend a couple of days in bed with their baby. If Rosie is your first- please do it!!! I so regret not doing it with dd1 and by the time dd2 came along she was lucky to get 5 minutes uninterrupted on the breast.

4. in general, have you tried different holds? maybe that's all you need to "restart" the latching learning process. Personally I have always loved the football hold as i could bfeed hands free and read a book in the meantime :-)

5. best advice i ever got re latching is to aim your nipple at the roof of the baby's mouth, so rather than putting her on straight, do it at an angle- i hope it makes sense. and don't be afraid to take her off and start again if you feel the latch is wrong and she is "biting". dd2 did that a lot.

I wish i could tell you it gets easier by week x but the truth is that it's a gradual process. i do admire you enormously for your determination to continue. the other thing i wish i had known with dd1 is that all that stuff about bad habits (wrt co-sleeping, letting them sleep in the sling etc) is just a load of crap, so don't be afraid to go down that route if it helps making your life and your bfeeding relationship a bit easier.

good luck!

Congratulations on the birth of your baby girl.

I'm sorry but I've no experience of tongue tie, but I do have experience of a DS who refused to sleep for most of his early life!

What we did was settle down together on the sofa every evening and cluster feed. He'd be on and off my boob most of the evening. I would put my feet up and watch DVDs and mumsnet. If he went to sleep I'd put him in his moses basket. He came up to bed with us when we went to bed, but he didn't sleep long between feeds.

When he got a bit bigger then he'd go a bit longer between feeds, and by the time he was about 3 months or so we "put him down" for the evening and not do the whole sitting on the sofa thing all evening.

It hurt to buggery in the beginning, but at some point it stopped hurting. I remember wondering why on earth anyone would feed for 6 months, let alone a year, and had six months marked on the calendar as give up day.

DS is now 2.4 years old and is still feeding. I'm also 31 weeks pregnant and was reminded of how painful it was in the beginning because in the early stages of pregnancy my nipples were really sore. It did wear off again.

It will get better, honestly. Someone useful will be along soon, I'm sure.

I have a ring sling I'd be happy to pass on to you if you'd like?

Its denin and big for warpping round.....

Oh yes, TV and mumsnet help lots

I have and I feel your pain! It's so hard to explain to others just how painful it is. The tongue tie snip can take quite a while to take effect, it did in my case as I think they have to unlearn their bad habits (that's just my own theory though) It's not quite the instant fix they promise
We had the tongue tie snipped at 4 weeks (no-one spotted it before then!) and by that time I was really at the end of my tether and how I got to that point I don't know, but it probably took another 4 weeks before things eased considerably. (Hopefully you DD tie was spotted earlier so you should be quicker) It was a combination of the tie snip, my DS improving his latch and the initial damage to my nipple healing (was quite severe)
One thing to try and hunt down is the exaggerated latch ( i think thats right) technique, apparantly this can help. It will get better I promise you. One thing I did for a short while when the pain got unbearable and the tie snip didn't seem to have worked ( I was ready to give up by then but felt too bad about it) I gave either an expressed or bottle in the evening for a couple of weeks, this eased my pain as I had chance to rest my sore nipple and DS had a good feed as I was told that their poor feeding technique is worse when they are tired and that is probably why your DD is worse in the evenings. I was then able to stop this bottle once things had improved.
The good news is once we got over this I went onto Breastfeed until well past a year old! I think I wanted to enjoy it after having had such a bad start.
It really will get better soon but try not to beat yourself up about it I wish I hadn't been so hard on myself at the time.
Good luck, hope things improve for you.

Just as an aside, have you checked the upper lip for lip tie, found out after stopping breastfeeding that this is less common but also can have an impact ( again this was missed in my DS!)

Hi

Congrats on baby Rosie. Sorry you have had problems with feeding. Ds had tongue tie though I didn't have it snipped I bf him for 11 months I however did have pain in the early days. Yes it is important to get the latch right so take her off and try again. Do you have any lanisoh cream?

The evenings can be the worst time and I found it didn't get easier until we implemented a bedtime routine around 6-8 weeks. Have you tried swaddling? This can work for some babies though ds preferred to be held.

I also fed lying down so at least I felt I was resting then I would get dh to wind and settle him to sleep. He was also very good at taking ds for long walks between feeds.

It will get easier, promise. Take care of yourself.

Wow, I wasn't expecting such prompt replies! Thanks for the messages it's so good to hear you're not the only one!! This Mumsnet thing really is a good idea.
I will definitely try getting all the help i can and see is we can improve the attachment. It's true that it's harder when we're both tired and I tend just to leave her her on when she's falling asleep, even if it's a bad attachment, not good for the state of my nipples!
The sling idea also sounds like one I will definitely try and will seek advice on expressing, it certainly would be a relief to have one less feed to worry about!

Have you had a little look under her tongue recently? Just occasionally the snip doesn't quite remove the whole tongue tie, so it might be worth looking to check if there's a little bit left at the back and if you think there might be you can request to go back to the place that treated her.

I agree that getting as much good help as possiblt with latch/positioning and attachment is crucial.

My ds (first child) had a severe tongue tie, snipped at 3 weeks. We had a lot of problems, but did get through it and he breastfed for 3 years 10 months in total. Those early weeks were really tough and it took a little while after the snip to improve the attachment to where it was comfortable.

And I'm afraid that being at her beck and call goes with the territory while she is so tiny. Try (if you can - hard, I know) to relax into it - this stage won't last long, but the best way to survive it is just to go with the flow - even if the flow means staying in bed all day feeding her. In the scheme of things, it will be over in a flash!

Good luck.

Just wanted to add my support. DD had a tongue tie and bf was excruciating. Managed to get it snipped and things did gradually improve, and we bf to 20 months.
If you can master the rugby ball hold, as somebody else suggested, that may help, as Rosie will get a different bit of your nipple.
I found that I had to hold dd's head very very firmly in place (felt as though I was squashing her so hard into me she wouldn't be able to breathe, but their noses seem to be designed for this!); and I had to watch her all the time so that if she slipped I could take her off and re-latch her straightaway.
Also watch her lower arm doesn't sneek in between the two of you, as that will make it harder for her to stay well latched. I'm afraid your wrists and shoulders will probably hurt from the effort, but this will lessen as she grows and gains more strength. Good luck and take care.

Congrats on your little girl . Hope you can resolve your latch issues. Have you tried feeding with you reclining on loads of cushions and baby lying across you?

Re the irritability, I did a bedtime routine in the evenings from an early age in response to this and I am a big hippy . Basically, after bath and lullaby, LO and I retired to a dark room for a very long lay down BF. Talking 2 hours at first! I just left her on the double bed as we co-slept so no hassle getting them to settle in the crib. DH and I would wake her up together before we went to bed for a feed so it was nice to share that.