10 day old and no milk in evening....help!

[Calico1]

I have a 10 day old baby and am trying to breast feed but have been topping up with formula on midwife's advice due to big drop in birthweight. I am trying to stop the top up feeds which is ok in the mornings but by evening she is feeding constantly (5 hours or more) and still appears to be starving hungry. I have had to give her a few oz of formula in the evening as I don't think she is getting anything from me at all. I have a two year old at home too so finding it hard to spend 5 hours with baby on the boob and look after toddler! I want to continue breast feeding but am thinking that it's not going to work....
Any advice please!

Hi, you are doing very well with 2children to look after! I have twins and when they were newborn they fed constantly in the evenings too, and I always wished I had more milk at that time. One of my babies would feed for hours on end and would only come off because I had to feed the other one. Your baby is building up your supply with all the feeding, so soon it should be a bit easier.

Maybe you could get a breastfeeding counsellor to check your baby's latch to make sure she is on OK. Your midwife should have checked it, especially with weight loss, but so many really don't seem to have a clue about breastfeeding, unfortunately. Also, maybe you could try wearing a sling that you can feed your baby in, so you can have hands free to look after your toddler. I have a 'closer' cloth one, apparently there is a position you can use to carry your newborn and feed them in it.

Hope it gets easier soon... La Leche League have a breastfeeding advice line: 0845 120 2918 which I have always found very helpful!!

All the best xxx

This is totally normal and called cluster feeding, it is to build up your milk supply and is to be expected. It's not the most enjoyable bit of the early days but get yourself comfy on the sofa with some DVD's etc, it won't last forever.

You could also try reading books with your toddler whilst bfeeding? Most people I know were out of this phase by about 8-10 weeks.

DC3 is nearly six months old and I can confirm this is totally normal in the early days.
She fed constantly from approx 7 or 8pm till midnight, before collapsing (and me within minutes).
When you have a newborn and BF you really do have to prepare for this for at least 6 weeks.
I'm not a health care provider so this is only my opinion but topping up compounds the problem. Cluster feeding is to build up your supply and if you disrupt it then you'll always be playing catch up.
I have a ring sling and used that so I could cater for my older children aged 3 and 5.
I've always gone to BF concillours for advise, HVs (and mine recently admitted it herself) don't have a clue, their BF training has not been updated since they qualified.

Thanks all - I must admit I gave in and allowed her 3oz of formula last night after she started screaming blue murder at 1am and was rejecting the boobs completely....

i can only echo the others and say that this cluster feeding is normal and will stop soon. but i do think that by giving her formula you stop the process of building up more milk.

please phone la leche who have helped me in the past.

this is completely normal and the hardest thing about breastfeeding in the early days as others have said.

mine were 22 months apart and DH was away alot when my youngest was born and it was hell on earth in the evenings . Stick with it ...it does get better.

I gave my youngest a formula feed for the first week in the evning to get him off to sleep for a while. He dropped this at a week old and was exclusively brestfed then until I went back to work. In fact when I needed him to take a bottle because I was going back to work he was a nightmare and rejected it out of hand!!

Keep feeding as much as you can but if you need to give formula just to give you some peace Im sure you will be ok.

AS others hve said also speak to La Lece they are brilliant

Good luck

ok thanks - will try to avoid giving her top ups. She is getting weighed again this morning so we'll see if she has put on any weight otherwise I expect I'll get told to up the formula intake. My husband isn't very supportive and can't understand why I don't want to give a hungry baby a bottle....

that is very sad calico. you have us supporting you!

how much birth weight did you dd lose? i think about 10% is normal...

your

Calico, it's always hard when you feel your baby is hungry and needs more - but if you continue doing what you are doing breastfeeding will end...that's the biology of it. It's a shame the midwife could not think of anything to help you when your baby's weight dropped too far except to tell you to give formula. This is sometimes necessary is extreme situations but it should always be done while protecting the milk supply, too (expressing, feeding the baby more often, checking the baby is able to remove milk effectively).

Even now, you do need a plan I think. Calling a breastfeeding counsellor will help you formulate one. She'll prob discuss feeding your baby much more often as this makes the milk, using both breasts every time and switching back and forth as well, having the baby skin to skin so you can respond to feeding cues quickly, possibly expressing, too.

Hope this helps.

thanks tiktok and warthog.
Lilian lost nearly 12% of birth weight in 5 days when I was just breast feeding and I was told we'd have to be re-admitted to hospital if she didn't put any weight on. She has since put on 60g in the last 5 days but it is still not much. I am feeding her constantly at the mo. She feeds for 20 mins - comes off the breast, falls asleep and then 5 mins later is crying for more....

calico - what are her poos like?

runny and very yellow - so that is good I think? Midwife has just been and she has dropped another 20g in weight - don't know what to do as I feel she is starving.....

Calico, have you thought about using a pump to express milk to keep up your supply and offering your baby formula as well? I'm saying this because my dd3 is 16 weeks old now and I'm successfully breastfeeding her still. It just works for me, I found exclusively breastfeeding very hard work and time consuming (I have four other children too you see), and this way I feel she's still having the benefits of my breastmilk. Just a thought .

Poos sound normal in colour and texture - how big are they and how frequent?

No, the weight loss is not good Are you confident about the weighing - baby naked, digital scales (not spring balance)?

I think it's reasonable to start working on this very seriously - expressing with an efficient, effective pump and using the resultant ebm to top her up after she indicates she has finished bf; breast compression (google it); careful observation of a feed by someone who knows what to look for. Is there a breastfeeding clinic in your area?

She does about 4 poos a day, not that big (about a teaspoonful).

Scales have been the same ones each day and are digital. She has been naked when weighed each time so I think it is pretty accurate. I have a breast pump and usually manage to express 2 or 3 oz at a time. I'll look up breast compression too. Not sure about a clinic in this area but will ask health visitor when she comes to weigh DD on Thurs. Thanks!

Just coming on to offer support as have been there. Tiktok sorted us out (ds4 was milk intolerant,caein so geting it through my BM) but once i gave up milk he satrted to thrive and at 10mnths is running around myliving room destroying it as we speak!

Cluster feeding is ahrd work and weight agin has to be mniotreed; are the nappies so wet they make athud when driopped? Do you get plenty?

A call from a BF Cunsellor would help but I still dont unerstand why tehya dvise formula, BM is just as calotific. Unless they think you are not amking enough milk in which case it needs closer investigation becuase thats very rare.

Slly question- you'renot anaemic are you? I was and when i googled it recently found there may be alink; starting meds amde me produce loads LOL

Hi Peachy - yes I am taking iron tablets for mild anaemia...

No nappies don't thud though!

All good points from Peachy, inc the wet nappies.

Calico - teaspoon of poo is a bit on the small side, and consistent with her not getting enough milk....Thursday to ask about the bf clinic is not soon enough; you need to be getting sorted today with some expert help and a plan.

have you got nu,bers for the counselling groups cal? happy to fetch for you (Am typing as I bf LOL)

Also get your bloods rechecked for anaemia as thast worth doing anyway.

If nappiesare not thudding thisreally does need sorting out before Thursday; assuming anaemianot severe and baby being fed very often and no history of dairy intol in family you need to be seen as am emergency. Did hv or mw check baby for hydration? (skin tone, smell of breath?)

Sorry for delay in responding - manic afternoon.

Thanks Peachy, I did speak to a bf counsellor today - she thinks that I am not producing enough milk yet - despite the epic feeding sessions and advised me to continue as I am until Thurs, however also got my sister (pediatric nurse) to come and take a look at DD and she was worried about dehydration as she said her skin looked 'papery'. So I did give her a bottle of formula this afternoon and will probably continue with the mixed feeding until I am satisfied that she is not going to dehydrate....I know this is going to affect the bf but don't feel I have a choice. I have been expressing milk too to try and stimulate supply - it's all been very hard work and I hope I can resolve it soon.

dd2 dropped a lot of weight when she was first born and I was adviced to express lots and top her up with that. I also took fenugreek tablets to increase my milk supply which I believe really worked. I know the awful feeling of thinking your baby isn't thriving and wanting to protect breastfeeding. It's a very vulnerable situation and I hope you get lots of help and support during this time.

On a happy note, after two weeks of expressing several times a day (btw, your nearest sure start centre might be able to lend you an electric pump) and fenugreek tablets things picked up and she is now a thriving, plump and breastfed 7 month old.

Calico how are you doing today? Is there anyone who can give you some help with your 2 year old so that you can concenrate on the feeding more?
Another thing to bear in mind - are you putting her to the breast regularly during the night? I had initial problems with supply and my BFC encouraged me to feed during the night as often as possible because this is when prolactin is highest (hormone which encourages milk production). I was actually setting an alarm to wake to express as well for a couple of weeks on her recommendation and that soon got things going. I am still exclusively BFing DS at over 7 months.

Thanks Sassy and Alibaba

I'll try feeding / expressing more at night. DD has been sleeping for 4 hours stretches at night and I am reluctant to wake her more often as 2 year old is up at least 2 times a night as well and I fear I'd get no sleep at all....

I gave DD a couple of oz of expressed milk in a bottle this morning but have just been bf so far the rest of the day. She really fights at the breast now....sometimes choking if the milk arrives too fast and sometimes twisting and squirming as if nothing is going in....it does make it rather stressful for both of us.