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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

breastfeeding and tooth decay

24 replies

fledtoscotland · 21/02/2009 21:41

just read a post in "behaviour & development" about cleaning teeth after a milk feed at night and one reply said that breastfeeding whilst co-sleeping could lead to tooth decay. am a bit at that.

i know that i should prob stop Ds1's bottle when he falls asleep but he's 17months old and likes his bottle before he rolls over to sleep.

am concerned about DS2 as we co-sleep and feeds throughout the night. when he starts to get teeth, does that mean i have to limit the number of night BFeeds in order to protect his teeth?

does milk after teeth cleaning really cause that much damage if the bottle is removed as soon as the milk is finished. (also DS1 never gets juice from a bottle, he only gets water or milk to drink during the day and thats from a cup. the bottle is a night/sleep thing)

TIA

OP posts:
DevilsAdvocaat · 21/02/2009 21:43

we just started giving ds a bottle of milk at 7, then at 7.20 story and songs.

you can always start reading to him whilst he has his bott so he associates that with sleepy time.

ds is 19 months.

hercules1 · 21/02/2009 21:46

I've posted before about this and most people have intelligently disagreed with my so I can only quote my own experiences. DS was bf till 4 and no problems (now 13).
DD was bf till 3 and had to have posts put into her top 2 front teeth.
Ordinary dentists said the damage was caused by her grinding her teeth (never heard her do this) and it was only after going back time and time again as her front top teeth were disappearing were we refered to a private specialist next to Harley street.
Paid a lot of money to get them fixed and were told by the specialist it was due to being bf at night and she often saw such cases and that ordinary dentists wouldne pick up on it - some special kind of rot apparently. Cant remember and tbh I was so horrified didnt take it all in.

If I were to have another child I would brush teeth after last feed and not feed again at night once teeth there.

DevilsAdvocaat · 21/02/2009 21:49

wow herc.
i had no idea, someone else said that earlier.

it seems logical though as bm is so sweet.

op, maybe you will want to reduce nightfeeds when ds is older anyway so you can get some proper sleep at night?

Original poster
fledtoscotland · 21/02/2009 21:51

hercules1 - thanks for that info. what i dont understand is how, when co-sleeping and feeding through the night do i manage it? i cant physically clean his teeth after every feed. I know this is hypothetical as DS1 is only a baby with no teeth but will be co-sleeping for some time yet and he is showing no signs of giving up night feeds in the foreseeable future.

i have been talking to DH about DS1 and cleaning his teeth (DS1 not DH ) after bottle before bed but DS1 creates such a fuss about teeth cleaning that at the moment i'm taking the quiet life option.

OP posts:
Original poster
fledtoscotland · 21/02/2009 21:53

sorry should say that DS2 is only a baby. DS1 will always be my baby even though he's a monster of a toddler now

OP posts:
hercules1 · 21/02/2009 21:55

SOrry no idea. I had stopped feeding dd already when I found out. Lots of people will disagree with me and as I said my 13 year old is fine and was fed for longer.

Original poster
fledtoscotland · 21/02/2009 21:58

thanks anyway hercules1. am just a bit as i just assumed that BMilk is natural so would be ok but of course anything other than water will cause decay.

might talk to our dentist when we go for our next check (in about 2months)

OP posts:
Grendle · 21/02/2009 22:09

There's some useful information onBrian Palmer's site. Kellymom also has an overview and other links. My understanding is that breastmilk alone does not produce tooth decay. For a start, the mouth has to be colonised by the relevant bacteria, eg by exchanging saliva through a kiss with an adult or older child who has said bacteria. Secondly, breastmilk alone is unlikely to cause decay. The problem arises when breastmilk is present in the mouth alongside ither carbohydrates. so, one important measure is to brush the child's teeth before bedtime in order to remove traces of the last meal, cow's milk, formula or whatever. Usually breastmilk is squirted straight down the back of the throat and does not pool round the teeth like milk from a bottle. However, when a child falls asleep feeding then the milk may pool in the mouth a bit. But, one study showed that immersing teeth in breastmilk ALONE was similar to immersing them in water, so again it's dental hygeine at bedtime that seems to be key.

Some children will get dental caries no matter what.

Most dentists seem to know little about breastfeeding, I don't think it's a big part of their training.

Original poster
fledtoscotland · 21/02/2009 22:23

thanks grendle. my understanding was the same as yours that breastmilk didnt cause decay. will ensure that when DS2 has teeth they are brushed last thing at night so its only breastmilk in his mouth during the night. he is such a boob-monster that i cannot see him giving up anytime soon.

I totally agree about good dental hygiene but at the moment DS1 has turned it into a battleground where he has to be pinned down so i can clean his teeth. am sure this phase will pass as he used to love him teeth being cleaned.

OP posts:
GreenMonkies · 21/02/2009 22:33

Ahh, the old "night feeds rot teeth" myth.

There is a lot of sugar in breastmilk, but there are also a lot of antibacterial agents. When breastfeeding the milk is delivered to the back of the mouth and doesn't really pool as when they stop sucking the milk stops coming out of a breast. As such, when they stop nursing and feeding and the suck becomes gentler as they fall asleep little or no milk is in the mouth. When a bottle is in the mouth milk flows out in a slow drip even if it isn't being actively sucked on, and milk is delvered much further forward in the mouth from an artificial nipple then from a real one. So milk from a bottle can and does pool and as it contains sugars but no antibacterial agents it can cause dental caries.

I'm probably not explaining this very well, try checking out these links;

www.kellymom.com/bf/older-baby/tooth-decay.html

playingitbyear.homeschooljournal.net/breastfeeding-tooth-decay-in-babie-and-toddlers/

www.brianpalmerdds.com/bfeed_caries.htm

Basically, no, don't stop night feeds. It's garbage.

Original poster
fledtoscotland · 21/02/2009 22:35

thanks. i sort of thought that but you know when you hear something and begin to doubt yourself. MN is great!

OP posts:
hercules1 · 21/02/2009 22:36

greenmonkies - any idea on my dd's teeth? Just the top 2 affected and teeth brushed every night etc and careful diet. No other problems with any other teeth.

hunkermunker · 21/02/2009 22:39

Possibly the enamel wasn't fully "there", Herc, on those two teeth?

hercules1 · 21/02/2009 22:41

I am sure she said it was either dry or wet rot and wouldnt have been picked up by ordinary dentists. Her teeth in a matter of months nearly disappeared and they kept telling me she was grinding them yet as we cosleep I was as damn sure as I could be that she wasnt.

hercules1 · 21/02/2009 22:43

hunker - have you seen the thread on breast and bottle feeding where a poster has said that aptimal is the best because of the prebiotics??

hunkermunker · 21/02/2009 22:44

No, I haven't, Herc. I will go and look now though. Thank you!

hunkermunker · 21/02/2009 22:49

Argh, can't find it - which thread, please?

hercules1 · 21/02/2009 22:51

It's the feeling low one in active conv

Original poster
fledtoscotland · 21/02/2009 22:52

thats the thread where i saw the post about not breastfeeding as it causes tooth decay.

OP posts:
Original poster
fledtoscotland · 21/02/2009 22:53

sorry - no its not . need to get my one braincell into gear.

OP posts:
GreenMonkies · 21/02/2009 23:23

Herc, how odd, DD1's are like this too (she's 5½). She has dinky little teeth, and they are kinda soft and look iffy. Her top front 2 get brown areas down the out sides unless we brush them extremely carefully, and I'm sure they are wearing down, although the dentist doesn't seem concerned about them. We brush her teeth morning and night and floss them most days too, yet they are not bright shining healthy looking teeth, but they never have been, not since they emerged from the gum.

However, DD2 (2¾) has big, robust, shiney white teeth, even though she doesn't like having them brushed (it tickles apparently ) and nurses at least twice in the night.

I don't know why they have such different teeth, they both eat the same diet of healthy foods (with some sweets/cakes etc) and have their teeth brushed twice a day. The only difference in thier diet is DD2 is cows milk intolerant, so drinks rice milk if boob isn't available, apart from that they eat the same stuff.

So, sorry, but I have no idea, and if you find an answer, please let me know!!!! (but it's highly, highly unlikely to be night feeding, as breastmilk doesn't pool at the front of the mouth etc etc........)

hercules1 · 21/02/2009 23:24

Thanks. I guess I'll never know!

Grendle · 22/02/2009 00:50

I wonder if it could be some difference that developed in the womb? I have a feeling babies are born with all their baby teeth in their gums. I don't say this to give you any sort of stick to beat yourself with, btw, I'm not saying something a mother does in pg might affect their child's milk teeth, just that it might have nothing to do with what happens after birth.

fledtoscotland -how old is your toothbrush-refusing ds? We've had probs at various times. Looking for tank engines coming in the big wide tunnel is a popular one, and my ds likes using an electric toothbrush (dentist's suggestion, even though he's only 3).

sandcastles · 22/02/2009 05:39

Grendle, Decidous teeth start developing while baby is still in utero, so it's possible that something prebirth could affect them.

We would need CoV to be able to clarify what, if anything would adversly affect, I don't really know that much about it, as it wasn't really something we cover in depth as dental nurses.

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