Extended BF; reasons for it please

[FloriaTosca]

Hi
I have been Bfing my Ds (pfb)for 16 months now..
However as time goes on and he is showing no sign of self weaning (still feeds on demand) which is not a problem for me, my Mother and my Dh have been suggesting more and more frequently that I should wean him off the breast.
Yesterday Mum asked to babysit at her house (she normally comes to mine while I work from home)saying she hadnt got her car for the day, but when I dropped him off she saw me off at the door saying "if we do this regularly we'll soon get him out of the habit"
Dh brought him home later than I expected, having missed 2 feeds then ranted at me when the first thing I did was offer the breast...but I was so engorged I was desperate! He then said that he was officially stating that he wanted me to wean now. When I asked why he said that "everyone thinks you should", that "he isnt getting anything from it anymore", that "you enjoy it more than he does", that "he is going to be asking for 'bitty'(a la Little Britain) when he is 20!"...he then spouted some daily mail trash about bfing being dangerous and making babies dehydrated
I said that when he read up on extended bfing and had at least a modicum of knowledge about the subject and he could come up with a more scientific reason for stopping now, I would consider his demand.
I am still upset. I dont want to stop bfing..my little boy is running headlong into growing up(walking at 8 months, talking at 12mths etc)bfing is the only babyish thing he still does and I want to hang onto my baby for as long as possible ( we are not having any more children)but this is an emotional reason not scientific. I remember reading something about weaning being best anywhere between 2.4 and 7yrs. Surely they are still getting benefit from bf after 12 months besides the comfort and closeness that my Dh denies is his real reason for wanting me to stop?

Wisknit, I have described the effect that you talk about as like a reset button. Everything is fine after a breastfeed.

hi, this is a bit of a hijack, but i do sympathise, i have had these comments from my mother and my lo is only just 12 months and dairy intolerant to boot, so bf is only option really, and much better than soya.

anyway, can i just ask you bf-ers.

How were your los eating ? My ds bfs pretty much on demand, but won;t hardly touch solids.
I have tried with holding for the morning but he still won't eat anything even though he is hungry. He also wakes every hour and half and feeds all night.

I want to have another baby, and not sure if I want to keep bf at same time, as i'm quite underweight now and have had a few miscarriages in the past.

Any advice?

Don't give up! You are doing the best for your baby - don't let people who don't know what they are talking about bully you into stopping before your LO is ready. As you know my DS is also feeding still and I am not stopping because people around me are getting weird about it. It's their problem not yours.

Cantsleepwontsleep; loved the reasons to be proud thanks
Kalo; we have similar problems when ds is teething with waking through the night demanding bf but he does eat solids normally so I'm sorry i can't helpin that dept...did you try purees or blw? My ds is not a fan of sloppy stuff and has always preferred to gum something to death himself rather than be fed from a spoon. Sympathy on the sleepless nights and totally understand about m/c worry having gone through 6 myself but apart from needing 500 cals a day extra to cope with the demands of bf I didnt think that bf could affect a pregnacy... I hope someone comes along who is more informed and can help you.
Stefka; Hi! You know me, I won't give up, at least not without a fight (and probably not then) Mum and Dh got me feeling very low last week about it ...it is very hard to continue without support ... but armed with all the information these lovely pro natural term bfing ladies have given me I feel more equipped to fight back.
I had a long discussion with Mum this morning and though she is a little sceptical she seems to have accepted my decision (with reservations) Dh is a bit more complicated so I have printed some of the links up and left them for him to read and told him the health benefits to me at breakfast this morning...(and as he has lost both grandmothers and a step grandmother to breast cancer he certainly took that statistic in).. I feel he hasnt opened up completely about his real reasons for wanting me to stop yet...(he is bit slow where emotions are concerned[rolling eyes emoticon])...but I now suspect that they are partly based in prudery (his whole family are terribly reseved physically)and partly in jealously...I haven't been paying him as much attention as I used to (for obvious reasons) and I think that 16 months of feeling lowest in the pecking order is wearing him down...I'm already trying to find a few moments for us time to redress the balance.
thank you for the support

Wisknit and mawbroon.. I agree with the reset effect...much, much more effective than anything else and another argument in the armoury

Floria, I found a useful technique when tackling the subject of bf is to do a drip drip effect.

Any time the non believers say anything positive about your ds, if you think you can possibly get away with it, then attribute it to natural term breastfeeding.

eg Your Mum: he is very content, isn't he

you: yes, I read somewhere that nursing toddlers are pretty calm in general

or

your mum: goodness me, he's getting independent.

you: oh yes, I am sure I read somewhere that allowing them to reach the next stage when they are ready helps them become more independent. And that's what I am doing by continuing to let him breastfeed.

etc etc

that way, you are not on the defensive about it and over the course of a few months the drip drip may have some effect.

thanks csws. I read somewhere that although bf when pregnant is ok, bf-ing can cause problems with implantation. once implanted then the nutrional supply is fine as long as eating well.

I want to bf for as long as possible but not 15 times a day. Which is what it is at the moment, and if i don't he shrieks like a little rumpelstiltskin!

ow do people night wean?

Hi kalo12,

Breastfeeding can interfer with implantation but that is only if your fertility has not yet return to normal (i.e. your luteal phase is the correct length to allow implantation - this is often one of the last things to adjust when you get your periods back)

I'm nursing my 35 month old daughter, my 15 month old daughter and I'm 7 weeks pregnant so breastfeeding doesn't always stop you getting pregnant . When you are the nutrition is divvied up as follows:-

Baby first
Boobs second
Body third

so as long as you eat reasonably or take your vits you would be fine.

Verity

kalo12 my ds1 fed on the same pattern as your ds - 15 times a day was normal for us at 12 months and he had little or no interest in solids. I remember wondering how we were going to reduce feeds as he would go ballistic if I tried to even delay a feed, and when I stuck to my horses, determined to get a 2 hour gap going, that was the only time he ever bit me - very deliberately, and very hard! Ouch.

The good news is that things changed very suddenly in the daytimes, once he discovered solids. He still loved his feeds, but somewhere around 13 months - just when I thought he was never going to get it - he did! Learning to walk probably helped - he had something else to distract him/focus on.

Night feeding was a different matter, and in the end (when ds1 was nearer 2) I called in dh, who snuggled him/sang him off to sleep, whilst repeating the mantra - "it's dark now, it's sleep time. See Mummy in the morning." We co-slept, but I had to stay out of the way until he was deeply asleep! He did sleep better that way, tending to wake for just one night feed, which he dropped, himself, at 2.9.

HTH

Floria, my ds2 had a chest infection at about ten months and a wheeze. The specialist I was referred to said I needed to accept he would be asthmatic and gave me an inhaler etc. I never needed to use it. I have to add that he was on formula exclusively (no colostrum even)until about 6 weeks old because he wouldn't latch on (and was a twin - various probs with our setup). But despite this wonky start he was latched on eventually THEN ended up breastfed until 2 years (about 6 feeds a day). His chest infection never reappeared after 10 months, he developed no asthma, has never had an earache, continued waking once a night even when no longer breastfed. My point is that breastmilk (along with other things like a good diet, exercise and sleep)kept him very strong and healthy and was not a reason for him waking at night. His twin who was breastfed from beginning and continued until two, was even healthier and stronger, and slept even better.
However when they were no longer breastfed at 28 months, (it seemed the right time to stop) I still felt as close as ever to them, and they were still my babies. So reassure your husband that the time WILL come when you are ready and the toddler is ready to stop. Perhaps you could structure the feeds as if you were offering meals or drinks and that might make your husband family less worried about the intensity of it all?

I think that I did offer feeds at particular times of day at 12-24 months rather than willynilly, say 7.00 (wakeup), 10.00 (coffee break) 1.30 (nap time) 4.00 wake from nap reviver, 7.00pm bedtime 2.00am (middle of night wakeful child zapper) so apart little comfort feed if baby fell over, tantrum etc I think I did structure feeds, and that led quite easily to self weaning.

I asked my NCT tutor (I'm a peer supporter) about bf and conceiving, and she said that in theory, as long as your fertility signs have returned (regular periods, cervical mucus around ovulation etc) that it should affect fertility, but that some people do just seem to find it harder to get PG than others when bfing. And if you have a history of MC, that you might get pressure from other health profs to stop bfing.

If you're interested in a relatively gentle way to move towards night weaning (we did it at about 21 months cos I had just had enough - DD was waking every 2 hours, on a good night) have you read Dr Jay Gordon? It is aimed at those co-sleeping but can't see why it couldn't be adapted. I liked it because it was adaptable eg you wouldn't have to necessarily to drop all feeds at once. Although I have to say that it only worked reliably when we introduced the kidsleep clock too, so DD could see when 'boob curfew' was lifted and knew she could ask for milk. Otherwise if she woke earlier, she'd still howl if I said 'no' to a feed.

BTW - also meant to say that I'm feeding DD 2.8mths, and I'm 20 weeks pregnant

Re the bf and fertility. I have been ttc no2 for over 2 years now with no joy. I have a regular cycle and ovulate every month (i check mucus and cervix etc) but my luteal phase is too short for implantation. I did get pg just over a year ago, but didn't get beyond 6 weeks.

I am now trying progesterone cream to see if it makes any odds or not. If not, I will wait until ds self weans and hope I am not too over the hill for another...

My 2y4m ds2 got over a dreadful sicky bug. He could keep nothing down - not even breastmilk - for two days. But I let him feed almost as much as he wanted throughout, because bm is in fact the best thing you can give anyone with a sicky bug. It has a far better ballance of salts/sugars/minerals etc than Dioralyte, and contains anti-inflammatories, too, which help the gut to heal.

I don't know how I would have coped had I not been bfing. How would I have comforted and soothed ds? Considering how weakened he was by the time he stopped vomiting, how much worse would he have been had he not had any nutrition at all?

After 24h of illness, ds's eyes were sunken, with dark shadows, and he was limp and lethargic. A HV told me yesterday that those are signs of serious dehydration, and that had I not been bfing him he would have ended up in hospital within a few hours, being rehydrated on a drip. But do you know what this ill, lethargic, breastfed toddler was doing within a few hours? Having a screaming tantrum because I wasn't letting him have as much food as he wanted.

The question is not: why breastfeed a toddler? The question is: why stop?

They will stop when they are ready. If you are ready earlier, then you will stop.

BTW, he was getting boiled water as well as bm. The bm did not cause the dehydration, it prevented it, and stopped it getting worse.

My Dd will not give it up either. She's 26 months and would rather have BM than solid foods. I think most people feel I should cut it out now ~ including my mum and even my dad said something along those lines the other day even though he was bf until he was 4.
I had wanted to stop by 18 months, but Dd has no intention of stopping so I'm continuing...(I think it pee's her dad off no end too, so I'll keep going until she's 18!)

thanks for all the advice.
notquitegrownup that has restored my faith in my dream of sleep at some point in the future!

Mij i am co sleeping too so will check out dr jay

Eversolololo - i was planning on stopping at 18 months - is it not possible? Is it easier sooner rather than later?

I really don't want to ttc and bf has have history of mc cos of non implantation and am also getting quite old so even though it willl break my heart to enforce any weaning I don't know if i can wait for a long time for self weaning.
is that really selfish?

well done to all that have continued bf, i fed ds until he was 34 months. he was just feeding at night and for a few secs and we just stopped. i have noticed that he has had more diarohhea since we stopped but thats probably just coincidence. i didnt care what people said and i still dont, it always amazed me that people could find it ok to stick a bottle in their kids mouth but it was wrong to bf, you carry on op. xxx

and we still co sleep!!

kalo12, I stopped feeding my Ds at 18 months with no problems at all. It was my choice and he complied. Dd wont comply! I guess that each child is different and they either will or wont accept your will. Good luck with getting what you want

Just a thought. I went back to full time work when Ds was 17 weeks and he had EBM whilst I was working and I nursed him myself when with him. With Dd, I'm at home full time with her, so perhaps it's the dependency/comfort that my Dd is getting that Ds wasn't getting full time.

Kalo, one of my friends conceived whilst bfing her first and she was 'quite an old mum' (as am I ).

Floria, I bf ds2 until he was 2. He didn't want to stop and neither did I. I had all the same sorts of things said to me that you have had. It did make me rather but I just ignored everyone. I would probably still be bfing now (ds2 is 2.3) but I had to go to a 6 day conference out of town and that sort of ended it for us

Today ds2 was feeling sick with a cold and put his hand down my shirt and said sadly "No milk there anymore" It really broke my heart I have to say.

I was rather torn about it towards the end b/c I still got uncomfortably engorged when I was away from him for too long and I have several more of these out of town trips to do this year.

It's a special time and you are right to cherish it.

ds says i drunk it all didnt i mummy!!!

Oh Jabberwocky. That is heart breaking
We have no good reason for giving up, I work from home and am never away for more than one regular feed time...it was just embarrasment/jealousy from Dh that made me even consider it...Your experience has made me doubly determined to let Ds lead the way and I wont care if he still wants "bitty" at 18 1

Kalo...for all that the specialists say about fertility after 35, our great-grandmothers were having children well into their 40s and even 50s. There is a thread here on MN full of women over 40 who are expecting or have babies/toddlers and some, like me, had more than age to contend with. I had polycystic ovaries, endometriosis, a genetic translocation making 50% of my embryos non-viable and (we later discovered)anti-phospholipid syndrome..I didnt start ttc until I was 40 but by the time I conceived my ds at 42 I had been pg 6 times ...3 of those 7 bfps occurred on the first time of trying ...What I am trying to say is don't worry so much about age causing problems...Personally, if I were you, I'd ttc whilst bf for a few months and only if bf appears to be interrupting your efforts then consider stopping bf.