Persuade me (or not, if you prefer!) not to introduce another formula feed...

[Hopefully]

DS is 15.5 weeks. Managed exclusive BF till 9 weeks, then introduced a bottle of formula for one night feed so DH could give me a break - DS was only waking once or twice in the night after his 10:30pm feed, but was taking at least an hour to settle afterwards every time, and I was going quietly insane.

I'm not sure if he's currently going through 4 month growth spurt, or teething, or what, but he's waking a bit more in the night (at least twice after 10:30 feed), and again taking a while to settle after feeding. He's also feeding a little bit more in the day, although not tons - previously feeding 3 hourly, now having a short (20 min) feed in between the big three hourly ones.

He's still only having the one bottle feed, as I figured that if it was a growth spurt I should feed him when he demands it to up my supply. However, the extra feeds day and night are getting a bit painful and very depressing - he feeds for 45 mins for his big feeds, so we are doing very little else. The other problem is that his sleep appears to be worse (harder to get to sleep for naps, shorter naps, but more overtired and grizzly), and we were wondering whether because he is all but asleep when he feeds, he is not tired enough to nap, but still needs it, iykwim.

DP asked, genuinely, if there was any reason not to top up with formula after each BF rather than bothering to up my supply. Obviously since DS is already having a bottle, the whole virgin gut thing isn't a reason, and as long as I continue BFing at all he will get immunity I assume?

I am happy (well, not happy, but willing!) to continue with the more frequent feeds if it's going to be better for DS, but I am honestly wondering whether it is. I have no intention of BFing beyond 6 months - might go to 8 months if it takes that long to slowly cut down the feeds, but certainly not committed to BFing for the long term - so don't need my supply to keep up indefinitely.

Rambly post, sorry! Any thoughts appreciated.

How long's it been going on? I had supply issues with DS at 17 weeks (after a stay in hospital) it was a nightmare for a couple of days then very quickly improved

i was very keen to breastfeed my younger two, and didnt introduce a bottle till eight months. completely stopped breastfeeding two weeks later.
i introduced bottles at much younger age with ds1. and by four and a half months, he didnt want breastfeeding anymore.
personally, i think that breastfeeding happens for such a short period of a childs existence, andf orumula feeding is such a major hassle, that it is best to continue with breastfeeding until solids have been started.
so, to answer your question, i think that even the one bottle of formula you have already introduced is a pain foryourself. not a help.

Hmm.... He probably began waking earlier from all his naps and taking longer feeds about a week ago, and has been really going for it (more night wakings, extra feeds in the day) for 4 days.

God, that makes it sound like I have an appalling tolerance level for suffering! It feels like a hell of a lot longer.

DP is back at work on Monday, so I won't be able to rest in the day as much as I am at the moment, which really worries me.

DS had a growth spurt around 4 months and fed (seemingly) constantly all evening.

And again at about 9 months - he became like a klingon in the evening/night time (although this could also be explained by the fact that I had to leave him during the day and he refuses all other forms of liquid!)

Is there any reason not to give formula? It's your decision, obviously, but am not sure that formula will be a panacea... For instance, you don't seem to have an adversion to feeding DS, but the time it takes? If so, then am fairly sure that ff and b/f take about the same time.

DS inhales a bottle of formula very quickly (on the slowest teats I can lay my hands on, he has 5oz in under 12 mins, and that's with stoppages for burps), whereas BF takes forever.

TBH I don't really know what I'm thinking formula will do, except mean I can have a decent length break on the weekends! I've tried giving him a top up after his last feed (when he was almost going through the night), and it made precisely no difference to when he woke!

I guess I'm thinking that if he had a formula top up after his BF he might not then need another feed before going down for his nap. Arghhhh, don't know really!

Have decided to battle on, come what may, until 16 weeks (next wednesday), and then if I'm still suffering, think about what to do then. With a bit of luck it will be more clear whether it's a growth spurt or something else and I'll be more clear about what makes sense to do, for both of us.

have you spoken to a bf counsellor? His feeds seem very long for a four month old?

No, I haven't. I've kind of got used to it and don't really think about it, but I suppose they are pretty long.

Perhaps I'll give one a call, it'll pass the time while I'm feeding

I think you need to give yourself a break and go with the flow - your baby is obviously hungry so feed him! Topping up with formula as often as necessary is fine in my view. I've got 3 boys and in my experience it's harder to exclusively bf boys - especially if they're big hungry ones! Ultimately, a happy, rested mum makes for a happy baby - so give yourself a break, give the baby some more formula and get on with enjoying your beautiful baby rather than beating yourself up over whether he's having too much formula/too little breast. I love breastfeeding for the intimacy and closeness; it's also great from a nutritional perspective but formula is fine too. My husband is from rural Ireland and was fed on unpastuerised cows milk from birth and he's turned out ok!! Do what's right for you.

it sounds a lot like my guy, who is now 23 weeks. His feeds have only recently dropped to more like 25 to 35 minutes, from 45, and he always seems a bit hungry. He also likes to have little snack feeds in between, and I'm lucky to get him down for any nap at all some days.

We also have on and off given one bottle of FF at 11pm. (which he takes quickly too!) Those didn't seem to have much effect on his sleep, which is still only in three-hour increments from one feed start to the next.

It sounds ideal to top up with formula but i decided not to because I got the feeling it would hit my supply.

sorry i don't really have any advice for you because i've basically been in the same boat!

one method i am aware of is to express a few times a day, and use that milk for top ups during the day feeds. the idea is to get him tanked up during the day so that he will feed less at night.

i can't bear expressing anymore though - i used to do it for the 11pm bottle but i can't really face it at this point.

Introducing more ff will reduce your supply so unless you actually want to give up breastfeeding I really wouldn't recommend this. I would definitely speak to a bfc - try phoning la leche league : 0845 120 2918 To me, it does sound like a growing spurt and he is at the right age for it. The more frequent feeding will settle down again once your supply has adjusted and it is more likely to adjust quickly if you aren't adding extra ff in. It is very easy for a baby to take a bottle of milk so just because he's taking some after a breastfeed doesn't necessarily mean that he needs it. I would let him breastfeed as often as he needs to for another few days (without any extra formula) and just see if it settles down. RE. the length of his feeds - some babies just take longer than others. I'm sure it can be frustrating if you're trying to get something done (have you tried a sling) but you could also look on teh bright side because it's time for you to sit down with a cup of tea, some chocolate and a good book/trashy tv!

They do have a huge growth spurt at about 3 mths, that's why so many Mums used to wean early. Give it another week or two I would!!

Thanks so much for your support and experiences.

I have decided to continue as I am until DS is 16 weeks (which is only till Wednesday!), and see how I feel. The last two nights have been less horrendous - he has slept one almost-4-hour stretch both nights, so I am feeling a bit more human.

I have decided that once I get to Wednesday, I will attempt to carry on as I am, but not feel guilty if I introduce a bit more formula. I already feel that my supply is increasing (occasionally get 'full' feeling, which I have literally never had since DS was born), so with a bit of luck the 'one more day' approach will get me through this, and if not, I'm not going to feel too horrendously guilty.

15 weeks = a hassle to bf. They feed loads and only you can do it. But it gets so much easier.

Dd is now 8 months and bf is soooooo easy. 3 a day and she sleeps 7-7. I'm soooo glad I persevered.

You have to feed them bm/formula for a year and bf gets really easy later on. It's worth keeping going for the ease later on

Hopefully, i'm in exactly the same boat as you. How are you doing? My DD got a cold at about 12/13 wks and started waking up more, I assumed it was the cold but think it coincided with a growth spurt - she's been waking up loads in the night, sleeping oddly (some days 2 hour naps, some days 45 min or less) and baby whisperer advises pumping between feeds for a few days and offering the EBM at each feed - and says that after 3 days, yr supply should have adjusted.

I'm just getting used to being on my own again but hoping to try pumping for the next 3 days as my DD's nightly habits are killing me!! WE've been topping up at the 7pm feed which makes me feel bad, having been advised by so many people NOT to top up - but then I feel relieved that I know she's full - she was taking over an hour to feed and it felt like something was wrong.

Why o WHY don't people warn you about all these things. I must confess everyday I think about my single friends and am JEALOUS. babies are lovely but this is the hardest thing I've ever done and I miss my old life.

Thought we were doing ok, despite insane 24 hour feeding frenzy (I posted about it earlier). however, this evening has just been horrific, DS has screamed within about 15-20 minutes of finishing a feed, and inconsolable until he goes back on again. And then he's so tired he's nodding off mid feed, and then he's waking hungry again...

Boo hoo!

my goodness, I've been much less steely than you, I've given the odd bottle during the day in the past couple of weeks just to know that she's full and not going to wake up. Am very impressed with you soldiering on.

I may not manage to for much longer! Although giving myself a mental deadline of tomorrow evening has helped, even though when it comes to it I'll probably end up persisting for another day or two before using any more formula.

Mostly laziness tbh - can't be bothered to make up bottles on a regular basis, and am trying to avoid it!

Hopefully - you're doing great. It IS so tiring but you will get there. Have you tried lying down to feed him again so you can at least doze a bit? In a few days this will have passed and you will be looking back on it feeling so proud of yourself for coming through it. Just take it one day at a time - one feed at a time and soon they will start to space out. Maybe your lo is coming down with something and it is unfortunately coinciding with his growth spurt - hopefully if it is that it will have revealed itself in the next day or so! Give yourself a big pat on the back - and a HUGE piece of chocolate for getting this far!

I am sipping quietly on a glass of very expensive wine to make myself feel better. it's working a teensy bit.

Good for you! You definitely deserve it!

Hi. I have a big hungry boy, and we've found that some nights formula is the only thing that will fill him up enough to go to sleep. I have plenty of milk so it's not a supply issue, it just seems not to satisfy him sometimes. I bf first and if he won't settle then add the formula - he's only 8 days old and we've only done it a couple of times - listen to me making excuses!

Overall totally agree that bf is best and he's bf most of the time, but life is full and if the odd bottle of formula helps then don't focus on it and make yourself feel bad.

xx