PLEASE HELP my friend desperate to breastfeed four week old

[Peckarolloveragain]

I would really love some support for a friend of mine. Her baby is 4 weeks old and was born weighing around 9lbs.

She was 12oz under her birth weight at last weigh in but had gained 4oz again when weighed yesterday.

She had tongue tie that was snipped around 10 days ago.

Feeding problems still remain however, baby is rejecting the breast adamantly whenever she tries.

She has sought help of a BFC who said that whilst her weight was low it was important to concentrate on expressing and getting it into her to get her weight up so that she can cross that worry from her list.

My feeding of my third child was very similar to this which resulted in me exclusively expressing til 6 months and I still have very unresolved feelings about having to give up on breastfeeding.

I would so love to be able to support her so that she can crack this and go on to feed happily.

She is getting all of the usual "just give her a bottle" etc remarks but really really wants to keep going.

I am going to send her the link to this thread, hope I have got the details right.

Any and all input would be really welcome

THANKS SO MUCH

xxxxxx

Hopefully Tiktok or someone better informed than me will be along to help shortly. Is she bottle-feeding the ebm? If so, could nipple confusion be the problem? I think usual suggestions are lots of skin to skin and maybe try to feed in the bath when they are both relaxed and milk might flow a bit quicker. Or perhaps try massaging the breast beforehand to get the milk flowing (this works for me anyway ) or expressing a little bit so that the nipple tastes of milk right away? Have you had a look at kellymom?

Hope some of that is useful and not really bad advice - I am happy to be corrected if so!

What Hoochiemama said. She could try being as available as possible with the baby tucked in her shirt naked, no feeding bra on etc so boob is ready when asked for.

And the BFC is right actually: if she is hungry, she won't have enough energy to feed. I have had nursing strikes but much later but I know how lethargic a hungry baby is sometimes - I imagine it is even worse in a new one.

So. Expressing where possible, and trying to feed with a cup, spoon or dropper would be a good idea. Most tiny babies can 'lap' from a bottle lid or feeding cup... there's an online video somewhere showing how to do this.

If really really desperate a bottle or two of expressed milk shouldn't do any lasting damage to BF if she is determined. But the important thing will be to get the baby alert enough to feed - which in itself demands a lot of energy.

Most websites/people who know about this say that a baby who won't feed usually can't feed. The answer though isn't necessarily formula - EBM will do if available.

Now, if EBM is NOT available, I would suggest going back to the counsellor or ringing a helpline for advice on giving formula but intending to BF long-term...

Hope this helps - let us know how she gets on. With the right advice and support, she can probably do it.

Has she discussed trying a nipple shield with the BFC or even a line feeder? These are obviously quite invasive but could be worth trying, anything to keep bf-ing going. There is no harm in consulting another BFC or experienced midwife who may have a different approach even if the first one is good. Already what she has done is excellent & she sounds quite determined! Bf-ing can be "challenging" even without any particular issues. The main thing would be making sure she has support as you say, so also see if there are local breastfeeding groups that could offer support. If she does have to go onto mixed bottle feeding it doesn't have to be the start of a slippery slope into total formula feeding if approached correctly. Best of luck to her & the babe.

Definitely skin-to-skin. Offer breast every feed, but set a time limit on how long you will persevere, say 10 mins. Then give half EBM. Then try breast again as sometimes when baby is not so hungry it can work! Set a time limit again. If unsuccessful, rest of EBM. I know someone who had not fed her baby successfully once, by then time she came to our group at about 6 weeks. After a week or so of doing this, she was exclusively breastfeeding!!! Patience, try not to get stressed and keep going, try EVERY feed.

I'm not sure the 'concentrate on expressing to get the weight up' comment is actually that useful! She should be helping her to latch baby on! Then the weight issues would sort themselves out and baby would be breastfeeding!!!

I had a baby who would not latch on. I had some success with the following:

If a bottle has to be given, strip off and feed the baby skin to skin with the baby in a BF type position with the nipple next to the bottle teat.
Skin to skin as much as possible
Have a bath together
Keep trying but never force the baby or make him carry on when distressed (or mum is distressed) as it creates a negative feeling towards the breast
Don't worry about when the baby last had a feed and might be hungry etc - just try constantly as babies need to suckle for comfort as well as food

I have heard very positive things about biological nurturing when babies are refusing to latch on even after a few weeks.

Finally she might want to speak to a different BF with a different perspective on this. I hope she succeeds.

This is a tricky problem - I can see why the bfc suggested expressing, prob not to get the weight up, at least not now that the weight seems to be going up, but to ensure the milk keeps being produced. If the baby rejects the breast without even coming on every time then epressing's going to be essential..not just to get the milk out and then into the baby, but to ensure she keeps making it.

Some good stuff already here about keeping the baby close and keeping everything nice and calm.

Kathryn says the bfc should be there helping to get the baby on - but maybe the bfc (a volunteer) is not available or maybe the mum lives miles and miles away. Often, though, someone being there can give confidence, and she can always speak to another bfc if this one is not able to help in the way she wants, or she can find one who can see her. Hope things work out well for her.

Thanks so much everyone for your input, baby gets very upset as soon as she is offered breast. She has tried in the bath, night feeds, feeding when not so hungry and she just gets very upset.

The BFC is very good as I visited her when I was having very similar problems and she helped me get my breast refuser on the breast.

I think she was going to ring her again tonight.

I think her health visitor has suggested a supplementry feeding system where the little tube goes in whilst she tries to feed, suppose this may help if the problem is frustration at slow breast.

Do you think there is any use in domperidome/supplements?

Oh and she has tried nipple shield too, no joy.

Thanks again

Is the problem slow breast though, or just preference for the bottle? Has the baby every been subjected to a bit of rough handling in the name of encouragement, maybe a MW forcing his head onto the breast? That is what made my DS refuse even though there was more than enough milk there. No amount of extra milk made would make a difference for him and the nursing supplementer didn't help because his problem was refusal to latch at all.

The good news is that with trying the things I mentioned he did latch on at 8 weeks and fed a few times. I then had thrush and then had to go back into hospital again so BF direct never worked out for us in the end, but I believe it would have done if that hadn't been the case. Apparently most babies will latch on at about 8 weeks even if they haven't beforehand, with the right encouragement.

I hope your friend is successful

Hi, not sure if its just slow breast or what, I think she is going to try and come on tonight and read the messages and tell us the full situation!

She had some success yesterday with a few very short feeds so hopefully things can be sorted

Had a similar problem with my ds when newborn (and he's still bf at 13mo now, so there is hope!). One trick that really helped with ds was to dab EBM all over the breast and just let the baby snuffle about until they eventually find their own way on to the nipple. Might be a less stressful way for them both? Good luck to your friend.

Oh that is great - if he is latching on and feeding even for a short time then there is every hope.

Yep, even short feeds are really encouraging. Tell her she's brilliant and to keep on going! It'll all happen soon by the sound of it!

Yes! I tell her she is doing so well and if you are reading this, you are doing SO well!! xxx