matthew wright and biggins have just drunk bm on the the ws.. saying its disgusting and kangoo balls are nicer

[milkgoddessmakesthefinestmilk]

im actually in shock !

I'm aware of this study - the professor behing it even said it was inconclusive and that larger studies were needed.

I have not read the IQ studies. On this point I too am suspicious and if they really didn't control for class/status, they are dodgy. And it is quite reasonable to question such research on TV.

Nor did I see the programme. But I have seen it. i can imagine.

But none of this excuses the general anti-BF attitude that is allowed to fester openly in this country. And I imagine there was NO reference to all the other research which does show the benefits of BF? Or was there?

I did see it.
There were some pro BF views and there were some anti - ie both sides were covered.

I have complained to ofcom. One-handed typing whilst bf-ing.

I have tasted my own BM and it did not taste disgusting, it was like very creamy cows milk with 10 spoonfuls of sugar in it.

I have also tasted C&G once and it was horrible.

I have wretched though at the smell of my friends Nutramigan milk, it is vile.

wilf, the person yesterday that was ment to covering th bf side,was not exactly articulate iykwim
[theres more about this on the other thread.]
i know im not either, but im not voluntering to go on a chat show to talk about it.
certainly did not get her points or views over well., or at all really.
why could they not get someone from the ntc or somewhere?

well done, zipps, im drafting mine out now.

im not interseted in the iq benifit thought, just the comfort factor for baby and the healthy benefits really

sweetkitty, yes it just the most wonderful, extremely FRESH milk there is
it doesnt even smell either.
unlike formula

milkgoddess - it makes sense that something fresh from source is going to taste much better than something pasteurised, highly processed and then dried. I bet milk straight from the cow tastes much nicer than the stuff you get in Tesco's as well.

Also the proof is on the poo. It doesn't smell horrible at all because there is hardly anything wasted. I hated the change in the smell when I stopped bf-ing my two year old!

My friend was actually crying when she was given nutrimigan as it smelled and tasted so bad, she felt like she was poisoning her baby. He guzzled it though (and brought it all back up thats anotehr story) but it was recommended by GP/HV/paed.

Oh yes poos definitely get interesting once wenaing kicks in.

sweet kitty, your so right, i bet fresh cows milk, is much nicer too.

sprocket, another great point, i wonder what gillian mc whatehername would makes of the poos !

"That's NOTHING TO DO WITH OFCOM !!!"

Oh fgs give it a rest! I've already got one mother! Right I think I shall complain to Ofcom now, just because I can

Fresh cows milk is indeed much, much nicer than the pasteurised stuff you get from the supermarket. My father was a dairy farmer and we used to drink it (almost) straight from the cow! Lovely! It also explains why I have super strong nails and hair.

Anyway, back to the point. I saw some of MW this am and was absolutely flabbergasted at them sniggering and pretend retching over the bm. I have sent the show an email saying how disappointed & disgusted I am with the show -- how it could put some Mums off bf in the future and how I sometimes find it challenging bf in public because of some people's misconceptions and programmes such as this will only make that worse.

Nancy fwiw you are incorrect or at least out of date
there has been some more recent research into bf/iq which tried made some more progress into distinguishing social factors, by studying babies in Belarus

here

what makes me genuinely very angry though are nonsensical and ridiculous attempts to suggest that there are somehow "two sides" to the "argument" about bf, and that there is somehow a "pro-bf" camp and and "anti-formula" camp. to suggest that there is some sort of controversy and that women are at each other's throats about it is nasty and insidious.
there is no argument. the scientific research is absolutely over-whelming. women should have a free choice about feeding their babies. we should be concentrating on supporting women to make the choices that are best for them and their families, rather than whipping up a groundless and distracting "controversy" to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

yes harpsichordcarrier I am aware of this study. Here's what New Scientist say about it.

"The study is limited by the fact that the researchers don't know whether the positive effect on intelligence scores comes from breast-feeding or from characteristics of the mothers who are more likely to nurse. The researchers didn't include the cognitive abilities of the parents."

I'm just trying to make the point that it is perfectly ok to question studies linking breastfeeding to IQ - that was all Matthew Wright did. He mentioned other benefits and did not question them.

Agree that studies of all kinds are there to be questioned.

I've never listend to Matthewi Writhgt so accept he might be an arse. But I really don't see how this media stunt will jeopardise the future breastfeeding choices of women.

yes of course it is perfectly OK to question studies
but really, this is not only what MW was doing
he was trying to whip up an argument where there is none.
as you said:
"There were some pro BF views and there were some anti - ie both sides were covered."
this is what I object to. what exactly is an "anti" bf side? and what possible positive purpose is served by taking sides?
how does that help women or babies or families?

The topic of the debate was whether the pro breast campaign made FF feeding mothers feel guilty or inadequate.

In order to have a fair debate you have to hear both sides of an argument.

To say there is no argument is not true. Look at the posts in this site day in and day out.

he's whipped up a bit of a flurry on here. Maybe that was his aim, to whip up those who would bother.

yes, but hold on that makes no sense
yes it is perfectly legitimate to discuss whether the pro breast campaign made f-feeding mothers feel guilty or inadequate.
what has that got to do with being "anti-bf"?
why is it necessary or even logical to take sides about that?
why, if he genuinely wanted to discuss that issue, did he bring into question whether "breast is best"?
totally irrelevant and pointless and wrong.
why would supporting ff mothers mean being "anti-bf"
it's just fuzzy logic.

Ok - well maybe 'anti bf' was the wrong phrase.

Throwing a topic open to debate doesn't necessarily mean you have to take sides. it can sometimes mean that you are forced to consider the other's viewpoint and that can only be for the good.

The issue was whether the campaign undermined some women it wasn't about questioning whether breast milk was superior.

its not a matter for ofcom though

all the agencies that beign with of are there for when you have exhausted other more direct approaches so you dont go to ofwat about water until you have tried to resolve the issue with severn trent etc

and if no code or law is broken then it is immaterial anyway

Do you really really think that anyone watching that show who was going to breastfeed, will now not breastfeed just because of what he said ??

i am deeply sceptical

unless someone actually says that about themselves

perhaps my breast milk was just particularly unpalatable lol cos i do agree with them

i would not have been able to drink a cupful

but then that doesnt matter does it as it is for babies and any grown woman would think that too

who cares whether a couple of nobs on tv like breastmilk?