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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

Everyone says I should ff..... isn't there another way?

31 replies

Dolorescat · 24/03/2008 09:50

Hi everyone, I'm new to MN but was hoping that you might have some ideas/advice as I'm getting very confused (cross eyed face).

I'm bf my (nearly) 7mo ds. He's my first and I'm really enjoying the bf. However I am getting almost no sleep and my back is aching from lifting him in and out of the cot. When I get up in the morning I'm hobbling about for hours and I've begun to dread the night shift.

I think my son is doing what is called 'reverse cycling' as he is a big active boy who will only have a few 'sips' during the day as there is far too much rolling and yelling to be done.....and so he still feeds 2 hourly at night. My family and friends keep telling me I should ff... the way they go on you would think I'm bf a 15 yo for God's sake. I'm finding it very disheartening.

I was thinking that the answer is maybe to co-sleep... has anybody else introduced co-sleeping at this late stage. Is it safer now that he is bigger/older? I'm very nervous about it as I have seen a baby in A+E who was killed while co-sleeping. I was thinking that we could just put the mattress on the floor and then I don't need to worry about him rolling out. He sleeps in a baby sleeping bag.
Sorry such a long post but would appreciate your thoughts.

OP posts:
StealthPolarBear · 24/03/2008 09:53

Yes, we started co sleeping a lot more often recently (about 10mo). Also done mattress on the floor as we have a smalll bed which is a good compromise.
Have you tried feeding him during the day in as dark and calm a place as possible?
Personally I don't think ff is the answer!

TheAntiFlounce · 24/03/2008 09:55

You need a bedside cot. Can you take the side of his cot of and put it next to the bed?

StealthPolarBear · 24/03/2008 09:57

Should have mentioned although I'm sure you've thought of this - if you are going to do mattress on floor make sure you have a stair gate!
Also, we slep on futon so mattress n floor is pretty much a bed extension for us

BabiesEverywhere · 24/03/2008 09:58

Co-sleeping can work very well, we co-slept between 0 and 6 months, however my DD and I sometimes nap together and she is 19 months old.

I understand if you follow the guidelines (no drugs/alcohol or excessive tiredness in the parents, must be in a proper bed not a sofa) that reduces the risks to an IMO acceptable level, plus the SIDS risk is reduced by room sharing with your baby.

We sidecared our cot to our bed, which gave us extra spare and I didn't worry about her rolling off the edge.

I can't see how FF would help your situation, why add buying, making, cleaning, sterilising to your work load make things easier for you

Oh, maybe offer more milk during the evening, might reduce the amount of nursing requested at night.

Good luck

BabiesEverywhere · 24/03/2008 09:59

spare space

Original poster
Dolorescat · 24/03/2008 10:21

Wow very quick response, thanks everyone.
I completely agree that ff just sounds like a lot of hard work to me, which is one of the reasons I love bf so much as no bottles to sterilise and no great big bags to cart about when i visit friends etc. (although the boobs are getting quite heavy to carry iykwim ).
I think my mum is under the impression that he will take more during the day and be fuller at night if he is fed from a bottle. I don't know if that is necessarily true. Solids seem to have made no difference to his appetite. If anything made it worse.
I live in a flat btw so don't need to worry about stair gate, but take the point about baby proofing the room thanks.
Have tried to feed him in the bedroom with curtains drawn during day but makes no difference, he just smiles and burbles at me and then slaps and pinches my breasts (ow)!

OP posts:
Original poster
Dolorescat · 24/03/2008 10:31

By the way I'm really angry about the way formula is packaged and sold. I had not noticed before as I have never bought it but the other day was looking at formula in supermarket. All the claims of probiotics and fatty acids etc made me feel like I was somehow denying my son something wonderful until I pulled myself up and reminded myself that breastmilk has twice as much of everything!
Makes you feel less confient in your own body doesn't it? Especially as I was told the other day that my baby needs vitamin drops because I'm 'still' bf him.

OP posts:
ib · 24/03/2008 10:52

We co-sleep on a mattress on the floor too, with ds in a sleeping bag. It works fine, you'll definitely get more sleep that way.

I'd ignore the nonsense about vitamin drops, if I were you.

CarGirl · 24/03/2008 10:56

If co-sleeping doesn't help then you could try taking him somewhere dark & boring to feed during the day in the hope that he is less distracted. Or you could put your self through a few days of hell by refusing some of his nights feeds to make him hungrier during the day and break the cycle that way. FF not the answer though it's just either accepting it or changing when he feeds IYSWIM.

Also as he weans he may be less hungry at night anyway.

sweetkitty · 24/03/2008 10:57

Agree with the bedside cot idea got one for DD2 wish I had one for DD1 it's fab.

Anytime there is ANYTHING the matter with a BF baby the usual "advice" is to give a bottle, don't know why!

Sailingonthedresser · 24/03/2008 11:09

Yes, started co-sleeping at 6-7 months with first out of desperation. It saved my life, I started looking forward to going to bed again! You do need to follow all guidelines carefully though. Make sure it's always baby between you and edge of bed not between you and another adult or child. A mattress is good but you'll still want it to be close up against a wall on the baby's side I think. A bedside cot is great early on (used one for my second) but relatively soon (small number of months) you'll probably be needing to drop the base for safety if the baby starts pulling themselves up, and once the base has dropped so it's not level with your bed any more you lose some of the main benefit of it as an extension of the bed on the same level. If you can afford it, and keep your current cot for naps so that can be the one with the base lowered earliest, it could still be worth it though as you could sell it on.

Is the baby having enough naps during the day? I have heard that frequent waking like that can be due to overtiredness and with hindsight wonder if my first had that problem. Try for an earlier nap during the day, as well as addressing the nighttime stuff? Good luck!

StealthPolarBear · 24/03/2008 11:15

Agree, in general, (although not at the moment ) I have always found that more sleep in the day = more sleep at night. In fact when DS has been teething / slightly under the weather there was a day when he slept for about 3 hours, I alwys knew that meant the worst was over and he'd be back to his better habits that night!

fabsmum · 24/03/2008 11:28

Can I throw something else in here?

I stopped feeding my first at night at 8 months, my second at 13 months and my third at 18 months (I got more tolerant of night feeds as my family got older).

I carried on bf during the day with all three. What I noticed was that as soon as I stopped bf at night all three ate twice as much during the day and it really only took a few days to correct the day/night balance in terms of their calorie intake.

I know it seems like a drastic solution, but in babies of over six months are usually capable of going without a feed at night if they're eating well during the day. The hard thing is stopping the night feeds without lots of trauma and crying. My lot are fairly amenable and yes - I did have a couple of horrid nights with each when they cried A LOT and broke my heart (I offered them a cuddle and water from a cup instead of a breastfeed), but it literally was only a couple of nights and then they slept through.

It's just a thought. I know it's not for everyone.

CarGirl · 24/03/2008 11:32

Mine that were all Bf were not feeding at night at all from 4 months, 3 months and 3 weeks respectively - they can do it but they older they are and more frequently they are feeding the harder it is to do those few nights of refuse them. It's a sanity balance though!

Maggieb52 · 24/03/2008 11:38

my little boy was the same during the day. The only way to feed him was to go into a quiet dark room where he could focus on feeding. Any noise would distract him so this was the only way. I tried with formula too but it was probably the worst thing I did as he stopped eating for me as he was filling up on formula and he became such a fussy eater. my dd is still bf at 19 months and she has a fantastic appetite and will eat everything. don't listen to the philistines. Carry on with BF as long as you feel it is right!!

Original poster
Dolorescat · 24/03/2008 11:44

I'd never heard that about daytime naps/night time waking, interesting.
My ds was never a good day time sleeper would only cat nap a few times a day up until a few weeks ago. Now though he is getting better at a longer daytime nap.. I will work on that more aswell then, thanks.

OP posts:
Original poster
Dolorescat · 24/03/2008 11:57

I think I 'cross posted' there and missed a few of the comments...
thanks for the breastfeeding support, I need it at the mo!!
I do feel that he has got into a viscious circle with night feeds and then not being hungry in the day. He was very keen on solids up until this started but now he is not so keen on solids in the day either. I was considering offering water a couple of times at night just to see if this helps to get back in a good cycle.
Maybe I am just too soft because I can't bear the screams at night. I also feel sorry for my dh as he has to go to work on such a poor nights sleep.

OP posts:
fabsmum · 24/03/2008 12:38

It is hard to hear your baby cry it's true - but you need to remember that you're not withdrawing your comfort or love, only your boobs and only at night!

I do think it's important though that if you decide not to continue the night feeds you have to be consistent otherwise you get into a terrible mess. As I said - with mine they all slept through after a few days so although the crying was hard, it didn't continue for long.

BabiesEverywhere · 24/03/2008 13:33

I disagree, withdraws your 'boobs' IMO does equals withdrawing comfort. There is a reason that mother nature makes it hard for us to listen to our babies cries, we are conditioned to respond promptly to our babies needs.

My DD simply outgrew her need for comfort and calories at night but if she does have a bad dream and asks for milk I would still nurse her, day or night.

foxythesnowman · 24/03/2008 13:47

I've been co-sleeping with DD since birth and she too is a night-feeder. She doesn't have a sleeping bag, I make a space between our pillows and move them down so effectively her head was above the pillows (helps that both DP and I are short-arses!). Now she's 8 months I worry less, but she still feeds more through the night than in the day.

Truth is, she sleeps better on her own as she doesn't root around for me. I'm sure she'd be able to go through the night, but uses me as a 'dummy' when she enters the light sleep phase - so can be 3 or 4 times a night. I do agree with Fabsmum, and Babieseverywhere to a degree. There are other sources of comfort, be it a dummy, blanket, or something else come to rely on. My LO relies on my breasts, and I'm beginning to sometimes wish she didn't!

CarGirl · 24/03/2008 13:51

Yes forgot the whole comfort thing - that is providing him with an alternative if you decide to withhold milk from him overnight.

callmeovercautious · 24/03/2008 13:58

Ignore the comments about Formula. It won't help.

You can either co-sleep or withdraw the feeds, say one at a time, gradually refusing more and more until he is getting no Milk at night.

OR you can give it a while longer and see if the more solids he takes starts to make a difference.

I went for the last option (easy route as far as I was concerned) with night wakings and she started doing all nighters very gradually. Sleeps 12 hours now at 18m but that only started around Christmas time. Before then she would go 3 or 4 nights then revert back to one or two wakings for a night or two.

Original poster
Dolorescat · 24/03/2008 14:06

I think he is genuinely hungry or thirsty as the dummy won't do it for him when he wakes in the night. I did wonder if he couldn't fall asleep without a bf, but if I put him in his cot sleepy but awake he will go to sleep on his own at bedtime.
I don't have a strong opinion about refusing night feeds/babies crying and don't want to critise anyone's methods, but I just don't think that I would be able to be firm and consistent enough to do it effectively and would end up making him confused.

OP posts:
pistachio · 24/03/2008 14:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

CarGirl · 24/03/2008 14:14

Well DC I would pursue the co-sleeping option then. I have used all my dc's cots with the dropside removed and they've been fine - certainly makes your bed wider!

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