So how knackered and hormonally weird does feeding an 11 month old normally make one feel? or do I really have PND

[MrsJohnCusack]

That's it really. Sleep has been a bit pants but I moved out of the bedroom and onto the sofa about 2 weeks ago (DS's room isn't ready yet, needs some work before he can go into it - hmm, must get on with that) and he is sleeping better now. occasionally I have to go in and feed him maybe once - and now he is suddenly cutting 3 molars which isn't halping. BUt anyway, I am not as knackered as I have been

but I am just a dried out old husk really. I am knackered, grumpy, shouty, dizzy a lot of the time, feel like my eyes are going to spontaneously close in the early afternoon, tearful, miserable, finding it hard to switch off and go to sleep etc. etc.

I had a load of blood tests - iron, thyroid, liver, blood sugar etc - which are apparently all fine (couldn't believe it, even my iron stores which were comically low when I was pregnant). I cried and cried when I heard this, I really thought there must be someething actually wrong that we could sort out

So, the doctor will want to discuss PND< which I had first time round. but I'm not sure that I'd be feeling miserable if I wasn't so knackered TBH so i'm quite reluctant to diagnose that.

Finally, round to the point - am feeding DS 4 times a day and sometimes in the night, he also eats enough solids to sink a battelship (yet has dropped from above the 98th centile at birth to under the 50th - still off the scale for length though, and is very active crawling etc.). I won't be giving up, but DH wondered if that was adding to the general knackerdom and stress. Periods came back 2 and a half months ago as well. Also, having dropped all the pregnancy weight and more easily within a few months, now I'm back to my usual overweight and CANNOT shift any more despite really not eating that much and going through days where I don't have much appetite

If you read all that (really long, sorry, but quite cathartic), could the breastfeeding be contributing? As I say, I won't be giving up, but it would be nice to know

or any ideas of what could be up
and I would really like to lose more weight but it's proving impossible. and with a 3 year old and 11 month old I'm really rushing around quite a lot, and I have cut out all the muffins/chocolate etc

I have no experience, but if you have lost all the baby weight 'easily' then you are probably not eating enough. Are you eating healthily>?? eating poorly makes me feel like shit.

Clingy teethy waily waking baby can take you straight back to newborn feeling, I find. I don't know about the breastfeeding.

don't have any advice for you so bumping it up for more knowleadgable

but your description of knackerdom fits me completly and I only have one child...

thankyou colditz - I really am a fatso though (still a good 4 stone over what I would ideally liek to be). I made an effort not to put on so much weight this time and it came off really easily but now it's just totally stalled

I have been trying to eat better - more vegetables, fruit, pulses, less bread etc. probably not massively healthy but really not that bad I don't think

I think you're right about the clingy etc. baby. He is currently up at 9pm because I can't get him to sleep . I just don't know what I@m doing and then DD was so foul this afternoon, it's been a grim day

see is it really that easy ahhChewww?
Am I a zombie purely because of having 2 small children?

HOw does eveyrone else manage?

MrsJC - I didn't BF for very long (6 wks), but I felt like this for about the first 18 mths of my son's life. I also had all the tests available and nothing came up. I did have PND, yes, although to be honest nothing helped ease it as much as finally getting more sleep when DS began to sleep for much longer stretches in his second year. Have you thought about changing your lifestyle a bit - exercise, diet etc? Don't mean to sound patronising, but it can boost your energy levels. Sympathies xx

Well I am four stone overweight too - but If I don't eat a decent amount of calories in a day, i feel appalling. Fat is living tissue too, and will make demands on your blood sugar and appetite (which will affect your mood and energy level) just like any other. I wouldn't be trying to cut calories in any way while you feel foul/

oh DON'T lapin I did think of that today and thought maybe I should do a test and rule it out. I am not sure if they tested that or not - doctor didn't say anything.

had a period ooh 3 weeks ago though so surely it's unlikely?

eveyrone is right about exercise. I do walk and things but I should be doing more. no idea when or how to fit it in though

and yes re calories.

I just don't know. I am crapola mummy at the moment and just FED UP

MrsJC - for you.

Re. the bfeeding - I know that i am unable to shift that last bit of weight whilst still bfeeding. And right now - because you are bfeeding, if you drop your calories too much, your metabolism is really going to slow down and your body is storing fat - as its priority is going to be making enough bmilk for your bub. Get calories into you - but from low GI, healthy sources - lots of lean meat, pulses, fish, oats etc.

Re. the bfeeding. Far be it from me to suggest that that is contributing - but if you are still having to wake in the night to feed - is it possible to express and store some milk so that if DS needs to feed at night, your DH can do it? Get your earplugs in and get some good nights sleep.

I also second the poster who asks whether there is any chance you could be pregnant?

Are you managing to get out in the fresh air every day - makes you feel a lot better and you get some exercise.

Also - I cannot think that sleeping on the sofa is doing you any good. Unless it is mega comfy? I have a lovely comfy sofa - but would never sleep as well on that as I do in my bed.

Re the weight gain of bub - are you feeding high calorie foods - banana and avocados etc? I hear that once they start crawling tho, it is normal for weight to fall off. They are more active. But maybe an expert can come along and answer that one.

Hope you start to feel better soon

MrsJC I really sympathise you as I am the same at the moment. DD is 7.5 mo and I just dread waking up in the morning as I always feel knackered and DD sleeps through the night. I'm still bfing too.

I do have a thyroid problem but recently went for a blood test and they said the does of meds that I am on has put it back to normal and I just cried as I was so hoping there was something they can do. I told the dr it was making me really unhappy and vile (not PND, they tried giving me ADs but I know its not) and said was there someone I could talk to, think I just need a outlet, but she just smiled sympathetically and said having a 7 mo is tiring, nothing she can do, no-one I can talk to unless I have a more serious mental health problem

Anyway, I was going to put a post up exactly like this seeing if anyone had any ideas or advice.

Everyone says exercise but the problem is it's vicious cycle, you are so tired you can't bring yourself to exercise even though it would probably make you feel better.

Hope you feel better soon, and I will be watching the responses.

oh aren't you all lovely?

Thank you for all this

And yes, I am thinking feeding an 11 month old 4/5 times a day really must be quite knackering

Bumperlicious, crap isn't it? and the 3 year old is REALLY pushing it at times. she was more or less beating me about the head today whilst I sat there not daring to do anything because I knew I'd just start screaming at her and feel even worse - my mother told her off but she just laughed . It really hurt!

You sound like me 6 months ago. I went to the doctor as I wondered about PND. She was great and after a long chat said she thought that actually I was depressed due to prolonged sleep deprivation- it has been 3 years since I had an uninterrupted night's sleep and dd2 didn't even come close to sleeping through before 8.5 months. Not to mention dd1! She offered anti-depressants or a form of CBT which I did briefly.

What actually helped most was accepting that I was exhausted and asking for a bit of help. My Mum now has the kids overnight once a month or so. Can anyone give you a break? Or can you stay at a friend's every now and then? I am still knackered (kids are nearly 3 and 15 months) but at least now I can focus on keeping going til the next time I have a night without the girls. I have just started weightwatchers so things are slowly improving. There is light at the end of the tunnel!

I do weightwatchers online by the way and use the points plan. You can still eat chocolate and stuff if you want and it made me realise that one of the reasons I felt crap was because I barely ate in the day and then ate rubbish after the kids were in bed. Now I try to balance my day a bit more and my energy levels have definitely improved. Next step is exercise- bought a pilates dvd but have yet to unwrap it.

I hope you start to feel better soon.

thank you RBH

I know the theory of WW quite well, lost 3 stone on it once, will attempt to follow it again!

I just saw that they have a little bit of info for nursing mums as well. And they do a lovely line of chocolate desserts too

Sounds like classic PND to me, esp. the dizziness. IME

I have struggled with PND thru two closely spaced pregnancies (number 3 and number 4).

I gave up bf number 3 because my DH was also convinced that it was a contirubuting factor.

Didn't make any positive difference. TBH it made the PND worse because I felt that i had lost a connection with my DS2 as my DH took over the feeds. Even now it upsets me that my DS prefers to go to him than me.

Am still feeding DS3 (9mo) and what is making the difference is time out -one pilates class and a post-natal class once a week and a couple of other mini-projects that I'm doing, that are just mine and don't involve children.

Hope this helps. Hang on in there!

RBH, I am a big fan of WW CHocolate cookies...

thefabfour, thank you. I am wondering now about the PND. I'll go back to my doctor - she's very helpful - and I won't be giving up breastfeeding because there;s no real reason too. I woul djust like to feel a bit better!

have quite a few things coming up which are just for me and luckily DH is very helpful

I just wanted to say that although i only have one DD of 6.5 months, i do empathise with you and understand what you are going through. I think that BFing IS a contributor to how you feel - i am very pro BF - i am just being realistic about the demands of BF. The last 2 months have seen my DD abandon all reason when it comes to sleep - ie. she doesn't!!! She has been teething and hungry and through Dec and Jan i was up every 1.5 - 2hours per night. I felt tearful, despondent, exhausted to my very core, anxious and angry with the world. Not a nice place to be and not a very nice person

I seem to be feeling better now that DD is sleeping better again but i had made an appt to see my doc for PND as i felt like i was on a downward spiral and that there was no way out.

My DP suggested that i give up BFing because of the extra strain it was putting on me - and i really believe it does add to the strain both from the physical demand it puts on you in the milk production; the time burden it places on you in the day because of the time you spend feeding and then of course, the killer night feeds which reduce sleep. It also adds an extra dimension of strain because the baby is SO tied to you. However, i couldn't give up because of the very reason thefabfour outlines above - i knew that it would makie me feel worse to lose that connection with my DD - and whilst i was tired, i knew that i loved BFing my little girl nothing in the world is better than seeing her look up at me and smile while she is feeding...

Anyway, am rambling becasue i felt empathy with you and wanted to show you that you are not alone!! I feel lots better now and put some of that down to the fact that I have really changed my diet so that there is all the goodness my body needs to support me and DD - i eat lots of fruit and veg, lentils, chick peas, red meat and oily fish. I feel lots better for that. It is worth trying?
BUT I have chocolate whenever i want too! We all deserve that!

thanks Balthamos and I'm glad you're feeling better. FWIW I think lots of them go mad at 4 months and sleep goes screwy - that's when it all started for DS,before that he was the easy peasiest baby ever. I moaned extensively on here...

I am feeling a little better at the moment as DS has mostly stopped feeding in the night and I'm getting a bit more sleep...even though he is cutting 3 molars all at the same time

MrsJC - I felt exactly the same six months ago in the same position. Couple of things:

(1) Is it possible you are not drinking enough (water not wine I mean - although the latter may help as well ) If you are dehydrated you are going to feel sluggish and some of your comments (dried out old husk etc) just hit me as being those of a woman in need of water. Might sound facile but I wasn't drinking enough and was so knackered and grumpy and I upped my water intake and in five days I lost half a stone and felt miles better.

(2) If you aren't getting more than four hours sleep straight you will feel like shit. It's basic biology. Bugger all you can do about it. If you accept that and realise that by 18 months most of the little ratbags sleep through (at least that's what I'm hoping), it's a bit easier to cope with because you know you are already through the worst.

(3) Give him drugs for teething. DDs teeth are finally all through and I know for a fact that we went through four bottles of Infant Nurofen, and two of Calpol - plus six tubes of teething gel (and one packet of paracetamols - for me because of the headaches from the constant screaming). Tis not worth the fight my dear! Drug and be damned - at least he'll get some kip and hopefully you will too.

(4) Are you taking vitamins and minerals? Often people take really decent vits during pregnancy and then just stop and then become lacking in zinc/magnesium etc (particularly if you are knackered). Might be worth taking one - it doesn't have to be an expensive one btw, but just try it for a month or so and see if it helps.

(5) Finally, when was the last time you did something nice for you for a couple of hours? Had your hair done, had a long bath? Are you neglecting your need to be a person apart from your child. Perhaps if you could get an hour out for you once a week - go for a walk or whatever, you'd feel a bit better.

But you know all this already because you are an experienced mummy. I hope things get better for you soon

oh mrsjc, you are adorable and funny.
no advice on the bfing stuff as you know but you have my sympathy and concern. re exercise, you could join us on Misdee's running thread. it's a right laugh, all us lardy-arses are doing it... there's hardly even any running!

WMMC - yes the water tihng is v.important and I am TRYING to remember to drink enough as I know that my default setting is not to

and oh yes I do drug him it's nurofentastic over here. especially with these fecking molars

aitch - I would like to run really - I would like to do SOMETHING
I had a personal trainer ad for 'Alistair' through the door, he lives in the next reoad (maybe he's seen me?) and is offering a free assessment (shouldn't take long - any fule could look at me and immediately assess me as a lazy lardarse in need of a good kick up the backside) and first session - am seriously thinking of taking the plunge as our finances are looking up a bit