combining breast and bottle-HOW??? any tips v.welcome

[emz31]

my DS is nearly 4 months , i've been trying a bottle of expressed milk almost every day for last 6 weeks. some days he will take maybe 3 ozs max, so i know he can do it, but most of the time he screams himself hoarse and just won't have it. any tips? also how about introducing a formula feed, would that help? don't want to give up BF but am a bit worried that i may be feeding him when he's 3!

I only got my ds2 to do mixed feeding 2 months ago when he was 11months old. IME they take it when they are ready but I'm sure you will get a plethora of wise MNers advising you how to do it sooner

Hi emz31. have you tried having somebody other than you give him the bottle? I have heard that babies can get frustrated when bfing mums give them the bottle as they can smell mums breast milk. i don't think that introducing a formula feed would make any difference, as the issue seems to be the bottle rather than the type of milk.

Have tried everything going MummytoSteven, as we speak DH is battling with a very distressed DS with a bottle. have evsn tried wrapping bottle in my bra when DH feeds him - to no avail. It's just so annoying as I know he can take it and does so happily on very few occassions.have spent a fortune on bottles and teats too, just seem to have my very own little mule on my hands - anyone else?

should aslo say that ds1 was very similar in taking the bottle but he decided to stop BF himself when he was 16mo. So don't worry about BFing your ds til he's 3.

Do you have an urgent need to get him on the bottle? Are you going back to work?

He may take forumla sooner than EBM via the bottle, he may know it's coming in a different container from what he really wants.

I managed to do breast and bottle feeding with DSs, but not with DD who resisted every trick I could think of (stubborn!)

My DSs both had dummies which made it a lot easier. To begin with they would not suck on the teat properly, and would get frustrated and scream. So, I would let them get settled with the dummy (which they would suck) then whip it out quickly and replace it with the bottle. They would then suck properly a few times before realising the swap and spitting the teat out. I used to just keep swapping around, and eventually they overcame whatever it was they didn't like about the bottle. It did take a few attempts though.

However, DD wouldn't go for it at all - she'd suck and then just spit all the milk out, whether it was ebm or formula. Luckily as I work evenings it's not been that much of a problem, and as she's nearly 1 now I'm not worried if she doesn't get milk if I have to go out (ie have a life....)

HTH a bit, good luck!

thanks guys - i'm not going back to work til he's 9 months, but will he still need milk by then? he also won't have a dummy - seems he's a boob man! - also not sure if he may need weaning as he feed every 2-3 hours still and has now stared waking in night starving which he never used to do - HV suggested formula as it may keep him fuller for longer?

2/3 hours for a baby that young sounds fine. Would you go that long without having anything to eat or drink?

Don't listen to your HV about that garbage, DSs were on bm AND formula and it didn't make any difference how long they went between feeds.

By 9 mths DD was having 3 feeds (morning, afternoon and evening) plus one at night which I think is comfort rather than hunger.

Incidently, DD started waking up in the night at 4 months after previously sleeping through. She showed other signs of wanting solids, and she took to them really well, but she still wakes through the night 6 mths later!

No, would def. not go that long - am constantly eating and drinking all day! - and complaining about the fact i can't lose weight! maybe he's ready to be weaned then - does your DD wake up in the night hungry? - thought baby rice or formula may be the answer to my prayers where sleeping is concerned - hate having disturbed sleep, especially when you're used to having a decent nights kip!!

must go and feed DS now - he has been trying a bottle with DH for last 40 mins and has screamed constantly - is this giving up and letting him have his own way?

I have to say getting a good nights sleep is my goal too atm! DS1 didn't sleep through until he was 2 and DS2 was about the same....the only thing that saved me with them was putting them in beds (low ones!) so when they woke up they got up and came to me rather than screaming for me to go into them. I'd not even wake up most of the time, just open my eyes in the morning to find a DS (or 2) in bed with us!

DD isn't waking up because of hunger, she just gets disturbed when she wakes and we're in the room. If she wakes and we're still up she'll moan than just go back to sleep. Unfortunately we don't have a room for her, so she'll have to stay in with us until she's old enough to go in with the boys.

If you get DS on to a bottle, at least your DP can let you get a couple of nights free of feeding!

My first was the same. Tried everything and like you bought loads of bottles/teats. In the end I gave up for a couple of months. Then she started drinking from a bottle one week before I was due to go back to work when she was 7 months! So then combined formula and bf for a while till she was on formula completely. Still is a stubborn little minx now!

With DS I was determined not to have the smae problem so stated him on daily 2 oz formula feeds from 5 weeks... Ah the wisdom of hindsight. No help to you now I know but may be of use for number 2?

emz31

You could get by on 2/3 bfeeds at 9 months. ie first thing, when you get home and late evening so don't stress if he won't take a bottle even by then. You can always mix ebm in with cereals and he'll probably be having yoghurt and cheese too.

I did introduce formula to mine and continued to bfeed am and last thing - at around 6 months with ds because we were going on holiday with friends and a little later with dd because she had reflux and it enabled her to have thickened milk which she could hold down better. Both found it difficult to adjust and ds just had to take it or go without for a few days, but compensated on the remaining bfeeds in the meantime. They had had ebm prior to that but neither were very keen. dd never took more than 3 oz at a time !

hth

emz31 - since you are not going back to work until your DS is 9 months old, I think you do not need to worry about him taking a bottle. At 4 months old you can try using something other than a bottle for giving EBM if it is needed. It seems to be that trying to get him to take a bottle is distressing to both you and him. I would say leave it at the moment. I certainly would not advise introducing formula in the hope that he will take it better or that he will sleep longer. That usually is not the case. In the 40 mins he has been upset refusing the bottle, he coulkd have had a good breast feed which will fill him up and boost your supply. More breastfeeds = more milk supply. I had 4 babies, worked and never gave a bottle a day to make sure they would take it. If I was not at home, a bottle was given then. Hungry babies will feed. Give yourselves a break and just breastfeed just now.

Emz31, we had this problem a few weeks ago as I was returning to work and DS (5 months old then) had been exclusively BF, we had a trial run (for a couple of days) with the childminder and I used a bottle of breast milk and the rest as formula for backup - DS wasn't interested in the formula and I returned to work the following week feeling worried that he was going to starve. I was panicking.

On my first day back at work I bought a second pump (my reasoning being that one was for home and one was for work) for £30!! that same day he decided that formula was ace and now happily guzzles all four bottles I provide. This says a lot about my son I think . . . as I now have two redundant pumps. I still bf in the morning before work and in the evening so I still get my daily nuzzle/cuddle sessions!

I think it worked because the childminder wasn't me (if you see what I mean) and because he twigged that food wasn't appearing like magic.

I hope it works for you too - let us know how it goes won't you? xx

Thanks for all your advice ladies - i guess it has just become a matter of principle for me now - guess where DS gets his stubborn streak from?! - rescued my DH yesterday from an hour long crying fit (DS not DH! - although almost!!) in which time DS did not take even an inkling of an oz, but then guzzled away happily, the minute i put him to the breast! - think i will just pack away my bottles, teats and breastpumps for now as even the sight of them is annoying me and just enjoy BF for the moment. Although did speak to a friend yesterday who had same problem and said that it made weaning her DD onto solids very troublesome as all she wanted was the breast - now have somethng else to worry about!!

emz31 - don't worry - though I know it's easier said than done. We had a terrible time trying to get dd to take a bottle around 4-5 months in readiness for me returning to work when she was 5.5 months. She was having none of it! In the end I mounted a daily bottle training campaign, trying her with a bottle of EBM after she woke from her 9am nap. So she was rested, and hungry-ish but not beside herself. I would walk up and down the room, holding her with the bottle in her mouth, with music playing to distract her. For at least 2 weeks she drank NOTHING! After 20 minutes I would remove the bottle from her mouth, play with her for 10 minutes, then breastfeed her. After 2 weeks of this she began to take an ounce here and there, after 3 weeks she was guzzling like a champion. I used avent fast flow teats - the ones where a bit of milk drips out when you tip the bottle up, to give her the idea that there was something nice in there! It was hard work - but worth it for me, as I was worried enough about the return to work.

I'm now pregnant with number 2 and this time round I won't return to work until 9-10 months and I don't plan to bother with bottles at all - we'll just go straight to giving the babe milk from a cup when necessary. As mears says - they won't starve!

And as for weaning - don't worry - my dd was exclusively breastfed for 6 months, started on solids and is a generally a great eater. Like all babies there would be weeks when she was less interested, other weeks when she loved her food. And she carried on breastfeeding till she was 2, when she gave it up of her own accord.

thanks pidge - i guess i just like to have something to panic about! - your bottle training campaign sounds all too familiar except sometimes he would take it and others point blank refuse - there was no pattern at all. will prob try a cup later on, any advice on which one and when i can start to try it?

why are you trying to make your life more difficultemz?
breastfeeding is supposed to be easy. all this faffing around with sterilising the pump and bottles and finding the time to do it, then getting stressed when he doesnt. why bother?
let him move onto solids, and when he is seven or eight months old, give him formula in an unsterilised bottle. it should be much easier then. and by nine months, you can giv eup bf completely if you want to. a nine month old only needs 2 0r three milk feeds a day, which can be bottle or breast.
dont make your life more difficult.
i breastfed all three of my kids. dd would nt take solids eve when she was six and ahalf months old coz she liked the breast milk too much, and also coz a brat. but by 8 and half months old, she was only on solids and formula!
good luck

Thanks stitch, guess i will try to stop stressing and go with the flow - at least at the end of the day i know by bf, i'm doing the best for him - i just like to have a good worry about things now and again!

emz31 - loads of different cups out there - the only thing I would say is don't bother with those non-drip cups (like AnywayUp Cup) at this stage - you have to suck blooming hard to get anything out and dd never managed it. We use "kids on the go" - where the liquid drips out, but you do have to suck a bit to get it properly flowing. But there are loads of options like that.

I wouldn't even bother until you start your ds on solids - at which point try giving him a cup of water with meals. He probably won't be interested at first, but after a couple of months he may be keener and by that point you will be thinking about going back to work and can start putting a bit of milk in for him.

Like stitch says - the joy of breastfeeding, once you get the hang of it - is that it's so easy. I'm really pleased that with this baby I won't have to do all the bottle malarky. I may end up expressing because I want to avoid formula and just give EBM, but that shouldn't be too hard.

Hi emz31, glad you're feeling a bit more together!

Just to agree with Pidge about the cup. I started DD with sips of water from a tommee tippee cup (one where you can close the lid, but if you tip it up open it dribbles out) when we started on solids and she got the hang of it pretty quickly, although be prepared for the showers you get when they decide to start trying to do it yourself!

ATM I'm trying to get her to drink milk (cow's, as she's 1 on thursday!) from the cup, but she's so stubborn. She takes big mouthfulls and then spits it all out laughing. I just have to go OTT on cheese and yogurts I think!

Or even 'themselves'

I breastfed DD for 1 year.
When she was on established on solids and having four/five breastfeeds a day (from 8 months) we introduced a small beaker of cow's milk just in the afternoons (Yes, I know it breaks the rules but it worked for us)
I used the Tommee Tippee 4 mth beaker.
She accepted this with no problem and made the
gradual transition to just cow's milk by 1 yr dead easy.

We gave DD bottles for a while and then she stopped taking them. We fought this for a bit (and she did reduce ex-commando DH to tears!) and then gave up. Best decision I ever made, should have done it sooner. When I put her in nursery, they were not worried and sure enough, she's not a big bottle drinker for them but goes through 8-10 oz in a day. And she took to solids (on her own terms) almost instantly at 6 months, so I wouldn't fret about that either. When she wasn't taking bottles we could still go out for 4-6 hours every so often; she'd take a few ounces to keep body and soul together and not be overly fretful about it.

My minx, contrary to all expectations, used to take a bottle just fine -- from me. Where's the point in that?

thanks all, after meeting with my NCT friends yesterday though, felt a tad inadequate as one woman even suggested i was allowing DS to get his own way if i was giving up on the bottle so easily!! bloomin' cheek of her as i didn't even know her and i think that a bottle a day for 6 weeks is bloody good going in the perseverence stakes! - plus, much to my annoyance, she banged on about her dream baby , how, thanks to gina ford, she takes specific naps and sleeps for 12+ hours a night!!! much to my shame however, i must admit to getting home and thinking i'll have one last stab, so gave DS a bottle of ready mix formula - BIG mistake - he gagged horrifically and i don't know which he objected to most - the bottle or the formula - don't you just wish people would stop giving their opinions when they're not wanted?!! Grrrrr! am packing away every last piece of feeding equipment i own as we speak!!