Have I missed the boat?

[tryingtoebf]

I have birth three weeks ago. My baby was very mucus-y at birth and struggled to feed so prior to being discharged we formula fed

We have since been pumping and bottle feeding, baby prefers bottle due to quick flow however will latch and feed on the breast however never for a full feed

Time at the breast is increasing however sometimes does make quick gulping sounds and begins to cry (I assume because milk is not quick enough) so we end up topping up with formula

I'm feeling like a failure as I think I should have persevered at the beginning and not given the formula

Is it too late for baby to be exclusively breast fed ? Am I best to just focus on pumping?

Hello,

Wow that sounds tough, massive pay on the back for persevering! In short, no it definitely isn’t too late! It’s great that your baby is latching and drinking at the breast!

The most important things are:

1. Maintain supply. So that means pumping whenever you give a bottle, putting baby to the breast as much as you can, perhaps skin to skin might help them to latch. You might also like to try gently massaging yourself breasts before both pumping or feeding as that some women find it can increase the amount of milk that they can pump and combined with breast compressions it can help speed up the flow for your baby (and for a pump). Here is a good link on how to do that:

1. Paced bottle feeding. This method of feeding a baby helps them to manage the milk flow from a bottle teat and slows it down so it’s a bit more like the way they would get milk from the breast. This link is a good explanation of it:

It’s probably also a good idea to check tour baby’s latch and make sure it’s nice and deep. I find video is excellent for really helping to explain and check a latch: globalhealthmedia.org/portfolio-items/attaching-your-baby-at-the-breast/

Finally, it sounds like you could do with some support on this. I would suggest you seek out a local IBCLC lactation consultant or qualified Breastfeeding Counsellor for some more support. lcgb.org/find-an-ibclc/

It can also be helpful to join breastfeeding groups (probably online at the moment) like La Leche League or ABM or just general bfeeding support groups as there will be other mums who have been through / are going through the same thing.

The National breastfeeding helpline is also a great resource and is (wo)manned by trained breastfeeding counsellors who will be able to support you:
0300 100 0212
It’s open 9am - 9pm

You can totally do this OP! I’m rooting for you!

(Trainee breastfeeding counsellor)

Ugh sorry for so many typos! Bloody text predict!! Hopefully you get the gist!

PS you are absolutely not a failure in any way. You are a mum doing her best and that’s all any of us can ever do. Don’t be too hard on yourself.

@Peasbewithyou thank you so much for your help, you've made me feel a lot better

I'll keep up the pumping and putting baby to the breast, the latch has been checked a few times and is supposedly good and deep baby is just impatient on milk flow

I'll try the paced bottle feeding and hopefully that'll help

It's hard work as I feel like I'm spending so much time around feeding ( trying baby on boom, pumping and bottle feeding) that I'm not spending enough one on one time with baby so hopefully if I can get one full boob feed a day I'll be so so happy

Ah I’m so glad it helped.

Many women find breast compressions really helpful,it will help milk flow and even if you think latch is perfect I would say it’s good to watch that video and just remind yourself. I still do it myself!

And try not to beat yourself up about not spending one-on-one time. When you’re feeding that is important time and pumping is important too. Babies at this age are generally happy to just be with you and you can talk to them, stroke, cuddle etc while you pump / feed. You’re doing great!!!

I would really recommend giving the helpline a ring too. They are so supportive may be able to give you more suggestions and info.

Good luck OP. You’re honestly doing so well!!

If baby is latching well and feeding I'd say it's definitely not too late.

DD was topped up with formula from day 2 as they were worried about her weight and we had terrible trouble getting her to latch well. By 4 weeks l managed to ditch the formula altogether and BF her until she was 2y.

The first few weeks were hard but it was worth it in the end. Regular BF as the priority, reduced the formula gradually and pumping a few times a day and we eventually got there. It was gruelling but I'm glad I did it. My supply was never fabulous so I was still pumping to encourage supply until 4m, but at that point only twice a day.

Congratulations on your baby!

@Peasbewithyou thank you! I have watched the videos so hopefully the compressions will help 🤞🏻

@INeedNewShoes your comment gives me hope!

I usually put baby to breast and let them feed until they remove themselves (either content or frustrated due to not enough milk and top up with expressed milk if needed)

Would you recommend pumping post feed until I'm confident baby is actually having full feeds on the breast (rather than half feeds and finishing because they're sleepy?)

I hope that makes sense, thank you both so much you're giving me hope ❤️

@tryingtoebf I had struggle with feeding and continue to combi feed at 7 months. I saw a lactation consultant after having my daughters tongue tie divided and her advice to me was: pop baby on the breast and let her feed until you see she stops swallowing, you can see if you can restart the feeding by stroking the back of the neck or stretching out their arms- she said touching face or hands can distract them). Once she was not feeding any more on that boob, I switched sides and did the same. I then repeated this 3 times (so each boob had 3 goes). When she really had stopped drinking I was then to offer the top up and see how she went.

Might be worth a try? At 7 months we only need one offering each side and then offer a top up (I couldn't handle the stress of breast feed pump and bottle so accepted for the majority of the time the top up will be formula, that was my personal choice though)

Yes, I always expressed immediately after feeding.

My GP gave me good advice to make sure I was well hydrated and to eat well to help my supply. It also helps to trigger your supply to have baby with you while you express or at least photos - something to do with hormones!

The early hours of the morning are important as that's when the hormone to trigger your milk is released so ideally you want to feed and express somewhere between about midnight and 4am. It can feel torturous making yourself express in the dead of night but that's the most worthwhile time to do it!

We topped up with the bottle for a while, we both had thrush and it caused problems with my milk supply. She was starving and the main thing was to make sure she was fed.

I ALWAYS offered the breast before the bottle. Didn't bother with pumping, just put her on the breast as often as possible. It was exhausting, particularly a night, when you'd sometimes prefer to give the baby a bottle and get back to sleep, but it was worth it. Over time my supply increased and eventually she started refusing the bottle. I kept offering it for a while – I wanted to make sure she really was getting enough – but after a few weeks of consistent refusals I stopped, and now she's been back to EBF for 6 months and is a very happy little nurser.

Don't beat yourself up over giving formula at the hospital, formula is not the devil and the main thing is that your baby is fed. And you can only make the best decisions for your child at the time, in retrospect you might think there are some things you would do differently, but that's part of life.

Thank you all so so much, you are giving me a much needed push to keep going!

I knew these first weeks were very hard but it's difference when you're in the midst of it

@Starwatcher123 can I ask how long it took before your LO was off the bottle? And how pls she was? I'm in a similar situation - BFing been bumpy due to DD's CMPA. My supply suffered when I cut a to ln if things out from my diet and now she is on formula top ups. I'm trying to get the extra calories in and hoping I can once again catch up my supply.

Hi OP,

I am in a very similar position to you. Mine is 4 weeks now and was born a month early, in SCBU for 10 days and then I was in transition care with him for 6 days. He had a very low sucking/swallowing reflex and it was hard to get him off the tube even onto a bottle. I EBF for 2 days in the hospital but despite people saying his latch looked fine, I found my nipple was compressed and I knew my supply was so far behind after his stay in the incubator. He was crying all the time and wouldn't sleep and was losing weight. I reached for the formula and he immediately started sleeping, stopped crying all the time, and started piling on the pounds which was such a joy to see with such a tiny one.

A few days ago I was where you are - beating myself up over my choices and over my use of formula, however I have realised that I can only try my best with the hand I was given. I've now rented an Ardo Carum pump and pump 7 times a day, doing breast compressions constantly and swapping from boob to boob a few times - it takes about 15-20m each time. I put baby to the boob before each feed or sometimes halfway through if he is starving and crying. He only lasts a few minutes on each breast, barely sucks, doesn't really swallow, and often just falls asleep. Its very frustrating but for me I think the pump is the way forward. I'm also taking brewers yeast, raspberry leaf tea and fenugreek tablets from holland and barred to try and increase supply.

When baby is on breast I do breast compressions too and watch his throat for swallowing - because mine has a bad latch I use nipple shields too which don't solve the latch problem but protect my nipples somewhat! Its frustrating because as soon as its skin to skin on the breast just me and baby my milk flows and the plastic def inhibits letdown for me.

Combo feeding is incredibly hard work but for me feeding my baby is the top priority, seeing him crying in hunger and losing weight is not something I could put up with.

As others have said - def not a failure - feeding baby is priority and we are all given a different set of circumstances when our babies arrive - we make the best choices we can for our babies and you are striving so hard to do whats best so dont' beat yourself up xx

@MOGMOGMOG85 thank you for replying, I am not against formula in itself it's more I wish I would have tried harder at the beginning if that makes sense?

Today baby has been feeding on the breast most of the day without top up at all. I only have a single electric pump so I usually pump for 10 mins with suction type pump on the other boob and then swap (20 mins total)

Trying to do this after having baby on my boobs for over 20 mins prior is making my nipples really sore, does anyone have any advice?

Would it be best to feed and pump maybe an hour post feed? I'm worried that baby will not be getting enough to keep my supply and by the time i realise it's reduced it will be too late to reestblish

Hi op, well done on getting so far - these early days are knackering and hormones are wild!

It sounds like breastfeeding is going well, if you can I would maybe try and phase out the top ups over the next couple of weeks and keep and eye on baby producing enough wet/dirty nappies and weight gain.

He maybe a bit grizzly at not getting the easy flowing milk, but not a bad thing for him to get used to more breast.

Psychologically I found it difficult to stop the top ups as you can see what baby is drinking, and you can't with breast, obvs. But was so much easier once I did that as sterilising/pumping/formula etc. was quite exhausting!

Good luck with it all - you're doing great! And congrats on your baby.

Use loads of lansinoh cream on sore nipples and make sure you haven’t got the suction on the pump set too high.

DD was a very slow BFer and would feed 45 minutes before she was satisfied and then it’d take me 40 minutes to pump. The first couple of weeks were agony and I’d be nearly hitting the ceiling while DD was getting her latch going but by 4 weeks the pain had stopped.

Be careful if you use reusable breast pads. These made me sore. For some reason I was better off using disposables or nothing at all as my supply was such that I really didn’t leak much.

@INeedNewShoes thank you!

I don't use nipple pads, I've not leaked milk and honestly only the past few days have had milk come out with a small massage despite getting between 500-650 ml a day (aiming for around 800 to fully feed)

I keep watching and watching the latching and general breast feeding videos but despite knowing the theory it's so hard to put into practise when baby is crying because they're frustrated despite attempting at first cues / or when baby isn't particularly hungry

Wow! You are getting loads of BM!

Mine was so slow. I’d generally get 300ml a day max from 7 expressing sessions.

It was really hard to take the leap of faith that DD was managing to get enough milk but she must have been getting more from me than the machine was. Generally they take more than we realise at each feed.

@INeedNewShoes that's made me feel loads better! I've been reading at this stage i should be getting at least 750ml so was aiming for this prior to dropping the top up to make sure I could cover what he was drinking

I'm just going to keep putting him to the boob every feed and hopefully it'll fall into place