Breastfeeding help - bottom jaw not opening

[Mangopassionfruit]

Baby is 4 weeks today and have seen
/spoken to SO many people about breastfeeding. EVERYONE says the latch looks great, he’s putting on weight brilliantly but I am still in so much pain.

A tongue tie was found, cut and this made things so much worse for just over a week. Things started to improve then but it’s still painful at most feeds.

He now opens his mouth so much wider to latch on but when I pull my boob to the side to look at the latch he literally doesn’t have his bottom jaw open and therefore any of the bottom of my areola in his mouth at all. Hence the pinching/chomping.

I was just wondering if anyone had any advice or even just reassurance that if I stick with it a couple more weeks and he gets a little bigger it will improve??

Considering trying out nipple shields but that’s last resort really.

Thank you!

Hard to tell but I wonder if he is positioned too high? For optimal latch they need to lead with their chin with head extended back slightly. Hard to describe well but it often helps if they are lower almost under the nipple.

Who did you speak to? Did you see a lactation consultant?

When you say you've spoken to lots of people, could you say who?

Midwives generally have OK breastfeeding training, especially infant feeding specialists, but may be better at getting you started off than supported long term.
Health visitors next to none
GPs none
Paediatricians little (although they may be better placed to spot issues such as jaw problems).

Lactation consultants/breastfeeding counsellors/La leche league leaders will have more.

Anyone in between calling themselves a breastfeeding advisor, peer supporter, etc it can be so variable.

So it does quite matter IME who exactly you've had advice from. The latch doesn't sound right at all if the baby's mouth isn't opening fully. So I would disregard people saying the latch looks fine, and push for specialist support.

Ideally you need to do a f2f or web based
Consultation with a BF specialist. Have you heard of the Milk Meg? She's brilliant.

In the here and now, try pulling on his lower lip when he's latched on. Just a thumb on his chin and tug the flesh down a few mm. this should pull the lower lip down making for a more comfortable position for you and encouraging his mouth to open slightly more.

I'd also be a bit conscious about how you bring him to the breast. He needs to sort of pounce on slightly - so essentially he's looking up. This makes his lower jaw drop and the latch wider.

Good luck! And get some real life help.

Look at your local La Leche League - they can help over video.

I can't find the article I wanted to share, but this one is quite good - it's a comparison of shallow vs deep latch pictures. Unfortunately the topic of the article isn't quite that but it may be helpful. And it illustrates the gap of knowledge between the common front-line supports vs somebody who has worked in breastfeeding support in an expert position for a long time.

www.analyticalarmadillo.co.uk/2014/11/im-banned-from-facebook-again.html

As you put him to the breast, try pushing his chin into your boob in such a way that he's going to have to reach upwards (upwards for him relative to his chin, obviously the actual direction in relation to gravity may vary depending on how you've got him positioned!) to get the nipple into his mouth - basically, keep his chin where it is and make him use that open mouth to get a good wodge of boob in.

Thanks everyone!

Yes it was a variety of people... one breastfeeding counsellor, midwives (can count 7), 2 infant feeding specialists, health visitor. Every single one has had contradicting advice and it’s been really frustrating. The general consensus has been he just needs to get bigger.

But yes You’re right, maybe it’s time for another breastfeeding counsellor/lactation consultant. I will look into them.

In the meantime I will try all your tips, thank you for those.

I would be all over breastfeeding group meet ups if it was possible but that’s obviously not happening at the moment!

Yes, it's very difficult.

I would treat all the advice except for the breastfeeding counsellor with a pinch of salt. Maybe go back to her if you can.

Had similar issues myself with my now 15 week old. Had tongue tie snipped at 4 weeks and whilst it didn’t improve immediately this was also related to no end of problems wi thrush etc. As he’s got bigger he has Definately been able to open mouth wider but I also help by holding him cross cradle and when he opens his mouth I put his lower lip/ chin to the place I want it to be under the nipple and as I’m doing that my free hand is using my thumb next to nipple on opposite side to his lower lip pushing down slightly which draws nipple towards my thumb/ away from him I then kind of push in the direction of his mouth and it tucks into his mouth under upper lip.

No idea if that made any sense or I described it properly but it’s a quick kind of fluid motion that I’ve found really helpful. I still do it now as he will just take the end of the nipple if I leave him to it himself.

I watched a million YouTube videos trying to get the ‘deep latch’/ sandwich that is always talked about but kind of created a mash up of them all in the end based on what our anatomy is like. Probably closest to the flipple technique if anything. Oh and was told from day 1 by my peer supporter who was amazing I might add that my latch and positioning looks right but it still bloody hurt! So don’t worry that isn’t always a good indication. Even now I’ll sometimes look at his latch and think it looks rubbish but as long as it isn’t hurting I leave it as what it looks like isn’t always a good indicator. Also are you sure there isn’t any thrush or anything causing the pain? I didn’t recognise that’s what I had for weeks asi thought it was just a poor latch as baby had no symptoms.