Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

Help with Newborn

26 replies

Paranormalbouquet · 08/12/2018 02:32

Help with newborn please. Fed older daughter for 2.5 years but don’t recall things being so difficult to begin with!

Baby number 2 born just after 7pm Wednesday, c-section. Latched and fed well night of birth. Since then it’s been very variable. Doing skin to skin but baby just sleeps in skin to skin and is awake and screaming when not- no in between!

The issue is that she wakes up and immediately begins rooting, and becomes frantic within seconds. Spits out breast. If latches will suck frantically for a minute or so and then stop and scream some more. I have some milk but not properly in yet- no let down/engorgement. Has had 2-3 wet nappies and lots of meconium stools so far today.

Been doing skin to skin since 9pm and she’s mostly sleeping, but when awake it’s frantic rooting, a few sucks and screaming at the breast.

I have no idea what I’m doing wrong or how to fix it. Haven’t slept in days so am on the verge of collapse now. Midwife coming to weigh tomorrow and I really want to avoid top ups unless really needed.

Any advice greatly appreciated.

OP posts:
WellAtLeast · 08/12/2018 02:46

Possible allergy?

WellAtLeast · 08/12/2018 02:47

Or tongue tie?

123bananas · 08/12/2018 02:56

Can you hand express into a sterile cup, even if it is colostrum and then cup feed her when she gets distressed to take the edge off her hunger before offering the breast. It sounds as if she is too upset, too quickly to latch effectively.

It could be that she is showing you subtle feeding cues before that point like sucking in her sleep. You could hand expressing a few drops then try to offer the breast in her sleep to see if she latches better before she wakes enough to realise the hunger.

Will post some videos on hand expressing and cup feeding in a minute.

ToBeARockAndNotToRoll · 08/12/2018 02:59

Congratulations on your daughter.

I'm not sure if you had a c-section before, but it can take a little longer for your milk to come in (I've had 2) her behaviour sounds 'normal' in that she will be encouraging your milk to come in. She's had wet nappies, she is getting something.

Can you hand express just before she tries to latch, so that there's some colostrum available on your nipple for her to get to? My DD was an extremely sleepy newborn and would latch, suckle then immediately fall asleep, so it took lots of work to get her to suckle. I ended up expressing some colostrum and using a cup provided by the hospital for her to sip.

Also I would try to wake her up before she was hungry so she would be calmer trying to latch too, could be an idea (although this can be easier said than done with a newborn!) Keep offering the breast as much as possible. Skin to skin is great.

The midwife will have lots of strategies too. In the meantime, plenty of fluids, and try eating porridge oats, and getting hold of some fenugreek (it's safe) both really helped my supply.

I hope this helps Flowers

123bananas · 08/12/2018 03:03

Expressing

Cup Feeding

Milk Meg YouTube Channel has lots of useful videos covering breastfeeding.

winnerwiner · 08/12/2018 03:26

Hi I am awake in a different time zone, so replying, I understand your worry, its such a hard time! You didn't mention if your first birth was c-section as well, but I believe milk takes longer to come in with a c-section, which is important to know if you didn't have a c-section first time.. It doesn't help you are still physically recovering, its no wonder you are on your knees. Also, there is a big leap between producing colostrum (the first 24-48 hours) and the more voluminous milk "coming in" you get after that it's a difficult transition for both of you, I found it so exhausting. You clearly know tons about it, but from what you say, the baby is really frustrated at the breast which is a worry for you. You do have choices, the midwife will hopefully weigh the baby and make sure they aren't losing too much weight tomorrow, and importantly making sure you are healing well.

Some swear by getting a good sleep (for me it was 4 hours straight, it was transformational) and topping up a little with formula, others ride it out and get supply established, knowing that it shouldn't be more than a few days, delegate everything you can. I would write down if you can remember, all nappy changes and the times, honestly if it's' easier to photograph it on the phone, do that, note whether they were wet, 2-3 a day seems a small number of wet nappies at that stage, but I'm not sure of your context, did you mean from midnight until now or from or from first thing this morning? Also note colour of the urine/meconium too so you can give the midwife as much info as you can.
Obviously can't diagnose anything on an internet forum but it's hopefully a mix of latch/milk coming in that's the issue. Make sure the midwife carefully examines your latch (for issues like tongue tie). It's not unusual for latch to seem good initially and then go a bit wrong when they need more. What help do you have? You are an experienced breastfeeder by the sounds of it, it's a hard balance between you recovering, getting milk in, taking care of a toddler, remember many many people give their child 3-4 oz of milk at this stage and go on to breastfeed for many months/years, might take longer to get the right amount of milk, it's true, but if it gives your body a chance to recover, really wish you and your family the best. Do what you think is right, we aren't there to tell you!

Original poster
Paranormalbouquet · 08/12/2018 04:59

Thanks everyone. I’ve been doing the usual things- expressing some colostrum onto nipple before offering it to her, have given a few syringes of expressed colostrum which she takes happily but then resumes her display of anger at the breast while rooting constantly. It’s like I’m feeding her acid. I can’t bear the thought of being readmitted for feeding issues as I’ll get even less sleep in hospital.

OP posts:
Original poster
Paranormalbouquet · 08/12/2018 14:25

Well midwife has just been and berated me for not giving formula. On my way back to hospital now to be assessed. Feel so useless, have fed a child before so can’t understanf why I can’t do it now.

OP posts:
123bananas · 08/12/2018 15:31

You can do it. Every baby is different and a c section changes things too (I have bfed after 3 csections and all were different).

She may just need a little top up to bring up her sugar levels to give her the energy to be awake enough to latch.

Keep Expressing by hand or pump to encourage your milk and put her to the breast first then cup feed the expressed milk or formula if she is awake enough. If not bottle.

When you are in hospital ask to see the breastfeeding support team or someone trained in breastfeeding support.

La leche league and breastfeeding network also have local peer supporters who can come out to you if you call their helpline (might be in your discharge paperwork somewhere).

Original poster
Paranormalbouquet · 09/12/2018 04:14

We are in hospital. I still have no milk. Nobody is willing to help me with latch, and they are insisting on fully supplementing so I don’t see how I’ll salvage this.

I had a c-section last time and had loads of milk at this point so can’t inderstand why this isn’t being looked into. Currently feeling incredibly useless. I’m terrible at pregnancy and delivery but last time round breastfeeding went right and now I can’t wvejbdobthat.

OP posts:
Original poster
Paranormalbouquet · 09/12/2018 04:14

Even so that

OP posts:
ToBeARockAndNotToRoll · 09/12/2018 07:25

Sorry to hear this OP, it sounds rough. Did you deliver at an earlier gestation? For example, DS was born EMCS at 41, DD ELCS at 38 weeks. It took a little longer for my milk to come in with DD.

See if they can give you access to a hospital grade electric pump too, if your baby is struggling to latch for now then the pump will simulate the sucking and hopefully encourage your colostrum to flow/milk to start coming in.

If you have to supplement that's ok, and does NOT mean you have failed. Easier said than done as you're very vulnerable right now, trying to get your newborn to feed whilst recovering from major surgery is HARD, and from the sounds of it you're not receiving much support from the hospital. Flowers

Original poster
Paranormalbouquet · 09/12/2018 08:05

I did deliver earlier- 37+2 rather than 41+3 but still think I should have milk in by now? Still no help with latching which should surely be the priority. Have a pump but only getting around 15mls every 3 hours so it’s not looking like my milk will be in any time soon.

I just don’t understand what’s going on. Last time I had a massive oversupply and could have fed triplets. This time I can’t get the baby to latch and have no milk at all. I’m asking to be checked for infection or retained placenta as it’s the only reason I can think of but obviously no interest in that either.

OP posts:
BrokenLink · 09/12/2018 08:17

I have seen this situation many times and it is highly likely your milk will come in either today or tomorrow. Just keep latching her and pumping to encourage the supply. If you are giving formula, try to insist on using a cup not a bottle. Yo get your reluctant baby to latch on, Give her no more than 10ml of formula, THEN latch her on the breast. She'll be less distressed having had a little drink first. Keep going with your skin to skin contact. There's a good artical on the internet called Increasing your Milk Supply by Breastfeeding Basics. Try and get in contact with a breastfeeding adviser ASAP.

Original poster
Paranormalbouquet · 09/12/2018 09:36

Well my pumping output has dropped from 15mls to nothing at all so it’s looking even less like my milk will come in at all. I’ve insisted on an NG for top ups, but the team are unsupportive and still have had no help with latching.

Been trying to get breastfeeding advisor privately but have had no luck as it’s sunday.

OP posts:
LimpLettice · 09/12/2018 10:30

Hi Paranormal. Congrats on the safe arrival of your girl at long last, I was on some of the preg after m/c threads with you. So sorry your team is being unsupportive, they sound dreadful.

One thing I would say is that 3 hourly pumping may not be enough. Even with hospital grade pump it's just not as efficient as a baby. The night before my milk came in this time DS was on and off in a frenzy literally hourly, bobbing and stressing and I'm convinced he was so mad as he was working to get the milk in. I'd try hourly today. Supplement as pp poster says, cup for just a few ml. Good luck.

Original poster
Paranormalbouquet · 09/12/2018 10:59

Hi Limp. I’m just so upset. It makes no sense after a straightforward breastfeeding experience last time that I’m failing so miserably this time.

OP posts:
LimpLettice · 09/12/2018 14:53

Every baby is different lovely, it doesn't make you a failure. Especially when your hospital doesn't sound bf friendly at all. Have they checked for lip or tongue tie, and do you have any chance of seeing a lactation consultant?

woolster · 09/12/2018 15:06

I was in a very similar position to this last week. Csection at 37+3. Experienced breast feeder as fed both sons for 2 years plus. Very, very frustrated at being taken back into jospital on day 5 due to 15% weight loss in DD. Difference is that my milk had come in and I was completely engorged. Tiny DD seemed frustrated by this and midwife thought I was in early stages of mastitis. Hospital came up with 48 hour feeding plan for topups if expressed milk and we actually used a bottle (to no ill effect on latch). I realise this story is not completely useful to you, but just wanted to say that a few days later I feel much better about the hospital admission. It sounds like you might be losing out as it’s a Sunday. I would keep shouting for a consult with a feeding expert- private or NHS. I’d also keep trying to pump. Surely it can only stimulate? Then take advice later on how best to cut down pumping when top ups are no longer needed. I’m guessing you’ve tried different positions? DD refused normal positioning but got on well in rugby hold. One paed suggested they’re only on the cusp of being able to feed at 37 weeks- this is definitely a clear difference from your previous feeding experience (and mine) so could explain some of baby’s frustration. In the end our DD was also put under a lamp for jaundice and it was suggested this was another reason she wasn’t feeding properly. So many different factors. Good luck with finding the help you need!!

PatricksRum · 09/12/2018 15:32

My baby used to do this! (Still does sometimes)
I was convinced something was wrong.
I've kind of put it down to there is milk waiting to be brought up and she's trying to comfort herself and stop the milk coming up by feeding again but when she begins she turns her head away and cries because it's not going to help.
I empathise, weeks I was going through this and was fretting and could hardly do anything.
When's next weigh in?

Original poster
Paranormalbouquet · 10/12/2018 07:25

Hi everyone- quick update.

  1. I’m being treated for post section infection and quite severe anaemia. This seems to be helping as I’ve managed to pump some milk since last night. Getting 30-50mls every 2-3 hours so am covering her needs now.
  1. After a lot of discussions I seem to have arranged for a lactation helper to come from maternity and help me try get baby latching tomorrow. Paeds seem to think that once milk is in she’ll magically get the hang of it but I doubt that somehow!
OP posts:
BrokenLink · 10/12/2018 09:23

That's excellent news, you are starting to lactate and get some help. Well done for persevering with breastfeeding, when no one was helping much, and good luck.

LimpLettice · 10/12/2018 14:23

Fab news Paranormal that your milk is coming in although sorry to hear you've got an infection. Very pleased a proper LC is going to help you out.