Women in Third World Countries are Still Able to Breastfeed Their Babies

[GeorginaA]

Firstly, please let me apologise, I've woken up in a really pedantic mood. I'm not looking for a fight, honest

It's just this phrase really winds me up, and I'm convinced that it's not helpful to tell mothers who are struggling to feed a statement that has major logical holes in on deeper investigation. I'd be very interested to see the research papers to back up the statement.

What is my problem with it?

• Third World countries cover such a huge, diverse population. People immediately envisage skeletal people in a drought area whenever the words "Third World" are used. But it covers cities, lush areas, etc.
• There is no other information - what's the child mortality rate there? Are there postmortems done on those children? In a famine-ridden area, is the death of young babies just due to disease? Have they a weakened resistance due to lack of nutrition?
• Logically, the nutrition a growing baby needs has to come from somewhere. If the mother doesn't have it in her body it's not going to go to the baby. Yes, the best of what she has may well go to the baby, but then neither is the baby going to survive if the mother doesn't.
• In the type of community imagined by that statement, would the breastfeeding and pregnant mothers get priority on any available food and water?

If what is meant by the third world statement is: "Don't worry, the baby gets the best nutrition from you that you have - if anyone is going to suffer it'll be you long before the baby, so it's worth eating healthily and well from that perspective" then why don't people SAY that?!

I have no idea why it irritates me so much, it's not as if I have strict accuracy in my speech all the time, but it's probably due to a similar statement that was given to me by a midwife who was very anti-epidurals while I was pregnant with ds1: "Women in Africa survive caesareans with only half a Panadol". I so wish I'd thought of a witty comeback at the time ("Really? And what's the mortality rate for mothers during childbirth there?"... "But you've been telling me how perfect childbirth is out in Africa - why the hell would they need a caesarean if everything is so perfect?"... "Some communities in Africa still practise female circumcision and I won't be following that either... now about that epidural" ) but instead I just gave her a withering look and actively avoided her for the rest of the pregnancy.

P.S. I am very pro-breastfeeding btw, but I just hate that statement.

The original statement is an enormous and extreme generlisation!
I summised from what I have read the following
a) that mothers with poor water supply/hygienic water basically have to breastfeed or compromise their babies lives...
b) not all women in the "3rd world" fall into this category
c) often mothers in category a) see their infants die anyway becuse of disease.

This is way beyond a breast is best argument...
Honestly, I am so pro breastfeeding my tits ache typing this, but it is not going to solve the problems in the depths of famine, poverty, crop failure, drought, monsoons, civil war, emergency and inadequate housing, disease and international apathy.
Hey one thought.
If only the 3rd world had f*ing oil, the yanks could come and save them...

Honestly, all the statement tells us (and rather sweepingly) is that breastfeeding does not depend on nutrition to succeed.

The factors that make breastfeeding so difficult for mothers have very little to do with diet.

Anyone who says this statement to mothers when 'they are struggling to feed' ( GeorginaA's example) is not likely to be helpful.

Like Piffle says, even if the whole world breastfed for ages, it would not solve other problems...however, infant mortality and morbidity everywhere would improve. It's a vital lilfeline for many (can you imagine what the infant mortality would be in Darfur, if the mothers weren't breastfeeding?).

I used to live in the 'Third World' in East Africa and I find myself constantly shouting at the radio/TV/newspaper when commentators/idiots/midwives/people who should know better try to compare an issue or service in the UK to that of the Third World. It's an easy dig and designed to make us feel guilty wrt things like breastfeeding. How many of these pontificators have witnessed child-rearing in the Third World, eh? Yes, b/f is something that women are accumstomed to as they see it for themselves from infancy as there is no shame in b/f in public. Yes, in Africa the majority of the population live in rural areas and live with extended families and get taught how to b/f by the female members of the family. I mean, wet nursing is still common where I used to live but I've yet to hear a HP suggest this. Not all of Africa is drought and famine as we see on the TV. When I lived in Tanzania, Kenya and Zambia there was no humanitarian crisis. But yes, people are poor. It is common for women to give birth to twice as many babies than survive into childhood. Malaria is the biggest killer of babies and children FFS.

It's all very selective. Would I really expect to be sexually serviced by my BIL if my DH was working away in order to prevent me from straying? That's common too. I get so enraged by comments like 'we have a Third World healthservice in the UK'. Em, no, that would be 2 in a bed if there was one and a live chicken strapped under the bed to ward off evil spirits, no drugs, no anaesthetic, blah, blah. And don't get me started on suggestions that we have a 3rd world transport system in the UK. Total and utter garbage.

Rant over as I could go on forever. If any HP dared use the words Third World to me in any statement regarding any aspect of my child's upbringing then they'd get both barrels as I could give them examples of what really goes on in some areas that would make their hair stand on end.

Surely the only point of the statement is to point out that a poor diet, tiredness etc arent reasons that would stop someone who wanted to bf to bf!
It's not making a big political/social statement. It's simply meant to reassure people that the quality and quantity of milk is fine because in part of the world where poor diet is common people are still physically able to bf.

It's not saying all people in developing countries are starving, poor, malnourished etc or that the way things are done there is better or worse then in a developed country.

I find this all very interesting and have obviously woken up in the same pedantic mood as GeorginaA. Em, who says that the diet in the Third World is poor? We in the West? For some it is. In some areas not. And I'm not talking about the extremes here as in famine. Isn't that just another assumption? Poor in relation to what, the Western diet? And here was me thinking that the Western diet was too much processed food, salt, sugar, fat, not enough fruit and veg, over-reliance on dairy.

If I think back to where I used to live, then the local diet was probably very healthy. Fruit and veg in season, grains and seeds, limited meat, no dairy, home-made unlevened bread. Just right for producing breastmilk?

My pedantry obviously prevents me from being articulate. Just trying to offer my personal experiences which I wouldn't want to extrapolate to a whole continent. So if it comes across as such, apologies. I am quite well aware that malnouishment is rife in Africa.

A bit offpost so sorry, but I was interested in what you said about wetnursing Portree. I have a theory for which I have no info at all - one reason that so many of us (I mean me) end up bottlefeeding here is that we don't share the feeding with other women in our community. Reading Spiritual Midwifery (Ina May Gaskin) I notice that on The Farm they managed 100% breastfeeding by having other women feed babies when necessary. In particular, if we were all producing babies throughout our childbearing lives (which God forbid) then our mothers/grandmothers would still be lactating when we started giving birth and would be able to share feeding with us.

I have no desire at all to be in this situation but I found it comforting to think that this is part of the reason why we in this age seem to struggle more with feeding than must have been the case in the past - our only option is to do it ourselves.

Have sometimes thought about posting/advertising for other mothers to share feeding if I have another bub. Wonder what the response would be?

Yes, probably true re the horror - would make a good story tho - 'and then my HV suggested wetnursing - silly cow' - yells all round, including from me... Ah well.

I've fed someone elses baby, her dd was amonth older than my ds and her dd was mixed fed.
It was unusual circumstances though, the mum concerned was hit crossing a road and ended up in intesive care for 17 days. I was only looking after her dd for ten minutes, I had no bottles, formula or anything and was broke, she could not tell me what one to buy, so I did what I thought was best and fed her dd
She was thrilled when she came to a few days later!!
I was pretty knackered though feeding two 6 + & mth old babies, both of which woke in the night!

WOW Piffle... I think you're my hero

I'm not sure how does that work but there are "milk banks" in some so called "third world countries" where mothers who produce milk donate it so children of mothers who can't breastfeed can have it (sadly in many cases the good will comes out of a death).

And probably those midwives who say that all woman in third world countries can breastfeed may be surprised to hear that where the economical circumstances permit it, many of them choose not to. In many cases children are reared with cow's or goat's milk/rice water from the early months. Of course, as third world countries are all those out of Europe, USA and the Commonwealth, the variations of poverty within them(and their attitudes towards breastfeeding) are huge.