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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

OPINIONS PLEASE: 3 days old and m/w advising to top up as milk not in yet

30 replies

liquidclocks · 24/04/2007 09:19

My friend has just had a baby girl. She's keen to give BF a good chance and I'm just a bit concerned about this advice she's had. My policy on advice to friends is generally wait until asked but should I say something here?

The slight complicating factor is that my friend has ME and the reason they gave a top up was so she could have a rest - she had a long labour and assisted delivery. Baby was feedin every 20mins or so.

Her milk was not in when I spoke to her DH last night but I expect it will be soon.

Most of you know more about BF than me so thoughts would be welcome! I'm afraid this is a bit of 'post and run' as I'm going out now but will be back later for replies.

TIA

OP posts:
hunkermunker · 24/04/2007 09:22

She doesn't need topping up if the baby is feeding well - colostrum is fine until her milk comes in.

Fucking midwife - what does she think happened before fucking formula was fucking invented - what a twat!

Psychobabble · 24/04/2007 09:23

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

fishie · 24/04/2007 09:25

ds didn't latch on till day five. he is alive and well (and two today!)

edam · 24/04/2007 09:27

Colostrum is designed to be baby's first food. Her body will make milk when baby is ready - it's simple biology! Can understand midwife wanting your friend to rest, though, with ME, but personally don't think formula is the way to go at this stage given your friend is keen to b/f.

Snaf · 24/04/2007 09:27

What hunker said - without the appalling obscenities obviously

Someone needs to explain to me how giving formula = rest. Because I don't get it.

She does need to rest, certainly, but how about the mw suggests she rests in her bed with her baby and feeds whenever, rather than running around sterilising and mixing up feeds? Duh.

Milk will be in soon enough. Until then, colostrum is absolutely fine and dandy.

Pruni · 24/04/2007 09:27

Message withdrawn

Original poster
liquidclocks · 24/04/2007 09:27

Go on Hunker - say it how it is!

So far as I thought - out now but thanks and will check later

OP posts:
Original poster
liquidclocks · 24/04/2007 09:30

Pruni - no jaundice that I'm aware of. Baby was just short of 10lbs though.

OP posts:
hunkermunker · 24/04/2007 09:31

What can I say, Snaf - breastfeeding brings out the potty mouth in me

hunkermunker · 24/04/2007 09:34

Ah, I wonder if she'll be getting the "you'll never breastfeed a baby that big" message very soon?

A dim statement which neglects the fact that the woman clearly managed to nourish a baby to that size in utero without help from "Artificial Placenta TM".

Gah.

Undermining twats.

Sorry, am on a bit of a rant re stupidity - I saw the leptin in infant milk news item yesterday and heard a broadcaster I generally respect and have a lot of time for saying how disgusting it was seeing women breastfeed and they should do it under a blanket it's made me wonder what on earth the point is when the country seems so bloody anti-breastfeeding.

tiktok · 24/04/2007 09:35

Oh dear....this is such poor advice, I do wonder if there is something else going on. Not that it is all that unusual for new mothers to get poor advice....

If all a mum is doing is lying in bed cuddling/feeding the baby, and someone else is doing everything else, inc. supporting her and encouraging her, how would giving a top up give her more rest??

In situations like this, I sometimes wonder if the parents give a top up because they think the baby needs it, and they tell the midwife who sort of affirms they were right to do so (rather than criticise) and that translates as the midwife's advice.

Snaf · 24/04/2007 09:40

Who said that, munker?

hunkermunker · 24/04/2007 09:44

I'm waiting for a reply to the email I sent him - I'll out him if he's unrepentant.

Rosylily · 24/04/2007 09:47

Maybe the mw doesn't think she will be able to bf with M.E. Breast feeding is very demanding physically, I find...though also very rewarding.
I've just had a baby and he got scrawnier and scrawnier waiting for my milk to come and the woman in the bed across from me was ffeeding and her baby was getting fatter and fatter.
This was my fourth so I didn't waver but many people would need to be reassured that the colostrum is enough. (And since then he's been putting on a lb a week with bf [proud of self])

Snaf · 24/04/2007 09:50

Absolutely right, rosylily - but it's the mw's job to give her that reassurance that colostrum will be enough, not to advise formula at the earliest opportunity. It's so undermining to a woman's confidence. Good on you, btw

GreebosWhiskers · 24/04/2007 10:06

Ummm I'm gonna get jumped all over here but still . . .
When ds was born in Nov the placenta wouldn't come away. I was encouraged to put him to the breast to see if that would make it separate but it didn't. After an hour I'd lost 2.5 LITRES of blood & my womb was contracting non-stop trying to get rid of the bloody thing. I got rushed off to theatre (delirious & actually praying to die so the pain would stop) where I was knocled out so some poor person could stick their hand in & yank it out.

Back in the ward I was on an IV getting 6 units of blood. I was in no state to bf so his first real feed was 30ml of Aptamil from a bottle. He was born at 8:30am & by mid-afternoon I was able to bf him lying down (dh & the mw weren't keen but I insisted). Next day he was on the breast constantly (I mean ALL day) & if I laid him down even to go to the loo he screamed blue murder. That night I was exhausted & I agreed to the mw giving him 2 25ml top-up feeds from a baby beak so I could get some sleep. I'm glad I did as next morning I was able to bf him again & he was happily settling between feeds.

I know if I hadn't let him have the formula I would have eventually given up on bf as the above is a carbon copy of what happened with his big sis (apart from the haemhorrage - with dd I had a stroke instead) but I persevered with BF dd 'til she was so dehydrated & ill that the docs were really worried for her & I made the decision to switch straight to formula as I felt that I'd put her thro' enough. I hated ff so much & felt like such a failure that I wound up with PND.

Sorry this is long (and prob incoherent) but I just think that in some situations a formula top-up may be justified.

BTW ds is almost 6 months old & now weaning but still gets his drinkies from mummy's boobies

GreebosWhiskers · 24/04/2007 10:08

A pound a week Rosylily? Good on you

tiktok · 24/04/2007 10:17

Greebos, nobody is saying that in some situations formula is not justified....in your case, your individual circumstances were such that anyone would understand the need, and even if they didn't understand, it's none of their biz

It makes me bewildered when people talk of desperate situations, and then assume, like you, that people will 'jump' on them, or that they need to don a hard hat, because they used formula! People here (on mumsnet) are not judgemental about the use of formula and do not query individual decisions or individual priorities the way you seem to think they do (this is speaking generally - I know there may be a tiny handful of posts in 8 years or whatever that are not like that).

You had a really bad time, and you turned it round to be a good time - why would anyone 'jump' on you??

wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 24/04/2007 10:19

I have to say I agree with gw, it's really not all black and white all of the time.

ME can be incredibly debilitating, I have a friend with it and she sometimes can't even get out of bed in the morning and will stay there for days and she doesn't have a baby, so I can only imagine that post birth it must be 10 times worse. also if I'm not mistaken being that exhausted can affect your milk supply so if she's not getting any rest at all this could be detrimental to her milk even coming in at all.

wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 24/04/2007 10:24

tiktok I do agree that most on here are sympathetic to individual cases and that posters don't habitually get jumped on for admitting to giving their babies formula, but i do also think that if a friend of gw's had posted on here saying she'd had a hemerage and mw was wanting to top up the baby, the majority of posters would be saying that she shouldn't do it and that the mw was out of order for suggesting it.

hunkermunker · 24/04/2007 10:42

Snaf, I've had an email and he's repentant and has taken on board my comments for the future, so I'll not name and shame. I've emailed him back with some ideas of things he might like to discuss supportively such as the right to bf without harassment law they have in Scotland, but not in England

tiktok · 24/04/2007 10:56

wanna - fortunately exhaustion does not appear to affect milk supply (I said 'appear' because individual people may feel their own experience is different).

Someone recovering from haemorhage might well be in a position where breastfeeding the baby is just not on the agenda for the moment - I don't think people on here would dispute that. On the other hand, it does not necessarily rule it out. It's up to individual circumstances.

Rosylily · 24/04/2007 11:35

Greebos sounds like you've done fantastically for all your children. My sister had pnd and was totally screwed up with guilt about 'not breastfeeding properly' as she put it. I think ok breast feeding is good for baby but a well and happy mummy is also important for the baby. And ff isn't bad stuff.

Some women need reassurance and know how to manage bfeeding but some women need to be reassured that not bfeeding isn't the end of the world.
Maybe it is sometimes hard for a mw to aim it correctly.
M.E is a horrible illness, I have a friend with it.
I am wishing that while my baby puts on a pound a week, I would lose a pound a week Not working so far!

GreebosWhiskers · 24/04/2007 14:29

rosylily & wanna - thanks for your comments

tiktok - i didn't mean the hard hat bit to annoy anyone - it was supposed to be tongue in cheek lol. sorry

sorry no caps btw - the wee man's having a snack & i'm not much good one-handed

charliegal · 24/04/2007 15:24

Oh I got that advice last November from the hospital to give my baby a top up as my milk hadn't come in on day 4 and I thought he was crying out of hunger
Even though I did manage to establish bfing and am still doing and intend to carry on until..whenever..I still feel when I think about it. My dp wishes I would let it go as I have the occasion rant and sad moment about the unnecessary top up.